a Good Refugee Podcast

About a Good Refugee Podcast

A Good Refugee Podcast is your source for news, opinions and questions from troubled (Tibetan) minds. agoodrefugee.substack.com (https://agoodrefugee.substack.com?utm_medium=podcast)

Publisher

Gelek Badheytsang

Category

comedy · news

Language

en

Explicit

No

First episode

31 Oct 2020

Latest episode

4 Oct 2022

Latest episodes

18 episodes in the feed.

1. 

   4 Oct 2022

   Toronto municipal elxn 2022 with Chemi Lhamo (45 mins)

   On Oct 24, 2022, residents across Toronto will cast their ballots to select their councillors and mayor. We caught up with Chemi Lhamo, a proud Tibetan refugee and Parkdalian, on why she decided to run as a candidate for Parkdale–High Park, what she hopes to change in city hall, and how she plans on achieving that. The conversation was recorded on August 17, 2022. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit agoodrefugee.substack.com (https://agoodrefugee.substack.com?utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=CTA_1)

2. 

   11 Apr 2021

   A long and meandering ride to anarchy and liberation - Arya Namdol (104 mins)

   Happy Sunday! Excited to share this long, sometimes heavy, mostly rambunctious conversation recorded last week (April 4). Gelek speaks with cyclist, entrepreneur and activist Arya Namdol about her early life in India and America (07:00); anti Asian racism (22:25); being an anarchist (36:06); what cycling means to her (47:00); creating BIPOC spaces and voices in cycling (56:16); plus tips on biking, memorable rides, etc. (89:25). Bio Arya Namdol is a first generation Tibetan settler on Turtle Island currently tending space in Machimoodus historically tended by the Wangunk people. The colonizers call this land East Haddam, Connecticut. She is a proprietor of RonsBikes.com (https://ronsbikes.com/) and is a founder of WTF BX, now called RAR (https://radicaladventureriders.com/). Arya recognizes the bicycle as a vehicle for inner and outer peace, and works toward expanding what it means to be a cyclist in today's world. She loves decolonial frameworks, buddhism (with a lower case b), and wants to give deep thanks to the friends, family and peers who give her the courage to be courageous. Instagram (https://www.instagram.com/goodolearya/) Episode notes * Arya intro, Machik talk, checking in with friends and relations lately. [01:10] * Early life in India and America: environmental justice work, activism, burnout. [07:00] * First bike, political formation, pushing leftist Tibetan discourse, Dalai Lama identifying as a Marxist (https://hhdl.dharmakara.net/hhdlquotes1.html), etc. [13:30] * Anti-Asian racism, reconciling identities (Tibetan and Asian) and values that aren’t always in sync with Stop Asian Hate. [22:25] * Responding vs reacting to traumas and oppressions (Highlander Center (https://highlandercenter.org/)). [30:20] * An anarchist response to COVID, collectivism and community. [36:06] * Cycling as a lifestyle, a solace and a part of Asian identity. [47:00] * Creating bike packs and starting ronsbikes.com (https://ronsbikes.com/). [52:20] * Creating BIPOC spaces and confronting racism, anti-oppression in the cycling world, forming Radical Adventure Riders (https://radicaladventureriders.com/). [56:16] * Riding solo in America and around the world, full moon rides, avoiding wildlife and training courtesy of special Tibetan genes. [66:47] * Putting together a BIPOC team for the Great Divide Mountain Bike Route (https://bikepacking.com/routes/great-divide-mountain-bike-route-gdmbr/),  [81:40] * Craziest bike, tips for new cyclists, nastiest fall, most memorable ride, bike recommendations, Lance Armstrong being an ass. [89:25] Recommended reading Braiding Sweetgrass - Robin Wall Kimmerer (https://bookshop.org/books/braiding-sweetgrass/9781571313560) A People’s History of the United States - Howard Zinn (https://www.zinnedproject.org/materials/peoples-history-of-the-united-states) The Conquest of Bread - Peter Kropotkin (https://bookshop.org/books/the-conquest-of-bread/9780983061588) Humankind: A Hopeful History - Rutger Bregman (https://bookshop.org/books/humankind-a-hopeful-history/9780316418539) Asia's Unknown Uprisings Volume 1 (https://www.pmpress.org/index.php?l=product_detail&p=375) & Volume 2 (https://www.pmpress.org/index.php?l=product_detail&p=413) The Black Foxes (https://www.theblackfoxes.com/) (all Black cycling team) Cycling Industry Pledge (https://www.bicycleretailer.com/industry-news/2021/04/05/cycling-industry-pledge-seeking-expand-company-membership#.YGs73elKjVo) This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit agoodrefugee.substack.com (https://agoodrefugee.substack.com?utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=CTA_1)

3. 

   20 Mar 2021

   The Atlanta shooting: reckoning with anti-Asian, anti-sex worker misogyny - Jane Shi (60 mins)

   On March 16, 2021, a gunman opened fired at three different massage parlors in the metropolitan area of Atlanta, Georgia. In less than three hours, 21-year-old Robert Aaron Long shot and killed eight people, six of whom were Asian women. Their names are: Soon Chung Park 박순정 (74 years old)Hyun Jung Grant [김]현정 (51)Sun Cha Kim 김순자 (69)Yong Ae Yue 유용애 (63)Delaina Ashley Yaun (33)Paul Andre Michels (54)Xiaojie Tan 谭小洁 (49)Daoyou Feng 冯道友 (44) Jane Shi and I had scheduled our March 17 interview weeks ago. We deliberated over whether we should go ahead, in light of the previous day’s event, and ultimately decided to talk about it. Jane and I discuss the March 16 Atlanta shooting (02:20); how class, citizenship, and the justice system interact in anti-Asian and sex worker violence (10:15); how people can meaningfully engage in the migrant sex worker issue (28:15); Canada’s Bill C-7 (30:27); Jane’s personal and political formation (38:00); and some of her other work and advocacy. Please note that Jane works as an outreach worker for SWAN Vancouver (https://www.swanvancouver.ca/), an organization that supports and advocates for migrant women engaged in indoor sex work. However, for this interview, she is solely speaking on behalf of herself, and not her organization. Bio Jane Shi is a writer, poet, editor, community organizer, filmmaker, and dumpling-maker. These disciplinary hats converge in a lifelong interest in cultural reclamation, survivorship, and healing intergenerational trauma. She is a graduate of The Writer's Studio program at Simon Fraser University, and an alumni of English Honours and Asian Canadian and Asian Migration studies at the University of British Columbia. She is currently a submissions editor at Room (https://roommagazine.com/). Her latest endeavour is infodumpling (https://gumroad.com/l/ICxXo?), a recipe zine that raises funds for #LandBack initiatives and Black reparation funds. Support her on Patreon (https://www.patreon.com/pipagaopoetry). janeshi.org (https://www.janeshi.org/) Twitter (https://twitter.com/pipagaopoetry) Instagram (https://www.instagram.com/pipagaopoetry/) Episode notes * How Jane is feeling right now. [02:20] * Reciting the names of the victims that were released at that point. [04:52] * How people in Jane’s network are responding to the attack; prevailing sentiments, flattening of incident into anti Asian racism. [05:36] * How class, citizenship, and the justice system interact in violence against sex workers; Yang Song’s death (https://theappeal.org/family-former-attorney-of-queens-woman-who-fell-to-her-death-in-vice-sting-say-she-was-sexually-d67461a12f1/); who gets humanized after a mass murder. [10:15] * Is there a connection between the Atlanta shooting and the constant vilification and/or criticism of China? [15:25] * Differences in migrant sex work situation and anti-Asian racism between Canada and the U.S. [18:20] * How the attacks have shifted Jane’s approach and work going forward. [24:00] * How people can meaningfully engage in the migrant sex worker issue: FOSTA-SESTA (https://whyy.org/segments/fosta-sesta-was-supposed-to-thwart-sex-trafficking-instead-its-sparked-a-movement/), decriminalize sex work, donate to Swan Vancouver (https://www.swanvancouver.ca/), Red Canary Song (https://www.redcanarysong.net/), Butterfly Toronto (https://www.butterflysw.org/). [28:15] * Bill C-7 (MAID). [30:27] * Jane’s early life, so far; decline of Shanghainese, different dialects. [38:00] * How Jane’s political worldviews formed: UBC, WAVAW (https://www.wavaw.ca/); TMX Pipeline protest, land defender Stacy Gallagher sentencing (https://www.vice.com/en/article/dy8qek/indigenous-land-defender-gets-jail-time-after-performing-ceremony-near-trans-mountain-site). [43:00] * Questions from Jane to GRP: how Tibetan and Chinese diasporas can work together, how this podcast started. [49:00] * Closing: Twitter voices, online accessibility (https://twitter.com/GelekB/status/1371199288932454416). [55:30] This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit agoodrefugee.substack.com (https://agoodrefugee.substack.com?utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=CTA_1)

4. 

   16 Mar 2021

   Advocating for better housing, cannabis, and BBQ joints with Caryma Sa’d (66 mins)

   This episode was recorded on March 8, 2021. I spoke with Caryma S’ad about her career as a lawyer and how she got into the legal field (05:25); her beef against BBQAnon guy Adam Skelly (19:00); her thoughts on cannabis law in Canada and how it intersects with the current discourse on police abolition (40:00); the housing situation in Toronto (58:25); and more. Bio Caryma S’ad is a Toronto-based lawyer and entrepreneur. Her advocacy focuses primarily on housing, cannabis, and criminal law. She is also active on issues relating to politics, access to justice, poverty, racism, and the legal profession. She is the executive director at NORML Canada (https://www.normlcanada.org/), a federal not-for-profit group that lobbies for fair, equitable, and sensible cannabis law and policy. Caryma graduated cum laude from the University of Ottawa in 2015. She was called to the Bar in 2016. Prior to attending law school, Caryma interned with a prominent human rights organization in India. In her spare time, Caryma likes to watch professional wrestling. carymarules.com (https://www.carymarules.com/) Twitter (https://twitter.com/CarymaRules) LinkedIn (https://www.linkedin.com/in/caryma-sad/) Instagram (https://www.instagram.com/carymasad/) Episode notes * How Caryma developed her unique and creative engagement style. [03:30] * Overview of Caryma’s practice, how she got into law, and how the legal world has shifted since she got called to the Bar (2016). [05:25] * The Stop SOP ordeal at the Law Society of Ontario. [14:00] * Caryma vs Adam Skelly aka BBQanon guy (https://nowtoronto.com/news/how-did-adamson-barbecue-guy-become-a-martyr-for-anti-lockdown-crowd). [19:00] * Being on the wrong side of cancel culture: Caryma’s open air comedy show 2020. [26:05] * Documenting the weekly anti-mask rallies in Toronto (https://twitter.com/CarymaRules/status/1350507978278006786). [30:00] * Caryma’s thoughts on prison and police abolition. [40:00] * Ontario cannabis rollout, decriminalizing pot offences, Julian Fantino (https://www.cbc.ca/radio/asithappens/as-it-happens-wednesday-edition-1.4403187/julian-fantino-who-once-compared-weed-to-murder-defends-opening-medical-marijuana-business-1.4403194), NORML Canada (https://www.normlcanada.org/). [43:00] * Park encampment and the housing situation in Toronto, Encampment Support Network (https://www.encampmentsupportnetwork.com/), Khaleel Seivwright (https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/toronto-carpenter-khaleel-seivwright-response-city-application-injunction-1.5923854). [58:25] This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit agoodrefugee.substack.com (https://agoodrefugee.substack.com?utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=CTA_1)

5. 

   11 Mar 2021

   East Turkestan: from frontier to prison state - Mehmet Tohti and Ben Mauk (79 mins)

   This episode was recorded on March 4, 2021. Gelek and Tsering speak with Mehmet Tohti and Ben Mauk about the situation in East Turkestan, aka Xinjiang. They speak about Ben’s New Yorker article, Inside Xinjiang’s Prison State (https://www.newyorker.com/news/a-reporter-at-large/china-xinjiang-prison-state-uighur-detention-camps-prisoner-testimony) (10:00), learn about the current situation there from Mehmet (18:10), the parallels of War on Terror between China and America (34:00), Adrian Zenz and the matter of one million Uyghurs detained (41:00), how people are staying connected within East Turkestan (58:00), and more. On February 22, Canada’s House of Commons passed a motion (https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/uighur-genocide-motion-vote-1.5922711) declaring China's treatment of its Uyghur and other Turkic minority populations as genocide. This was followed later in the week by the Dutch parliament passing a similar, non-binding motion (https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2021/2/26/dutch-parliament-says-chinas-treatment-of-uighurs-is-genocide). Canada and the Netherlands join the United States (https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-55723522) as three democratic countries that have now accused China of genocide vis-a-vis East Turkestan. Bios Mehmet Tohti is a prominent Uyghur Canadian activist, campaigning for the rights of Uyghurs over a decade. He is a co-founder of the World Uyghur Congress and has twice served as vice-president. He is executive director of the Uyghur Rights Advocacy Project (https://www.urap.ca/), based in Ottawa. Twitter (https://twitter.com/MehmetTohti) Ben Mauk is a journalist and writer based in Berlin. He has written for The New York Times Magazine, The New Yorker, Harper's, and the London Review of Books, among other publications. He is writing a book for Farrar, Straus and Giroux (https://us.macmillan.com/fsg). He co-founded and directs the Berlin Writers' Workshop (http://www.berlinwritersworkshop.com) and is a contributing editor at The Ballot (https://www.theballot.world). He has taught English literature and writing at the University of Iowa. He is part of the mentorship collective PERIPLUS (https://docs.google.com/document/d/1uIADsfzaB3SWK-mp_kIuXGOPtjgn0JqGywscbbcZkX8/edit). ben-mauk.com (https://www.ben-mauk.com/) Twitter (https://twitter.com/benmauk) Ben’s New Yorker article, Inside Xinjiang’s Prison State (https://www.newyorker.com/news/a-reporter-at-large/china-xinjiang-prison-state-uighur-detention-camps-prisoner-testimony), was published on February 26. It’s a meticulously and delicately compiled chronicle of individuals who have experienced detainment, surveillance and the crackdowns in East Turkestan. In addition to text, the article also features illustrations, animations and sound. It's very immersive and poignant at points. I highly recommend you read it, if you haven’t. Episode notes * Ben Mauk: early career, settling in Berlin, medievalism, art heists. [02:40] * Overview of Ben’s article: “Inside Xinjiang’s Prison State (https://www.newyorker.com/news/a-reporter-at-large/china-xinjiang-prison-state-uighur-detention-camps-prisoner-testimony)” [10:00] * How Ben got connected with the people featured in the article [13:30] * Mehmet Tohti: situation update, Xinjiang vs. East Turkestan [18:10] * Modern history of repression in East Turkestan, including Sept 11, 2001, the two Michaels. [24:10] * The parallels of War on Terror, Islamophobia and state surveillance between China and America. [34:00] * Adrian Zenz and the matter of one million Uyghurs detained. [41:00] * Manufacturing a New Cold War against China? [48:55] * How people are staying connected within East Turkestan, Truth and Reconciliation Clubhouse (https://supchina.com/2021/03/03/truth-and-reconciliation-excerpts-from-the-xinjiang-clubhouse/). [58:00] * Babymaking Uyghur machines. [64:10] * How Canadians can help in Uyghur campaigns. [65:50] * Ben’s article and short film: how it came about, the collaborative process, etc. [69:00] * Article feedback. [74:30] * Erbaqyt Otarbai singing. [79:05] This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit agoodrefugee.substack.com (https://agoodrefugee.substack.com?utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=CTA_1)

6. 

   27 Feb 2021

   Black, queer liberation & Tibetan Buddhism: Lama Rod Owens - part 2 (29 mins)

   Hello. Hope February has been treating you well. In the second and concluding part of Gelek’s conversation with Lama Row Owens, they speak about the loss of magic and exploring Indigeneity (01:25); holding space for anger and violence in creating justice and peace (09:05); the weaponization of niceness (20:55); bodies, movement and breathing in the time of a pandemic (22:40); and more. If you missed part one of the conversation, click here (https://agoodrefugee.substack.com/p/black-queer-liberation-and-tibetan). Episode notes * Loss of magic and exploring Indigeneity. [01:25] * Loving our anger. [03:56] * What Black History Month means to Lama Rod. [06:15] * Holding space for anger and violence in creating justice and peace. [09:05] * Discussing police, prison abolition, political systems and institutions in dharma teachings. [15:29] * Weaponization of niceness. [20:55] * Bodies, movement and breathing in the time of a pandemic. [22:40] * Lama Rod’s current and upcoming projects. [26:30] Interview transcript You have a chapter towards the end of [Love and Rage] where you speak about the loss of magic. Yeah, that’s part of my Indigenous work right now. This is work that I hope to present in the next couple of years—me connecting more to my African as well as Native American ancestry, and putting all of that in conversation with Tibetan Buddhism. For me, again, it’s a synthesis of what’s being created. I think “Love and Rage” was a good beginning step to demonstrate how I am transitioning into this space. As an American Black person, my Indigenous spiritual practice is hoodoo. Hoodoo derives from the practice of Africans coming on to the West, meeting Christianity, and developing the system of philosophy, ritual magic and so forth. It’s so related to tantra and Vajrayana in Tibetan Buddhism. I wanna understand how I can synthesize that even more so that it’s more authentic for me. I remember years ago, Rinpoche [Norlha] was talking about the magic of Native Americans. He was saying, “Native Americans were so strong that they survived genocide.” It really struck me when he said that. For me, that was just the way he recognized the validity of this community of people. He respected Native American gods and spirits. When Kundun [HHDL] makes his trip to North America, he always makes it a point to also have representatives or emissaries from the local First Nations or the Native communities to meet with them and speak with them. I always find it beautiful how there are these patterns of elemental rituals that’s consistent across hemispheres, cultures and Indigenous communities. I am reminded of, for instance, the whole myth or idea of how Buddhism was propagated by Padmasambhava [in Tibet], and him having to clash with nagas and deities. It’s very fascinating to actually look into those things, and I’m really excited for this project that you are undertaking. The title of the book itself, I was curious about that. When you placed “Love and Rage” in that order, was that intentional? Yeah absolutely. The title came first before the content. Like not “Rage and Love,” but “Love and Rage.” Was that intentional? Yes, because love holds the rage. Love leads. So, when I talk about this conversation between love and rage, it’s not a fight. It’s more about how love is holding the space for our rage to be there. Love is the container that holds everything. If there is no container of love then that rage actually becomes an expression of violence. “My anger is like a living being I am in partnership with.” And then a couple of pages later you say, “Loving our anger invites it into a transformative space where it emerges as the teacher.” That’s so profound. I wonder if you can expand on that a little bit. That’s rooted within the teachings around the manifestation of the guru. How the guru is manifesting in the phenomenal world. One of those manifestations of the guru is through emotions. Once we pay attention to the emotion, the emotion is actually trying to teach us how to be in relationship with it. For so much of our lives, we tend to be overreacting and running away from our emotional reality. But to turn our attention back to something like anger, we begin to hold space for it and to experience it, that experience begins to teach us about the nature of emotion. And of course the nature of emotion is the nature of the mind itself. Once we realize that, the guru emerges in that moment. You’re saying anger can be a vessel that helps take us to the ultimate reality. Well, anything can take us to the ultimate. The nature of the whole phenomenal world is of one essence. So if we recognize the nature of that phenomena—an emotion, an object, an idea, whatever it is—it unlocks the nature of all phenomena, and that opens us right into the ultimate. Does Black History Month hold significance for you? That’s a good question. It doesn’t hold significance for me because I feel like I’m always celebrating my history and culture. It’s not relegated to one month—the shortest month of the year, by the way. I just think that we have to establish a culture where we’re celebrating all the parts of our history; all the different groups and communities that have helped shape the world. We should have knowledge and an appreciation of that. And yes, I understand that there are histories that have been so silenced that we have to create and designate these periods of time to bring attention to it. But I really want to take it to a point where we don’t need to have a special time to think about these things. That it just happens naturally. That we think about Black folks, Asian American communities, queer history, Native American history… where we just know that. And we don’t. There’s so much history that has been erased. This is different from how some people then take that other approach where they say, “I don’t see race. I’m colour blind.” You’re not saying that at all. You actually have a passage—I can’t find it right now—in your book where you affirm and celebrate the different histories, traditions, lineages that we embody. Yeah, I see differences. I love that. Again, it goes back to the teachings of the mind. I can hold space for everything and notice everything. And I can look at the ways in which I have fixations on certain things. I can examine that. That fixation may also mean prejudice. It may mean resistance to certain things. I can look at that and hold space for it and allow it to be this immense amount of openness. We can hold all the difference in the world but the problem is our relationship to that difference. Is that relationship one of opening and acceptance or is it one of restricting and defining and pushing away? And asserting power. And asserting power, absolutely. Because we’re fixated on our sense of self and ego, right? But there has to be space for it too. Spaciousness is another theme that’s quite prevalent in your book. Early on in your book, you say (in speaking of anger): “In activist communities, our relationship to anger is immature, ill-informed and overly romanticized. We manipulate anger as a false sense of energy and inspiration.” The first image that came to my mind when I read that line is the burning of the 3rd Precinct building of the Minneapolis police department shortly after the killing of George Floyd. For me that was such a powerful, revolutionary emanation of what activism means but also what taking back justice means. Do you think your line and that image are in contradiction? I think that one of the things—and this is a really subtle, nuanced argument—that I’m always trying to push for, particularly with activists, is knowing what you’re doing, and not just reacting. If you’re gonna burn a building down, know that you’re burning it and know that you’re doing this in order to hopefully trigger freedom, liberation. Not just cause you’re pissed off. I know that’s a very nuanced thing. Our holding space for anger and reacting to anger may actually look like the same action. Often I’m trying to avoid violence, but at the same time, sometimes violence has to be expressed in order to reduce greater forms of violence. And so I’m not a 100 percent non-violent person. I think violence can be used skillfully to reduce other kinds of violence and harm. So we have to know what we’re doing and why we’re doing it. The use of violence has to be skillful. And of course people push back, but then I use this example of like, if you have a child and someone runs up and grabs your child, are you going to stand there? Are you gonna do whatever you can to get your child back in that moment? We all have the capacity to express violence. Every being on this planet has been violent in some capacity or another. What I’m arguing for is can we skillfully use that violence to reduce other forms of violence when we need to. Dr. King said, “Riot is the language of the unheard.” I think that’s important for us. And then, when something needs to be destroyed, can we critically say, OK we’re going to do this? Not out of hate and anger, but out of this need to be heard; to disrupt certain systems that are increasing harm and violence for others. This is perhaps my own Tibetan neurosis surfacing where I feel like non-violence tends to get weaponized, funnily enough, in how we are meant to come to terms with our traumatization and our oppression. It also operates through respectability politics, where the idea is that if you conduct yourself civilly or in a way that’s appropriate, that somehow it elevates your dissent over others. I think it’s very timely or relevant that you quote Dr. King because I’m reminded of his quote where he says, “True peace is not merely the absence of tension. It is the presence of justice.” That piece, again, gets easily paved over when those in power talk about non-violence or of being peaceful but miss the whole context of justice. And I think that in itself is actually a form of violence. I totally agree. I think in the west, the teachings of non-violence have been so over emphasized because it comes through a culture of dominance. You’re already at the top, you actually have the privilege of being peaceful and practising non-violence because you’re not fighting for basic resources. And that’s what I have to struggle with in white, western Buddhist convert communities. I have to be conscious of what it means to be Black, particularly a Black man in the south right now, because my life can be at any point in danger depending on where I’m at, who I’m talking with, etc. At no point do I not know that I’m Black, and can be killed because I’m Black. You say, “My anger is the single greatest threat to my life.” I think that’s a very skillful way to demonstrate that it’s not about you being Black that’s the greatest risk for you, but it’s actually anger. Well, it’s the anger and how my anger creates a mirror for dominant culture. I am angry because I’ve been hurt through systematic oppression. So I’m not angry just because I’m Black. That’s not an aesthetic of Blackness. It comes from systematic woundedness and oppression. It’s also a very convenient trope for those in power as well to then misconstrue that anger and say, oh just another typical Black person who’s angry. So you’re constantly having to navigate these very discombobulating experiences and then to comport in a way that makes you feel more agreeable. But that’s not actually true to how you experienced whatever you experienced. Exactly. And that kind of trope is just another way that we are raised, that lived oppression. “Oh you’re just complaining. You haven’t pulled yourself up by your own bootstraps.” This another mythology that white, American individualism has created that further disciplines us and marginalizes us. Do you try not to bring in present-day politics into your teachings or is that something you let is come and go as it arises? It’s so funny you mention that. [Norlha] Rinpoche was so political. He would talk about politics in public teachings all the time. Like American politics? Oh yeah. In my teaching, I’m much more interested in systems and institutions because I think those lie at the heart of politics in general. For me, particularly in America, it’s not about the two-party system and democracy. There are deeper issues that we actually have to begin to name for ourselves. That’s where I want the teachings to be. It’s not about who’s the president, it’s why they’re the president. What is the system that gives rise to certain people having power and others not? And we can use dharma to do that. Absolutely. Do you change your tack in any way when you speak about these issues in the context of a dharma teaching, depending on the audience, or do you keep it consistent? Yeah, it does depend on the audience. It depends on what country I’m in—that’s a huge thing. The age of folks—when I work with teenagers it’s a different energy as opposed to adults. Is it a BIPOC community? Is it mostly a white group? That all determines how I show up. But I think that mostly I show up in spaces where people are pretty much politically aligned with me. And that’s the trick here. We’re all excited about Trump being out of the White House, but let’s go deeper now. Let’s talk about what it means to be revolutionary and radical, instead of being centrist and liberal. Let’s talk about how dharma is actually pushing us more towards being revolutionary rather than being conservative. It’s about everyone getting free; everyone getting the resources that they need to be well and happy. It’s very socialist. That’s how I talk. That’s the dharma that I use. Let’s talk about what it means for the people that you don’t even like to be free to have the resources that they need. For me, just over the past couple of years, my awareness and understanding of things like prison and police abolition has been way higher than it used to be. And I think it would be so amazing if the dharma community cohered around that. I feel that prison abolition is an incredibly complex thing that challenges all kinds of different notions about what we mean when it comes to justice, reformation, rehabilitation and forgiveness. I don’t see a lot of that happening in my limited perspective of the dharma community and I’m really glad for people like yourself who are speaking on those things. Have you noticed a change in the tenor of those kinds of discourses? I think, for the most part, people are much more educated than they were in the past about mass incarceration, for defunding the police. Climate change, interestingly, is a really safe space for people to get progressive in. [laughs] That’s like very neutral. Greta Thunberg and the Dalai Lama! [laughs] Oh yeah. American Buddhist communities: environmentalism, yes! But you start talking about mass incarceration… Wealth redistribution… Oh my god. That’s when you run into it. Racial justice. It gets sticky because we’re not linking all this together. If you’re about justice for the environment then you have to be about justice for people and the most marginalized. This is why I love this kind of philosophy of liberation theology that we get from progressive Christinanity. God is on the side of the most oppressed. We have to bring some of that knowledge and language into dharma. We have to understand that oppression has to be something we disrupt for everyone. That is the calling. That’s the calling. Dharma is about the liberation of people, even when we’re the ones who are doing the oppressing—that dharma will actually have to deal with us. And again, we’re not interested in that. We’re not interested in being held accountable, hauled out, or any of that. Until that starts being a thing, it’s like we’re going to maintain this level of comfort. You have a piece in your book about niceness, where it’s just about making people feel comfortable but not progressing any further than that. Yeah, exactly. Somehow niceness is dharmic—that’s what we’re supposed to do—when the fact is it’s just weaponized. That’s the first thing I noticed when I started going to sanghas: everyone’s so nice. Then when you start talking about issues of inclusivity—cause I was the only person of colour in my early sanghas, period—people shut down. Then another kind of nice emerges where it’s like, “You don’t have to think about that, Rod. We’re not a racist sangha.” It’s like the movie “Get Out.” It’s like a Jedi mind trick where I literally had people actually turn the teachings around and say, “Rod, you’re too fixated on identity.” We’re all Africans is another one I’ve heard. Right. That sounds great. This is why I’ve survived all of that, I went through it, and now I’m in a different space where I need to commit to creating new communities where we’re not having these one-on-one, intro conversations about race. We need to start living and embodying inclusivity and radicalism in this moment, on this spot. How do we do that? It’s not about having the conversation; it’s about living it and doing it right now. The final piece I want to touch on is about embodiment: all the different ways that you’ve studied it, how you’ve related to your body and those of others as well, especially in the context of the pandemic that we’re currently situated in. How has your relationship to your body evolved? For me it’s like a deepening relationship to all the ways my body shows up. Even this past year I’ve noticed how when one aspect of my body is off, it impacts all my other bodies. When my subtle energy body is out of balance I’m physically and emotionally unwell. It’s hard for me to connect to others. Even with my physical body, being static and so stationary for a year I feel the impact of that. I also feel the impact of all the vicarious trauma physically. I know that particularly this year so much of my work is going to have to be about getting back into the body—even my yoga practice I haven’t been really doing. Moving and working energy through the body is going to be incredibly important for all of us. The body is necessary for us to process and metabolize trauma, and movement is a part of that. And also breathing, which is a key piece throughout your practice. I was thinking about how we’re in a pandemic of a disease that affects the lungs and I wonder if you had any thoughts on that. About people who may have contracted COVID, or know people who did, and how that affects the act of breathing, and can be an incredibly destabilizing thing. Breath, as you’ve enumerated many times in the book, is one of the foundational pieces on how we first process all the different energies, right? Yeah absolutely. Even in general, I think breath is really tricky for a lot of folks. I’ve had to over the years had to develop ways for people to re-approach the breath. Even now, looking at a pandemic that’s really affecting the lungs, one of the practices that I’ve been working with people is kind of like a tonglen practice—this taking and sending practice. As we’re breathing, imagining that we’re breathing on behalf of so many folks who can’t breathe. That’s gonna direct us deeper into the fear of all of this as well. We have to open our minds to the reality that people are dying because they can’t breathe, not just through the pandemic but through social oppression as well. Breath has been a part of how police have attacked Black folks. I can’t breathe, a slogan from a few years ago. Absolutely. All of that. Breath is important. Breath is life. We know that very intimately in the practice. Breath carries life force. So we just want to breathe and add this energy and I guess do emotional labour of acknowledging that we can breathe on behalf of so many people who are struggling to breathe. That way we stop taking our breath for granted. Thank you. Before we wrap up, can you please give us a quick rundown of the things you’re working on right now and looking ahead to? I have a bunch of different events coming up through February and through March. All of that information can be found on my website (https://www.lamarod.com/). I’ll be also developing some content for the Calm app (https://www.calm.com/) over the next few weeks so I’m excited about that. I’m being introduced to the Calm network so if people subscribe to Calm, please check that content out. Are you also working on a book? I am working on a book. I am kind of in the process of figuring out what area or topic I want to go with; I have a couple of different ideas. I will say that over the summer we will be introducing a brand new course on grief and using a lot of the practices from Tibetan Buddhism and some practices from my own Indigenous practices as well. Creating something that’s going to help people work through what I call the brokenheartedness of not just this past year but the grief of our lives in a way that hopefully will be really powerful and meaningful. We’ve lost so much ritual because of the lockdown just around grieving and mourning. I know that in many Black communities and churches, funerals are actually a social thing, with lots of spectacle and pomp. It’s also true in Tibetan communities. We actually have 49 days of people gathering in homes and chanting daily. All of that has not been in play, unless you are actively contravening lockdown measures. I think that also speaks to a very special kind of isolation, especially in the moment of when you’re losing someone. So thank you so much for putting that together. I think it’s extremely timely. Thank you. I appreciate this. — lamarod.com (https://www.lamarod.com/) Instagram (https://www.instagram.com/lamarodowens/) Twitter (https://twitter.com/LamaRod1) This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit agoodrefugee.substack.com (https://agoodrefugee.substack.com?utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=CTA_1)

7. 

   14 Feb 2021

   Black, queer liberation & Tibetan Buddhism: Lama Rod Owens - part 1 (43 mins)

   Losar Tashi Delek and Happy Lunar New Year! In this episode, a Good Refugee Podcast speaks with Buddhist teacher, activist and writer Lama Rod Owens on a wide spectrum of topics covering spirituality, silence and power (06:55); how class, race, wealth and justice intersect with Buddhism today (12:35); sexual abuse in dharma spaces (26:56); drawing boundaries between the teacher, student, sangha and social life (29:38); and mental health (40:00). This is part one of the conversation. Listen/read part two here (https://agoodrefugee.substack.com/p/black-queer-liberation-and-tibetan-848). The full transcript of this interview is posted below, lightly edited for clarity and flow. Bio Lama Rod Owens is a Buddhist minister, author, activist, yoga instructor and authorized Lama, or Buddhist teacher, in the Kagyu School of Tibetan Buddhism and is considered one of the leaders of his generation of Buddhist teachers. He holds a Master of Divinity degree in Buddhist Studies from Harvard Divinity School and is a co-author of Radical Dharma: Talking Race, Love and Liberation (https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/547708/radical-dharma-by-rev-angel-kyodo-williams-lama-rod-owens-and-jasmine-syedullah/), and Love and Rage: The Path of Liberation through Anger (https://anotherstory.ca/?q=h.title.links&parms[eisbn]=Dh7d12j5BrmJ5rBRr76s1A). Lama Rod will be hosting a seven-week online course and practice group based on his book “Love and Rage.” It starts on February 15. Sign up here (https://lama-rod.teachable.com/p/love-and-rage-online-course). lamarod.com (https://www.lamarod.com/) Instagram (https://www.instagram.com/lamarodowens/) Twitter (https://twitter.com/LamaRod1) Episode notes * Making sense of these times. [02:30] * How “Love and Rage” fits in this moment. [04:20] * Meditations on silence and power. [06:55] * The evolution of activism and dharma from when Lama Rod first began. [11:18] * How class, race, wealth and justice intersect with Buddhism today. [12:35] * Sexual abuse in dharma spaces. [26:56] * Drawing boundaries between the teacher, student, dharma and social life. [29:38] * Seeing the teacher as a mirror to your own wisdom. [32:58] * Understanding mental health from Buddhist, western and Indigenous perspectives. [40:00] Interview transcript Lama Rod thank you so much for joining us. Welcome. Tashi Delek! Thank you so much. Where are you speaking from? I am speaking from Atlanta, where I just relocated to. This is traditionally, historically the land of the Muskogee people and the Cherokee people. But I am originally from Rome, Georgia, so this is like returning home. And how are you doing at this moment? I’m ok. I’m a little tired, but for the most part, mentally I’m feeling clear, open and fluid which is really wonderful. Has it felt like lately there has been a much more ramped up conversation or discourse about existing and how to make sense of these times? Yes, oh absolutely. I think last year the beginning of quarantine and the pandemic really forced people to do intense discernment about exactly what they were doing in their lives. The beginning of the quarantine reminded me of my years in my three-year retreat where everything just kind of shut down and I was just really holding space in one place for an extended period of time. That kind of holding space for me always triggers this deep kind of contemplation and discernment about what my work is. Last year, I think a lot of folks just started waking up and realizing that they had to start making different decisions and choices about how they were living their lives. And of course, on top of that, the world continues. We continue to live within systems and institutions that are creating violence for a lot of different people. So we were having to negotiate racial injustice, economic injustice, climate instability [while] at the same time negotiating a pandemic. A lot of folks started waking up to the reality of these harmful systems. When you first started [Love and Rage], you wrote that there was this moment where you were giving a talk with your co-author of Radical Dharma [Rev. angel Kyodo williams], and there was this Black gentleman who spoke about anger, and that was kind of the genesis which started your writing of Love and Rage. When was this around? 2017. Before that I was really avoiding writing a book on anger. I wasn’t really interested. But at that event, where this young Black man was just like, “What do I do with anger? How do I choose happiness?” I really realized that this would be an important teaching to offer. When you locate yourself back to that time in 2017 and how things just unfolded from that point on—understanding of course that so many of the injustices and violent things that we’ve witnessed and experienced have already been happening for many decades—and then this year has been such a collision of all those injustices. And then of course we have the pandemic. As I was reading through the book now, so many of those things were almost prophetic in some ways. Was that a realization that you had to also reckon with? I will say this: my experience as I was writing that book was an experience of feeling as if I—it’s hard to articulate. I guess what I’m trying to say is, I felt like I wasn’t talking about what was happening in the moment of writing the book. And this is why I didn’t really think the book was that interesting. When I wrote it, I was like who’s gonna actually resonate with this because I don’t think it’s actually talking about anything that’s happening now. On top of that, the book was supposed to be out much earlier than last summer [2020]. It was supposed to be out the fall of 2019 and I couldn’t meet the deadlines for getting the drafts in. I kept missing all these deadlines. Classic writer’s dilemma. Exactly. Finally, my publisher was like, you have to get it in at this date or we have to push it back like a year. And so I made that deadline and when the book finally was published a year later, then it kind of landed within this current… well, apocalypse. June 2020. Yeah, I had no idea. Absolutely no idea that 2020 was gonna be the way that it was. Silence, which I know has been an important piece in your practice, is a recurring theme in the book. It also coheres with how many of us have lived in isolation throughout this pandemic. Is that something you’ve meditated on length and spoken to others about? Yeah absolutely. For me, quarantine was something that I knew how to do because of retreat. And quarantine was something the majority of folks didn’t know anything about so I just felt like I was coming home to an old practice. For me, silence is also about stillness. A lot of folks didn’t have the privilege of being in the space that felt still and quiet. Many folks were kind of bound together in family units and other roommates and other kinds of living arrangements where it felt very crowded and intense and stressful. But even in that kind of stress and crowdedness there’s still this incredible way we can touch into this stillness within all that movement and constriction. So I’ve spent a lot of time meditating on silence itself and trying to understand what silence is. I’m really influenced by the work of Audre Lorde; she talks about silence and the transformation of language. For me what I began to understand is that silence helps me to understand language and all the different ways we communicate. If I may quote a passage from [Love and Rage], you say, “The transformation of silence into language is the migration from captivity into freedom or even the migration from invisibility into visibility. However, freedom and visibility come with the burden of confronting all those who don’t want you to be free or seen.” What I read from that, and understand from you, is you also wrestling with the complexity of silence and how that can also be weaponized on those who are oppressed into being silenced. Can you please expand on that? I think about another quote from Zora Neale Hurston who, among many things, also wrote “Their Eyes Were Watching God” and she has this quote where she says, and I paraphrase, if you don’t speak, they’ll kill you and say you enjoyed it. So that weaponization of silence is really about how silence is used to erase people and then to replace that erasure with a narrative that’s much more comfortable than the true reality of things. And so, I was doing two things: I was trying to figure out how to move into language as an act of liberation. And secondly, I was trying to figure out in my practice how to use silence to communicate as well. That’s where we talk about the weaponizing of silence. It’s like, yeah we silence people but in my practice I wanted to be empowered in both silence and language. I wanted agency to choose the best way to be in the moment. I think silence, when we’re conscious, intelligent and aware about it, can speak even louder than words or language. I think that’s a very keen insight, especially when you pair silence with power and the notion of agency as well. You cite specific examples in your book of how silence can just be another form of abuse. You also make it a point to mention your root guru Norlha Rinpoche and how all that episode played out. How even in those instances silence is another one of the ways that people not only perpetuate violence but also delusion. Was that a piece that was intentional for you when you speak of silence? Yeah absolutely. I think that also silence is something that when we get to a certain agency, we choose because that silence—in a really complicated, complex situation, particularly in the case with my teacher—was the best choice to make for me personally. Have you noticed changes both in the spaces of activism and the dharma communities from when you were first starting out? Have you noticed any tangible differences, just even in terms of discourse? I think one of the shifts that I’ve noticed is that there are more resources that tend to expand the discourse. More of us are writing and speaking out, which is actually deepening the subject matter of what we’re talking about. So I think this idea of justice and the practice of justice has expanded quite a bit for a lot of sanghas, particularly around inclusivity and sexual misconduct. I think there have been, over the past five years, such intense—I hate to use the word scandal but—real situations in sanghas that have created a lot of harm. From Shambhala to Rigpa to Against the Stream (these are the major ones), my monastery, Palpung Thubten Choling, people are aware of the potentiality of certain kinds of violence and injustices happening in their communities. I grew up in a Buddhist surrounding; both of my parents are very devout Buddhists. It’s a tradition that is deeply instilled in me and I feel like it’s almost part of my being. I can’t quite extricate myself from it even though lately I’ve grown quite disillusioned with it. Disillusioned in the sense that I feel Buddhism is kind of devolving into this very individualistic pursuit of just finding a way to be a little bit more at ease with your existence and minimizing suffering—which is completely valid. But I find that people get too engaged in that and they lose the larger justice based framework of Buddha dharma, which I find to be much more compelling and also authentic. You speak on that quite often in your book. Is there an evolution in that discourse that you’ve witnessed? Absolutely. I think what’s happening is that there are teachers like me who have decided to step outside of lineages and institutions to create the communities and sanghas that we most want to see. I’m no longer a reformist. I used to be a reformist. Can you explain what that is? I believed at one point in my teaching life, practice life, I can just change the sangha that I was in. That I could bring these issues of justice, inclusivity, ethics and so forth and try to transform the community to be based on these values. Over time I realized how difficult that was. And so I kind of transitioned into this space of being much more of a visionary and innovator. I just really started practising creating the communities that I want to see instead of super investing in communities to transform them. This is a better use of my time and energy. I had to make some really hard decisions about leaving a lot of sanghas to do this work of creating communities that are justice informed and ethically based. A lot of our communities, specifically here in the west and United States for instance... the convert, white western communities weren't really thinking about justice and ethics. They were just thinking about practising and feeling better and I think that has created a foundational sangha culture [in the west] which people are really attached to; [people] who will fight really hard to keep a foundational culture which is just really a culture of comfort and avoiding conflict. A culture that lacks transparency. And so when we bring up the idea of justice—it’s not that people are opposed to justice; they’re opposed to being uncomfortable. People can get with justice, people want accountability, people want to be safe, people don’t want to be victims of violence. I think that’s a universal desire. But when we talk about disrupting comfort in a culture people specifically created to be comfortable in, that’s the issue. That’s when justice becomes a problem. Whenever Buddhist teachers say stuff like in western societies, there’s an excess of materialism… and I’m like, you can be more specific and say rich white people. That kind of specificity I think has been lacking, and for me, my contention is that it continues to lack. There is this invisibilizing of people, even in western spaces, who don’t conform to that identity. There’s obviously a breadth of people from different backgrounds and ethnicities, but also in terms of class, ability, sexuality...we’re losing that granular aspect of it and I think that speaks to a great loss of how Buddha’s teachings are then transmitted. The idea of a practitioner early on, particularly in the west, was of a white, educated, resourced person. That’s still the stereotype of a practitioner now. Even a Buddhist is like a white person, not an Asian person, or anyone of any other racial background even though we have like the Dalai Lama, who’s like an icon—everyone knows who the Dalai Lama is. Many people have never met an Asian Buddhist practitioner, quite honestly, but a lot of folks know white folks [laughs] who walk around chanting with dharma names and wearing whatever. So when I came along, it was obvious that to be a practitioner was to somehow assimilate into a culture that actually erased much of my identity: my queerness, my Blackness. Back then, my economic class was erased. Class was actually one of the harder things for me to deal with. I just didn’t have endless resources to do retreats, to do teachings and to always offer money for everything. I felt super alienated and resentful to be in a path where money was always the thing that people operated from. And of course I heard all kinds of excuses and reasons why we have to charge [people] and to an extent I get that. But it’s still really restrictive for many of us. So now as a teacher I’ve made a commitment to try to make everything as accessible as possible. Economically, ability-wise… just trying to invite as many people as possible into the work that I’m doing and then challenging myself to make it even more accessible. But basically, I make it accessible by just being visible. People look at me and say, oh you’re a Buddhist. Not only are you a Buddhist, you’re a lama. Which I don’t even [understand]—how did I make it through this system to get this title? And knowing that there have been many lamas before me, even a couple of Black lamas, who haven’t had the level of visibility that I’ve had. I am a majority of people’s first Black lama that they’ve ever met. I’m the first one to have pushed through in this kind of public space and I mostly did that by stepping around lineage because quite frankly a lot of teachers are encapsulated within the lineage. The lineage can be quite competitive, it can be hierarchical, and I just never felt a part of that so I stepped out and created this whole other kind of, I don’t know, path into teaching. You were being a punk. Yeah. Well, my teacher Lama Norlha Rinpoche, that was one of the things he told me to do. This older Tibetan master was like, “I’m not Black. There are people that will not listen to me but they’ll listen to you. So you should go and try to do that.” That was one of the wisest things he ever told me. I have friends with Tibetan teachers who would never have heard that from their teachers. My teacher was like go out into the world and do what you feel is most skillful. I would go back to Rinpoche and tell him what I was teaching—justice, sex and all kinds of stuff—and he would be like, fine, whatever. Going back to your point about some of the different teachers who, for reasons that are sometimes beyond their control, don’t quite include the concept of class in how they build their sangha—I think that partly informs some of my resentment towards rinpoches and tulkus. They’ll speak grandiloquent things about how people are just too obsessed about work and earning money and that they should be less materialistic. Well that’s easy for you to say because you don’t have to worry about paying bills. A single mom who’s working in a factory shift or is a healthcare provider… they don’t have time to think about these things. So that’s kind of situating Buddha dharma squarely within the confines of course of a capitalistic society. I think this also speaks to your persistent theme of earth, of grounding yourself. Right. Wealth has always been a factor in Tibetan Buddhism. Tibetan Buddhism has been a feudal system. A lama is like a lord [laughs]. When I talk to teachers in other traditions, I have to communicate that when I say I am a lama, I have this incredible agency and autonomy. You get the title and you can do whatever you want. There is no accountability. Traditionally, if I were in a feudal system in medieval Tibet, I would be in a monastery or go off, claim territory, build a monastery, collect wealth from the local village and then maybe I’ll be recognized as a tulku. Wealth just begins to accumulate life after life and it keeps getting transferred into my reincarnation so it becomes this system of wealth transfer. Isn’t that so bizarre? It’s so bizarre! I mean there are all kinds of sophisticated ways that have been created to make sure wealth stays within a particular line of succession. There are present rinpoches who are incredibly wealthy—millions, billions of dollars, but we don’t talk about that at all. I have such animosity towards the accumulation of wealth in that way. I remember in my early days of going off to retreat, I would have to get financial aid. A week-long retreat may be $1,500. That was impossible for me to afford. That’s what I made in a month. So I would always have to get these hugely reduced retreat fees and in those days, [in order to get that discount] I had to work during the retreat. So it creates this class of people who are actually beginning to serve those who are more resourced. I resented that. I resented having to clean during retreat because I didn’t have the financial resources. It wasn’t ever framed in a way of like, “oh this just a service that we’re offering.” Only the poor people had to do this. It would have been much more intuitive if everyone had to do it. A lot of teachers now in retreat centres are structuring work in a way that everyone has to do work to help run a retreat. But back in those days, it was just the poor people, who were usually the young folks or the people of colour. Whenever I see large gatherings of Tibetan Buddhist teachings and the lama is seated high on a throne, usually very ornate and with a slate of attendants around… mostly him, it’s always a him—there’s not a lot of Tibetan women Buddhist teachers—and I would think it would be so revolutionary if that rinpoche who was doing the teaching made it a point to be level on the ground. To be level with the people seeking his teaching or wisdom, and to actually serve the people. I don’t think I’ve seen anything like that. Sometimes my teacher would cook and serve. But I think also the other part of that is the communities also really intensely force this kind of… Veneration. That’s true. Yeah, veneration. I know that early on—of course I experienced this on a very very small level—at the beginning of my teaching in my sanghas, I felt that pressure to be a certain way. To wear certain things and accept certain kinds of devotion, which I eventually resisted. It really, over time, influenced me to leave these intense communities altogether. I just think that people find a lot of comfort in that kind of veneration and I think there are teachers—doesn't matter their background, Tibetan or westerner—who actually don’t have the capacity to hold that level of devotion that people are expressing towards them. As I often say there are a lot of teachers, and this is extremely the case for Tibetan tulkus, where they’ve actually never had a chance to figure out who they were outside of a monastic institution. So they get recognized, get swept up into a system where they are actually being abused—emotionally, physically and sexually. And then they mature into adulthood and they have this incredible shadow side which is all this stuff, this material, that they’ve never processed and developed because they bypassed all of that. One of the reasons why we have these intense scandals with all these teachers is because they’re trying to get their needs fulfilled within a community where it’s inappropriate for those needs to be fulfilled. And also the notions of boundaries, things like agency and where someone is coming to you with authentic needs versus projections—that’s a skill, like you’ve said. A lot of it is the skill of discernment that you develop through the course of living and when that part of your life has been excised, swept up in this tradition of tulku and the teachings and the abuses, that all gets very distorted. Everyone’s a victim in the way this system has been conceived. I would say that it’s important for me in my teaching that I resist these forms of veneration because I want to live a life, and to have a teaching life and to be a teacher where I’m just really honest about my life. As a teacher, you have to know that I’m also queer and that I have these beliefs about sex positivity and relationship and dating and sex… I want that to be transparent. I don’t want you to ever assume that I’m like a monk. I actually get really offended, and a little scared when people from other spiritual paths relate to me like a monk. I’m like, you can’t do that. You can’t do that because I don’t want you to assume something that isn’t true. It’s important for me to be truthful about how I show up in the world as a teacher. It’s also a form of fragmentation in a way, right? Which is again something that you’re quite persistent in your book about it being a delusion that we need to remove and liberate ourselves from. Yeah, well it’s the distinction that we make between the public life and the private life. The private life becomes the shadow life. So you have these people who have these intense, devout and sacred public lives where they’re really wonderful and great. They’re saints. And then in their private life they begin to engage in certain desires and appetites that are not in line with their public self. I think that that’s what creates the struggle and the tension within sanghas. It’s that tension where teachers aren’t allowed to bring their personal and public lives together and it’s not accepted by the sangha. It’s also different though from how you explicate in the book about your need to differentiate your sangha and the people who look up to you versus your own community of friends and sexual partners. You make it a point to keep those groups discrete, right? Absolutely. Even when I’m on a hookup app and people recognize me [there] that becomes a really important space for me to set boundaries, to say this is who I am, this is what I believe in. Depending on how this relationship goes, it’s going to be a different relationship. Are you going to see me as a teacher? If you do then this other stuff isn’t going to happen. And that happens. If you’re more interested in me as a teacher then I can show up as that. But it can’t be this mixed thing because you have to keep those roles really separate and different. If there is any binary that you subscribe to, I guess that would be one of the few ones. Yeah, absolutely. It’s just getting clear about what you want. And it’s not to say that I haven’t had partners who’ve also seen me as a teacher. But they’ve seen me more as a partner and a lover than as a teacher, and that’s been really important for me to differentiate in that way. It’s just about being clear. I think it’s easy to kind of get addicted to the power that being a teacher offers you. That’s really where it gets messy in romantic situations. Are you into me because I’m a teacher or are you into me because you’re attracted to me? Oh that’s such an incredible tension or struggle. Because I can easily imagine so many times someone coming to you for guidance and that need and that projection and love and everything gets wrapped up and then that can easily become sexual. So it’s important for you to make it very clear from the outset that that’s a hard line that you want to maintain. I also have a very natural, built-in safeguard—which I think is just a result of very good, virtuous karma from past lives—this intuition that I have which is that I know what people are like, why people are approaching me, or why they want to be in a relationship with me. If people just see me as a teacher or a guide, I get completely turned off, sexually. It just naturally happens. I get really resentful, actually. That’s part of the safeguard that people would rather see me as a teacher than as this person that they want to get intimate with. And that’s a very different feeling than someone coming to me who wants to be with me romantically or as just a friend. It’s a whole different energy and I’ve just learned how to identify that. I’ve been in many spaces, casual and informal, where people recognize me and I can tell which way they’re gonna go. Sometimes [someone] will go, “oh it’s Lama Rod. That’s cool. I’m not interested in what you do but you’re cool.” On the other hand, it’s like “oh you’re Lama Rod. Can you teach me on the spot about something?” And I usually say no. [laughs] That’s not why I’m there. You write in your book that when you first met Norlha Rinpoche, there was this very incredible energy that you sensed within you and that intuitively told you that this is your teacher, in one form or another. I wonder for someone who’s perhaps seeking a teacher and who has that same kind of emanation of energy, what is your guidance on how to make sense of that energy and secondly, making sure that you then don’t project it in a way that becomes unhealthy and makes you prone to being manipulated or abused. Well, it’s different ways I want to answer that. Beginning with: how do we make sense of the feelings that we experience around certain teachers? For me, when a teacher opens up something inside of me, I see them as my teacher or one of my teachers. Because they have this incredible capacity to do something. To create this opening for me to do work and to understand dharma deeper. And so I take that person as a teacher. When we have those experiences I encourage people to see them as these invitations to move deeper into their own experience. I think all a teacher is doing is reflecting your wisdom back to you. They’re just mirrors and they’re pointing us back to these parts of ourselves that we’re discovering for the first time. I think the misconception is that somehow the teacher is doing something really extraordinary and special. That somehow the magic is with the teacher. I mean yeah there are incredibly powerfully realized teachers, but really, particularly in Vajrayana Tibetan Buddhism, the teacher is a mirror that points us back to our own wisdom, clarity and mind. So that’s what you’re experiencing, it’s just your self for the first time. I’ve had that [experience] so many times. Of course I’ve had to learn what that was. At the beginning, I was like, oh this teacher is powerful and they’re doing something. No, they’re actually just pointing back towards me and saying, look! You’re just like me, if you can just realize that. And if you trust that to take those people as a teacher in whatever way feels appropriate. Another way to think about this, from the perspective of students, is I think it’s really easy to lose agency within relationships with very realized folks because we feel as if we don’t know anything. It’s a very [infantilizing] relationship, where we become children. At my monastery, it was like we were all the kids and Rinpoche was like the dad. No decision could ever be made without consulting Rinpoche, but that was the culture. That’s Tibetan Buddhist culture because again the rinpoche, the abbot, is like the head of the manor, the king, the lord. And of course as someone who naturally distrusts authority I came into that really resentful. I was like, yeah of course I wanna ask Rinpoche about my personal practice but I don’t think Rinpoche needs to be consulted about the colour of curtains you’re going to put in the library. [laughs] I mean I just don’t think that’s necessary and I just got turned off over time by that kind of deference, that kind of, oh we can’t do anything without his consent. And so I was interested in agency; I wanted to make my own decisions. Again, my relationship with Rinpoche was him always reminding me that I have agency. I think partially he did that to get me out of the way. [laughs] To get me out of the community after I was authorized, to get me into the world. It’s hard and complex because I needed to be in the world. I wouldn’t be here, if he didn’t send me away. He dissuaded you from taking a second three-year retreat. Right. He was like, no. [laughs] He was like, “just go out into the world. Do something. If you still want to do the [retreat] after a bit, come back and do it.” Once I got into the world, I realized that this phase of my life was over, this retreat phase. But yeah, agency. I think this is a part of how we’re going to cut through abuse between teachers and students. For us, as students, to remember our agency, to remember that we can make choices. If something doesn’t feel comfortable, we have a right to say no. And then as a teacher—because I’m both a student and a teacher so I’m always flipping back and forth—my job is to make sure my needs are fulfilled outside of spiritual communities, and teacher student relationships. That I have other spaces that I have created in order to express different parts of who and what I am. I tell teachers all the time, you need to have friends who aren’t Buddhists. [laughs] Like you need really messy friends. I’m gay, queer… so I have really messy queer friends who are really catty, and really superficial and some of them are really selfish, but all really loving. So I take refuge in those communities. I’m not Lama Rod there; I’m like one of the girls. In that space, among my friends they’re like, “yeah, whatever. We see what you do. We see how you’re doing it but we’re here just to have fun and spend time with each other. You’re not here to teach us.” And I have friends who were very clear about those boundaries, and those were very hard to hear initially because it sounds like they don’t give a s**t about what I do. But instead, they’re saying “we respect what you do, but you’re not the teacher here. You can be the teacher somewhere else, but here you’re a friend.” So we have to find those spaces and create them. That will make us a better teacher. So I can go into spiritual communities, sanghas, whatever and I’m not forcing that community to meet all of my needs, which is how traditional monastic communities are established. All the needs, even sexual needs, are being met in ways that are not articulated but are known and experienced by almost everyone within an institution. The other thing I thought about when you spoke about the need for setting boundaries, having agency and all that, is also about being true about your state of mental health. In many ways the Buddhist tradition has means of addressing those. But in other ways I also feel like there’s this externalizing of it, where it feels like if you just pray on it, chant on it, meditate on it… that will hopefully find you some measure of relief. You were very deliberate in your book—you’ve actually outlined various different practices to deal with anger, contentment etc.—but you also state that if you need medication, therapy... you have to take that. It’s about skillful means. It’s about understanding the best way to reduce harm and violence. We also have to understand, as you know, within Tibetan psychology mental health is conceived of being very different. Mental health is externalized in Tibetan culture, whereas in western culture it’s internalized. So we [westerners] may experience depression, traditionally Tibetans experience demons. I’m not depressed; I’m just being tormented by this demon that I can actually direct practice towards. Like the practice of chöd (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ch%C3%B6d). What’s really interesting for us right now is that we’re moving through this synthesis where we’re bringing together western psychology, Tibetan psychology and trying to synthesize something that I think is really quite powerful. And I’m kind of back and forth with that because for me that kind of externalization of mental health is also in a way very Indigenous. There’s an indigeneity there that I’m really interested in. I think it’s maybe both. I think sometimes, growing up in the west, there are energetic forces that the best way for us to name it is to name mental illness, depression, or anxiety. But maybe it’s actually an energetic being that’s affecting us somehow. So I’m interested in discerning those nuances as well. — Part 2 (https://agoodrefugee.substack.com/p/black-queer-liberation-and-tibetan-848) This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit agoodrefugee.substack.com (https://agoodrefugee.substack.com?utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=CTA_1)

8. 

   3 Feb 2021

   For the love of reading - Manjushree Thapa (53 mins)

   Are you like many of us who feel trapped in this pandemic paradox where it feels like we have lots of time on our hands and yet unable to make our reading pile lighter? Then this episode is for you! Gelek speaks with writer, friend and fellow Nepali Torontonian Manjushree Thapa to get some insight into her reading projects (03:34), traveling across Colombia in the footsteps of Gabriel García Márquez (08:30), her writing process (26:11) and writing projects (35:15). They also mix in some spirited momo discourse, where Gelek tries to pitch Manjushree on his idea of co-hosting a Netflix show about these delectable Tibetan/Nepali dumplings (17:20). Bio Manjushree Thapa is a Nepali Canadian essayist, novelist and translator of Nepali literature into English. Her most recent novel “All of Us in Our Own Lives (https://anotherstory.ca/?q=h.tviewer&using_sb=status&qsb=keyword&qse=RZsUYuhDitjUetC9GpIhTA)” is a beautiful story of strangers who shape each other’s lives in fateful ways, about Nepalis in Nepal and abroad, about human interconnectedness, about privilege, and about the ethics of international aid. Manjushree’s non-fiction books include a travelogue, a biography, and a collection of editorials and reportage on Nepal’s Maoist war and peace process, including “Forget Kathmandu.” Manjushree currently lives in Toronto, Canada with her husband, the irrepressible journalist Daniel Lak. manjushreethapa.com (http://www.manjushreethapa.com/) Twitter (https://twitter.com/manjushreethapa) Episode notes * Reading as a way to cope with the pandemic. [02:00] * Manjushree’s reading projects: audiobooks, research vs pleasure. [03:34] * First reading project: Chinese literature. [05:25] * Reading Colombian writers and tracing the footsteps of Gabriel García Márquez in Colombia. [08:30] * What would a Manjushree Thapa-themed reading tour look like? [13:24] * Momo discourse! [17:20] * Understanding Manjushree’s love of Proust. [23:35] * Manjushree’s writing process; typing vs writing by hand. [26:11] * Current reading projects: quantum theory, memoirs, poetry... [30:00] * Writing own memoir, about Nepali feminism, pandemic writing setup, and more process. [35:15] * Eden Robinson’s Trickster series and the matter of Indigeneity. [41:26] * Reading tips from Manjushree, plus painting. [48:54] Reading list All of Us in Our Own Lives - Manjushree Thapa (https://anotherstory.ca/?q=h.tviewer&using_sb=status&qsb=keyword&qse=RZsUYuhDitjUetC9GpIhTA) Women Have No Nationality - Manjushree Thapa (Record Nepal) (https://www.recordnepal.com/perspective/women-have-no-nationality/) I Don’t Love You, Toronto: On Books and Cities - Manjushree Thapa (The Millions) (https://themillions.com/2017/08/dont-love-toronto-books-cities.html) Serve the People! - Yan Lianke (https://groveatlantic.com/book/serve-the-people/) Living to Tell the Tale Reader’s Guide - Gabriel García Márquez (https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/57992/living-to-tell-the-tale-by-gabriel-garcia-marquez-translated-by-edith-grossman/9781400034543/readers-guide/) In Search of Lost Time Volume V The Captive & The Fugitive - Marcel Proust (https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/136211/in-search-of-lost-time-volume-v-the-captive-and-the-fugitive-by-marcel-proust/) Son of a Trickster - Eden Robinson (https://anotherstory.ca/?q=h.tviewer&using_sb=status&qsb=keyword&qse=ERwtpK2h44BGLqrzmZpcqw) Monkey Beach - Eden Robinson (https://anotherstory.ca/?q=h.tviewer&using_sb=status&qsb=keyword&qse=5Z0NmApghbypTXO50zlGAw) Additional links Trembling Mountain - Kesang Tseten (2016; trailer) (https://vimeo.com/191335276) Trickster's 2nd season cancelled by CBC (CBC News) (https://www.cbc.ca/news/entertainment/trickster-cancelled-1.5893752) The Boyden Controversy is not about Bloodline - Robert Jago (The Walrus) (https://thewalrus.ca/the-boyden-controversy-is-not-about-bloodline/) The Real Education of Little Tree - Dana Rubin (Texas Monthly) (https://www.texasmonthly.com/articles/the-real-education-of-little-tree/) The White Tiger (2021; Netflix) (https://www.netflix.com/ca/title/80202877) This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit agoodrefugee.substack.com (https://agoodrefugee.substack.com?utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=CTA_1)

9. 

   29 Jan 2021

   2020 in review and 2021 in Tibetan oracle style (72 mins)

   Recorded on Jan 23, 2021 (which now feels like a lifetime ago), the GRP cast catch up to give a retrospective on 2020, and their most based and boring predictions for 2021. Everything from the shenanigans that unfolded on Jan 6 and Jan 21 (09:05), Gelek going nude on print (23:50), the biggest disappointments of 2020 (30:00), and what they think will happen in 2021 (49:00). Editor’s note: this episode was recorded prior to the GameStop and reddit/r/wallstreetbets situation, but the hosts of a Good Refugee Podcast were unfortunately not able to forecast that into their stock predictions. We regret this oversight. Episode notes * Choeyang and Tsering’s classes. [03:30] * How we processed the double events of Jan 6 and Jan 21. [09:05] * Tibetan cameo at Trump insurrection. [11:00] * How does the insurrection compare to other major events like 9/11? [14:20] * Tibetans vacationing in Mexico during a pandemic. [19:30] * Gelek’s Love Your Body photoshoot (https://nowtoronto.com/lifestyle/love-your-body/love-your-body-2021-gelek-badheytsang). [23:50] * Biggest disappointment of 2020: Centrist Dems conspiring against Bernie. [30:00] * Biggest disappointment 2: anti-maskers and anti-vaxxers. [34:20] * Biggest disappointment 3: tattoos (lack thereof). [35:30] * 2020’s most pleasant surprise: Zoom learning. [38:16] * Most pleasant surprise 2: gaming. [39:54] * Biggest flex of 2020: bleached hair. [44:36] * Biggest flex 2: squats! [47:42] * 2021 most boring prediction: collapse of bitcoin. [49:00] * Most boring prediction 2: lockdown and masks continue [51:34] * Most boring prediction 3: boring Biden bores on. [52:00] * Take most likely to get us cancelled: supporting another one of Gelek’s projects. [55:00] * Take most likely to get us cancelled 2: new Tibetan Sikyong not having any meaningful effect in the lives of regular Tibetans in exile and in Tibet. [56:56] * Take most likely to get us cancelled 3: lockdown! [59:15] * 2021 stock market prediction: Tesla gonna Tesla. [64:25] * Stock market prediction 2: cannabis high. [66:45] * 2021 wholesome prediction: going back home. [68:55] * Wholesome prediction 2: more solidarity and radical community building. [69:40] This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit agoodrefugee.substack.com (https://agoodrefugee.substack.com?utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=CTA_1)

10. 

    16 Jan 2021

    Training the next JEDI leaders - Annahid Dashtgard (45 mins)

    Author and change-maker Annahid Dashtgard chats with Gelek about her life and work confronting racism (00:55), how the oppressed can become oppressors (09:00), healing work among racialized peoples (18:30), the limits of diversity trainings (25:00), adding justice to EDI work (36:22), the upcoming Anima Leadership Conference (40:00), and more. Bio ANNAHID DASHTGARD is author, change-maker and co-founder of Anima Leadership (https://animaleadership.com/), a highly respected international consulting company specializing in issues of diversity and inclusion. Annahid has over 25 years of experience designing systemic change initiatives and coordinating programs at local, national and international levels. In her career, she has moved from organizing national political campaigns targeting broad scale change to studying the psychology of individual behaviour. She is the host of the podcast series Soundwaves of Belonging (https://podcasts.google.com/feed/aHR0cHM6Ly9mZWVkcy5ibHVicnJ5LmNvbS9mZWVkcy9icmVha2luZ3RoZW9jZWFuLnhtbA?sa=X&ved=0CAkQlvsGahcKEwjgt5m6qKHuAhUAAAAAHQAAAAAQAQ&hl=en-CA), and the director of two award-winning documentaries, Bye Buy World: The Battle of Seattle (https://www.videoout.ca/catalog/bye-buy-world-battle-seattle) and Bread (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pa4SWi4T5tM). Her memoir Breaking the Ocean: Race, Rebellion and Reconciliation (https://anotherstory.ca/?q=h.tviewer&using_sb=status&qsb=keyword&qse=temoIPlhFAhgZjbttqnxhA) launched August 2019 to rave reviews. On Jan 21 and 22, Annahid will be hosting Anima Leadership’s Ordinary People, Extraordinary Times Conference (https://animaleadership.com/opetc/). Episode notes * Annahid intro [00:55] * Dismantling Canadian exceptionalism (homegrown white extremism, Proud Boys). [04:40] * How the oppressed can become oppressors. [09:00] * Reconciliation vs accountability [13:40] * Cancel culture and how do you meet in the middle with a white supremacist? [16:45] * Importance of healing work among racialized peoples. [18:30] * Channeling rage against injustice properly. [21:20] * The limits of diversity and representation politics. [25:00] * @arayabaker: racial justice is not about diversity, it’s about overthrowing power (https://twitter.com/arayabaker/status/1212093074702315520?s=20). [32:00] * Diversity trainings being used as a checklist by organizations. [34:10] * J.E.D.I.: justice, equity, diversity and inclusion [36:22] * Anima Leadership Conference 2021 [40:00] This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit agoodrefugee.substack.com (https://agoodrefugee.substack.com?utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=CTA_1)

11. 

    2 Jan 2021

    Tibetan elections in exile - Kaysang and Tenzin Jigdal (92 mins)

    Happy New Year! Gelek and Choeyang caught up with Chitue (parliamentary) candidates Tenzin Kalsang (Kaysang) and Tenzin Jigdal to talk about the Tibetan elections taking place on Jan 3, 2021. They touch on initial thoughts about the upcoming election (02:10), the issues they want to highlight (9:05), how the Tibetan parliament-in-exile is set up (24:50), a literally earthshaking endorsement from Kaysang (70:25), dismantling the U-Tsang confederacy (77:30), and more. Episode notes * Initial thoughts about the upcoming election. [02:10] * Why did they run in these elections as Chitue candidates? [05:30] * What are some of the biggest issues you wanted to highlight? [9:05] * Perception of Tibetan issues as being monolithic, plus lack of class analysis. [14:10] * General lack of understanding of the parliamentary process. [19:00] * Tibetan parliament-in-exile setup. [24:50] * Is regional allocation (chölka) outdated? [31:05] * What does democracy mean to the two candidates? [39:00] * Religious sects getting 10 seats from the 45 total parliament seats. [44:50] * Rangzen (independence) vs umay lam (middle-way). [59:30] * How unity gets weaponized. [66:00] * Sikyong endorsements plus EARTHQUAKE! [70:25] * Dismantling the U-Tsang confederacy. [77:30] * Respectability and elitist politics and how class and power intersects. [79:00] * Why should Tibetans support you? [85:00] * Closing remarks [89:25] Bios Tenzin Kalsang is the co-founder of Drokmo, a feminist resource group working with Tibetan and Himalayan communities on gender justice. She is running for the 17th Tibetan Parliament-in-Exile, as an U-Tsang candidate. Instagram (https://www.instagram.com/kay.sang/) Tenzin Jigdal is running as a parliamentary candidate for one of the Dotoe seats. He’s an international coordinator for the International Tibet Network, and has also served in Tibet Action Institute and Students for a Free Tibet. Instagram (https://www.instagram.com/tenzin.jigdal/) This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit agoodrefugee.substack.com (https://agoodrefugee.substack.com?utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=CTA_1)

12. 

    27 Dec 2020

    Am I the A*****e? with Nishant Upadhyay (64 mins)

    Happy Holidays! The esteemed professionals and academics at a Good Refugee Pod get into the festive spirit by partaking in the joyous tradition of identifying people with a*****e tendencies. Gelek and Tsering, along with special guest Nishant Upadhyay, pass judgments on a housekeeper terrorized by plush lizard toys (05:25), the U.S. finding $600 for Americans (14:30), dick pic etiquette (22:40), Modi and the farmer protests in India (31:15), and our millennial casanova Martin Shkreli. Bonus discussion on the Bidens and the whole deal about credentials (52:30). Episode Notes * Nishant intro [04:00] * AITA for refusing to make my son get rid of a toy that scares our housekeeper? [05:25] * AITA for giving $600 stimulus checks to struggling Americans? [14:30] * AITA for getting mad at my mom for sending me a dick pic [22:40] * AITA for passing farmer’s bills in India and causing the largest protest ever? [31:15] * AITA for having a crush on a universally reviled pharma-bro [41:10] * Bonus: AITA for talking at any length about the importance of credentials [52:30] * Closing AITA remarks [60:25] Bio Nishant Upadhyay is an Assistant Professor of Ethnic Studies at the University of Colorado Boulder. They received their PhD at York University, Toronto in the Graduate Program of Social and Political Thought in 2016. Website (https://www.colorado.edu/ethnicstudies/people/core-faculty/nishant-upadhyay) Links AITA for refusing to make my son get rid of a toy that scares our housekeeper? (https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/kb3g6y/aita_for_refusing_to_make_my_son_get_rid_of_a_toy/) COVID-19 relief package: $600 stimulus checks, $300 bonus for federal unemployment benefits in new deal (https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/2020/12/20/stimulus-checks-unemployment-benefits-economy-covid-relief-package/3921356001/) AITA: my mom sent me a dick pic and is mad I’m mad? (https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/ka0e4w/aita_my_mom_sent_me_a_dick_pic_and_is_mad_im_mad/) Dozens die during India farmers’ protests; Modi offers more talks (https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2020/12/18/several-indian-farmers-dead-in-protests-against-farm-laws) The Journalist and the Pharma Bro (https://www.elle.com/life-love/a35021224/martin-shkreli-christie-smythe-pharma-bro-journalist/) This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit agoodrefugee.substack.com (https://agoodrefugee.substack.com?utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=CTA_1)

13. 

    22 Dec 2020

    The best music, films and fashion of 2020 - Susan Blight (72 mins)

    Gelek spoke with artist, educator, friend and troublemaker Susan Blight to get her take on the best films and music to come out of an impossibly bewildering and isolating year. The episode begins with Susan’s participation in Indigenous Fashion Week Toronto [03:00], what films mean to her and her top five selections [9:45], the Michelle Latimer issue [37:00], and finally, Susan’s connection to music and her top five records, plus song of the year [46:00] Episode Notes * Indigenous Fashion Week Toronto [03:00] * Susan’s connection to the world of cinema [9:45] * First film pick: Time (https://time.com/5900390/time-documentary-garrett-bradley/) [13:40] * maɬni – towards the ocean, towards the shore (http://www.skyhopinka.com/mani-towards-the-ocean-towards-the-shore) [16:00] * PLUCK (https://festival.docedge.nz/film/pluck/) [18:00] * POSSESSOR (https://www.imdb.com/title/tt5918982/) [24:00] * êmîcêtôcêt: Many Bloodlines (https://boxoffice.hotdocs.ca/websales/pages/info.aspx?evtinfo=125229~741853d5-bf72-40a5-a015-09aded779383&ep=1) [27:00] * Honorary mention: Mandalorian (https://disneyplusoriginals.disney.com/show/the-mandalorian) [28:30] * The importance of supporting Indigenous artists [34:10] * The Michelle Latimer controversy [37:00] * What music means to Susan [46:00] * First album: It Was Good Until It Wasn't (https://open.spotify.com/album/6ROLwnmW9pOioLned0DaP3) - Kehlani [48:20] * Featuring Ty Dolla $ign (https://open.spotify.com/album/6M4Nu5UgX097dxeF2lm9P8) - Ty Dolla $ign [51:05] * Shore (https://open.spotify.com/album/0lmjCPEcec2k6L7ysNIcd3) - Fleet Foxes [55:15] * City on Lock (https://open.spotify.com/album/7D7MbEqj5SqR0aFW5j9gid) - City Girls [57:00] * BLAME IT ON BABY (DELUXE) (https://open.spotify.com/album/7E2Jnmff9veZnuyOwXHGbS) - DaBaby [58:15] * Song of the year: Laugh Now Cry Later (feat. Lil Durk) (https://open.spotify.com/album/0qGdc7fNq9RNIPEzZufa43) [64:40] * Close [66:54] Bio Susan Blight (Anishinaabe, Couchiching First Nation) is an interdisciplinary artist working with public art, site-specific intervention, photography, film and social practice. Her solo and collaborative work engages questions of personal and cultural identity and its relationship to space. She is a PhD student in Social Justice Education at the University of Toronto and her dissertation examines Anishinaabeg geographies of resistance. In August 2019, Susan joined OCAD University as Delaney Chair in Indigenous Visual Culture and as Assistant Professor in the Faculty of Liberal Arts & Sciences and School of Interdisciplinary Studies. Twitter (https://twitter.com/Blightyboo) Website (https://www.susanblight.com/) Links imagineNATIVE Film + Media Arts Festival (https://imaginenative.org/) Indigenous Fashion Week Toronto (https://ifwtoronto.com/) Sovereign Screen (https://www.instagram.com/invcsovereignscreen/) Language and the Land (https://www.instagram.com/invclanguageandtheland/) This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit agoodrefugee.substack.com (https://agoodrefugee.substack.com?utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=CTA_1)

14. 

    6 Dec 2020

    Tibetan art in exile with Tenzing Sonam and Tenzin Dolker (61 mins)

    Gelek and Choeyang speak with Tenzing Sonam and Tenzin Dolker about the growth and evolution of Tibetan arts in the diaspora ahead of the launch of TibetFilms.com: how they first connected with art [02:04]; censorship as both restricting and liberating inside Tibet [16:20]; lack of institutional and community support for non-traditional Tibetan artists [27:00]; DIFF and TibetFilms.com [36:15]; and much more. Episode notes * Guest intros and how they first connected with art. [02:40] * How their art evolved over the years. [10:00] * Does censorship inside Tibet hinder or boost creativity there? [16:20] * How free are you as an artist outside Tibet? [21:30] * Lack of institutional and community support for non-traditional, non-religious Tibetan arts. [27:00] * How Tibetan artists are supported vs non Tibetan artists. [31:05] * Dolker’s current and future projects. [34:15] * Dharamshala International Film Festival (DIFF): origin, concept, hosting a festival during a pandemic. [36:15] * Launching TibetFilms.com (Dec 3 - Dec 13). [41:00] * How people can tune into TibetFilms.com and its different offerings. [46:00] * Tenzing’s current and future projects. [55:20] * Situation in Dharamshala. [57:20] Bios Tenzing Sonam was born in Darjeeling, India to Tibetan refugee parents. Working through White Crane Films, Tenzing and his wife Ritu Sarin have made more than 20 documentaries, several video installations and two dramatic features. A recurring subject in their work is the issue of Tibet, with which they have been intimately involved: personally, politically and artistically. Through their films, they have attempted to document, question and reflect on the questions of exile, identity, culture and nationalism that confront the Tibetan people. They are the directors of the Dharamshala International Film Festival, one of India’s leading independent film festivals, which they founded in 2012. They are based in Dharamshala. Tenzin Dolker is a Tibetan exile, born and raised in a Tibetan refugee camp in South India. Prior to her work as a photographer, Dolker was a co-founder of Dharamshala Dance Arts where she managed the day-to-day activities of the center and taught Bollywood dance and yoga. She is a vocal advocate and activist in the Tibetan Freedom Movement. Photography gave Dolker a voice to explore, learn, question and accept her space and existence by observing and documenting people, culture and the uncertain quietness of everyday lives. In 2019, Dolker played the lead role in the Tibetan feature film, The Sweet Requiem. She’s currently based in New Orleans. Links TibetFilms.com (https://online.diff.co.in/) (Dec 3 - 13) Dharamshala International Film Festival (https://diff.co.in/) White Crane Films (https://whitecranefilms.com/) Drung Films (http://drung.in/) Nangpa la Pass 2006 shooting incident (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nangpa_La_shooting_incident) This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit agoodrefugee.substack.com (https://agoodrefugee.substack.com?utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=CTA_1)

15. 

    1 Dec 2020

    What makes a good Tibetan refugee? (65 mins)

    In this sprawling and freewheeling conversation, a Good Refugee Podcast tackles the messy, meandering ways that political and personal identities evolve in the diaspora (03:30), the interplay of politics and religion in Tibetan lives (16:00), revisiting His Holiness’s pretty Dalai Lama joke from 2019 (28:00), Palestine (39:00), and more. Episode notes * What does/how should the Tibetan political identity look like in the diaspora? [03:30] * When did you start being aware of your Tibetan identity? [08:30] * The easy trappings of Tibetan political tropes in a Western setting. [16:00] * Buddhism superiority/sincerity paradox. [26:00] * Revisiting HHDL’s pretty Dalai Lama joke and the immediate aftermath. [28:00] * President of the Central Tibetan Administration visiting Israel in 2018. [39:00] * Concluding thoughts on Tibetan identity, Buddhism, justice, freedom, etc. [44:20] * Final remarks, featuring Korean dramas and hot takes re Attack on Titan. [61:30] Articles of interest: CTA President Dr Lobsang Sangay marks fruitful first visit to Israel - Tibet.net (June 26, 2018) (https://tibet.net/cta-president-dr-lobsang-sangay-marks-fruitful-first-visit-to-israel/) The Dalai Lama on Trump, women and going home - BBC (June 27, 2019) (https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-48772175) This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit agoodrefugee.substack.com (https://agoodrefugee.substack.com?utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=CTA_1)

16. 

    22 Nov 2020

    Love, solidarity & mutual aid with Kalaya'an Mendoza (62 mins)

    A Good Refugee pod welcomes a new co-host: Tenzin Choeyang! In this episode, we speak with Kalaya’an Mendoza about his work as an election defender (8:20); mutual aid and community justice in the time of COVID and state violence (12:20); how Kalaya’an got involved with the Tibetan freedom movement (30:20); weaponization of non-violence (44:00); and much more. Bio: Kalaya’an Mendoza [He/Him/Siya] resides on occupied Lenape territory. He is a Queer, Hard of Hearing Filipino American organizer and human rights activist who has been engaged in nonviolent civil resistance for the past two decades. His work is currently focused on voter protection, community defense and tactical safety and security training in the lead up and aftermath of the 2020 election. He is the co-founder of Across Frontlines, an organization that works alongside frontline human rights defenders to keep their communities safe from state and non state actor violence. Instagram (https://www.instagram.com/kalamendoza/)Twitter (https://twitter.com/kalamendoza) Episode notes * Tenzin Choeyang intro. [00:30] * Kalaya’an Mendoza intro. [03:10] * Kala’s work during the U.S. elections. [05:50] * Self-care as an election defender. [08:20] * How is mutual aid operating during this time? [12:20] * How to separate electoral work from the work of decolonization, police abolition, etc. [17:30] * Organizing from a space of abundance vs scarcity. [22:10] * Naruto runs and Avatar bending as resistance. [28:40] * What drew Kala to the Tibetan cause. [30:20] * How to resist the unrelenting rise of neoliberal power as an organizer. [38:30] * Is non-violence civil resistance the best path forward? [44:00] * Kala’s action during Beijing Olympics 2018. [47:15] * Kala’s current projects. [54:05] * How Kala developed practice of self-care and community care. [55:55] Links Across Frontlines (https://acrossfrontlines.org)Instagram (https://www.instagram.com/acrossfrontlines) This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit agoodrefugee.substack.com (https://agoodrefugee.substack.com?utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=CTA_1)

17. 

    1 Nov 2020

    Trump, Tibet, the decline of America & Nov 3 - Carole McGranahan (55 mins)

    Gelek speaks with professor Carole McGranahan about what’s at stake on Nov 3, Trump’s incredible capacity for mendacity (05:00), why Tibetan Americans should think twice about supporting Trump (28:00), China vs the U.S. (40:00), and what’s a good refugee to do going forward (43:00). Bio: Professor Carole McGranahan is an anthropologist and historian of Tibet and the Himalayas, and a professor at the University of Colorado. She conducts research, writes, lectures, and teaches. At any given time, professor McGranahan is probably working on one of the following projects: political asylum and refugee citizenship in the Tibetan diaspora (Canada, France, India, Nepal, Switzerland, and the USA); Tibet, the British empire, and the Pangdatsang family; the self-immolations in Tibet; the CIA and the Chushi Gangdrug resistance army; and, anthropology as theoretical storytelling. She lives in the mountains outside of Boulder, Colorado. carolemcgranahan.com (http://www.carolemcgranahan.com/) Episode notes: * State of America heading into Nov 3 election [03:00] * Do Trump’s lies really break from past American presidencies? [05:00] * Is Trump the logical endpoint of America as a settler colonial project? [14:00] * Is a Biden administration really a true, progressive force that people think it will be? [19:00] * Local state elections and voter suppression [23:00] * Tibetans, Trump and Tibetan conservatism [28:00] * American presidents who stood up for Tibet against China [37:00] * What’s so bad about China’s rise to the top? [40:00] * Tibetan refugees and good refugees [43:00] * Final thoughts and go vote (for Biden)! [53:00] Projects in the works: Book on Pangdatsang family. Research project on political asylum and questions of citizenship in the Tibetan diaspora. “The Tibet Reader” book in collaboration with Dechen Pemba (High Peaks Pure Earth), Lama Jabb (Oxford University), Nicole Willock (Old Dominion University) and Dhondup Tashi Rekjong (Northwestern University). Reading: A Presidential Archive of Lies: Racism, Twitter, and a History of the Present,” International Journal of Communication 13, 2019, pp. 3164-3182. “An Anthropology of Lying: Trump and the Political Sociality of Moral Outrage,” American Ethnologist 44(2), 2017, pp. 243-248. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit agoodrefugee.substack.com (https://agoodrefugee.substack.com?utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=CTA_1)

18. 

    31 Oct 2020

    Episode 1: Breaking down the pivotal Tibetan Trump voting bloc, with Dechen Tsering

    A Good Refugee Podcast is your source for news, opinions and questions from troubled (Tibetan) minds. We endeavour to challenge the mainstream imagination of Tibetans (and other refugees) as peaceful, momo-loving mystics—well, many of us are mystical, and we do love momos, but we also want to move beyond the traditional trope of the hardworking immigrant. We want to disturb the conversations about migrants seeking refuge on colonized lands, and imagine how we can help create a just, free and protected Earth for Black, Indigenous and all dispossessed peoples. A Good Refugee Podcast was conceived by Gelek Badheytsang, a Tibetan Canadian who lives in Toronto and dabbles in writing, photography and now, podcasting. Twitter: @gelekb (https://twitter.com/GelekB) He is joined by co-host Tsering Yangzom from Cambridge, MA, who is also Tibetan as well as an American (yikes). She is currently completing her masters degree at Harvard Divinity School, where she is studying Tibetan Buddhism, conflict and politics. Twitter: @sayoyobae (https://twitter.com/sayoyobae) For the first episode, we interview Dechen Tsering and talk to her about why she thinks Tibetans shouldn’t support Trump [16:00], why Biden and Harris represent a lifeline for America [37:00], and why it takes more than a vote to be an active and compassionate citizen [48:00], among many other things. Bio: Dechen Tsering is a public health specialist at the City of Berkeley where she manages multiple health programs and administers grants funded by the City of Berkeley’s tax on sugary beverages, first in the nation. She has worked in international development, philanthropy, women’s and LGBTIQ rights advocacy and health care through Community Health for Asian Americans, Global Fund for Women, Seva Foundation, and Tibetan Delek Hospital. Dechen is the first out-lesbian in the Bay Area Tibetan community and a former president of the Tibetan Association of Northern California. Dechen is a co-founder of ACHA-Himalayan Sisterhood, a volunteer organization empowering survivors of gender-based violence in and outside the US. She is a trained domestic violence counselor and a member of San Francisco’s Asian Women’s Shelter (AWS) volunteer network. For 10 years, Dechen has been an active participant of a statewide gathering Strength collaborative of Asian American advocates against gender-based violence. Dechen is passionate about civic engagement, social justice, human rights and the rights of marginalized communities. Dechen lives in Berkeley, CA with her partner. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit agoodrefugee.substack.com (https://agoodrefugee.substack.com?utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=CTA_1)

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