Listen in as we discuss art, life, and the Christian faith
Art Life Faith Podcast
Claim This Podcastby Roger W. Lowther
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Listen in as we discuss art, life, and the Christian faith
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Recent Episodes
July 16, 2026
76. Consolations of a Christian
<div class="wp-block-image"> <figure class="aligncenter size-large is-resized"><a href="https://www.amazon.com/dp/1953704603/" target="_blank" rel=" noreferrer noopener"><img fetchpriority="high" decoding="async" width="634" height="1024" src="https://www.rogerwlowther.com/wp-content/uploads/2026/07/Consolations-Cover-Final-634x1024.jpg" alt="" class="wp-image-8869" style="aspect-ratio:0.6191404948215905;width:235px;height:auto" srcset="https://www.rogerwlowther.com/wp-content/uploads/2026/07/Consolations-Cover-Final-634x1024.jpg 634w, https://www.rogerwlowther.com/wp-content/uploads/2026/07/Consolations-Cover-Final-186x300.jpg 186w, https://www.rogerwlowther.com/wp-content/uploads/2026/07/Consolations-Cover-Final-768x1241.jpg 768w, https://www.rogerwlowther.com/wp-content/uploads/2026/07/Consolations-Cover-Final-951x1536.jpg 951w, https://www.rogerwlowther.com/wp-content/uploads/2026/07/Consolations-Cover-Final-1268x2048.jpg 1268w, https://www.rogerwlowther.com/wp-content/uploads/2026/07/Consolations-Cover-Final-200x323.jpg 200w, https://www.rogerwlowther.com/wp-content/uploads/2026/07/Consolations-Cover-Final-495x800.jpg 495w, https://www.rogerwlowther.com/wp-content/uploads/2026/07/Consolations-Cover-Final-248x400.jpg 248w, https://www.rogerwlowther.com/wp-content/uploads/2026/07/Consolations-Cover-Final.jpg 1435w" sizes="(max-width: 634px) 100vw, 634px" /></a></figure> </div> <div class="wp-block-buttons is-content-justification-center is-layout-flex wp-container-core-buttons-is-layout-fe48e5de wp-block-buttons-is-layout-flex"> <div class="wp-block-button"><a class="wp-block-button__link wp-element-button" href="https://www.amazon.com/dp/1953704603/" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer noopener">BUY CONSOLATIONS OF A CHRISTIAN</a></div> </div> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">This is the Art Life Faith Podcast, and I’m your host, Roger Lowther.</p> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">I’m excited to announce to you that we just released a new book, Consolations of a Christian, by Japanese writer Kanzo Uchimura. Written in 1893, it has never before been translated into English, which is surprising because this is the book that made Uchimura famous, instantly becoming a bestseller and launching his career as a writer. Here’s some backstory for this book. In 1890, the Emperor of Japan issued an Imperial Rescript on Education. Kanzo Uchimura was at that time a teacher in one of the top schools in the country, but he did not bow deeply enough to the Emperor’s signature on the document, for as a Christian, he saw this as a kind of idolatry. However, his fellow faculty members saw this as a huge sign of disrespect, and the press saw it as an act of treason. His name and face were plastered on newspapers across the country. He was fired from his job. His friends distanced themselves from him. He fell into deep poverty. And from all the stress, he got really, really sick, even to the point of death. While his wife was caring for him, she too got very sick, and then she died. This was especially crushing because they were newlyweds, having been married little more than a year.</p> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">Uchimura hit rock bottom in his life, but rather than giving up, he cried out to God in ink, brush, and paper, capturing the minds and hearts of so many with his uniquely Japanese understanding of the Bible. And his book came out during a time when Christian books were mostly just translated Western authors. This book is fascinating for many reasons, but I can tell you from personal experience that I was greatly encouraged working on this project, and so I know it can be a great consolation and comfort to you as well, and anyone going through a difficult time in their life.</p> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">Let me say a quick word about the translator. Chris Born is a longtime friend of our Grace City Church community here in Tokyo. First, he came for a year to work on his doctoral thesis on Uchimura, and during that time he and his family poured into the church community, helping with many of the ministries. Then he returned to the States, where he’s the Associate Professor of Japanese and Asian Studies at Belmont University in Nashville, Tennessee. But he recently came back to Japan for post-doctoral research and to write a number of books including this one. Again, he and his family poured into the community, and even his oldest daughter worked with us as an intern, giving piano concerts, leading worship with her playing and singing, and helping out in so many ways. They go back to America this month, and we’re very sorry to see them go. They will be missed.</p> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">Let me also say a word about the cover designer, created by the immensely talented Emma Grace von Fange, one of the interns who worked with us this summer. She did such a beautiful job getting inspiration from the text and making it appealing while also giving a sense of what we find inside. It’s a very attractive cover and really a work of art. I’m so grateful for her hard work on this project.</p> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">Recently we had the launch day, and one of the church members threw a dinner party for the event. So I took a few minutes to sit down with a translator just before the party to invite all of you into the celebration. Here’s our conversation.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">So today is the launch day of Consolations of a Christian by Kanzo Uchimura, translated by Christopher Born, who is sitting right next to me. Thank you so much for being with us tonight.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Chris</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">Thanks for having me, Roger. This is awesome.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">Yeah, so we are meeting in a friend’s home downtown Tokyo. We’re going to have a launch party tonight. Some of us are already here preparing the food, and others are going to be arriving soon. You’re probably going to hear some doorbell ringing…</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Chris</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">So pull up a chair and hang out with us.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">I’m just so thankful that it’s finally out in the world as of today, July 13, 2026.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Chris</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">Wow. Unbelievable.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">A lot of time has gone into this, hasn’t it?</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Chris</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">Yes, from your own kind encouragement for me to follow through and get it done from about 10 years ago when I started it to bringing it to completion just now. It’s been quite a journey, but exciting to be part of it and also be working so closely with an amazing team. Really, you assembled a wonderful cover designer, and you’ve done so much of the editing.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">She was great.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Chris</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">She was fantastic, and you put it together so quickly. I mean, you really have a lot of talent behind this project. You just made it pop and shine. I’m grateful.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">I really like that about putting out books. It’s not just about the writer writing solo in a solitary room somewhere, but there are a lot of people who are part of the whole project and are excited for it when it comes out.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Chris</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">That’s right. It’s a big production team.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">Yeah. So, how did you get into this project? Why did you translate this book?</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Chris</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">So that’s a great story for me. I’ve been studying Uchimura since about 2009. When I was working at a seminary, and I was able to take courses while I was working there as like staff. I took a course called Christianity in East Asia because that was always interesting to me. And when I did my master’s in East Asian studies, we covered some tangential aspects about Christianity in the Meiji period and how it influenced social movements, how there was a big missions movement that helped grow women’s education and the YMCA, things like that, but we never focused on Japanese Christian thinkers. So this course was the first time I was exposed to an actual Japanese Christian thinker who not only originated a number of writings but also had his own theological perceptions from a Japanese perspective that he wanted to add to sort of global Christianity. And he really thought that if Japan learned about Jesus and became more Christian, it would be a light to the world. So I thought that was an interesting entryway.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">Okay, so using Western years, when are we talking about?</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Chris</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">Uchimura lived from 1861 to 1930. He became a Christian around 1873 when he went off to Sapporo Agricultural College, which is now University of Hokkaido, one of the larger state schools. And when he became a Christian, he realized monotheism was the answer to a lot of his problems because he had such a strong religiosity as a kid and would bow to every shrine and every temple. And as he got older as a student, he really still held on to those beliefs. But when monotheism was presented to him, he really didn’t want to become a Christian. He was sort of pressured into it, but he went along with it primarily because he said, well, there’s only one God I need to worship, then I don’t need to worry about all the other gods. So that I thought was interesting because Japanese are famously known for having 8 million gods or something like that.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">Okay, so for those who don’t know their Japanese history, this is like the very beginnings of Protestant church planting in Japan.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Chris</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">Yes.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">So he’s one of the first of modern Christians.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Chris</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">That’s right. Christianity was banned from about 1609 to 1872. In the interim, in 1859, there was some missions activity but it was kind of underground. Uchimura was a part of the early generation of the different bands. There’s the Sapporo Band and the Yokohama Band and the Kumamoto Band in Kyushu. So these were sort of early Christian groupings. Uchimura was from up north. But yeah, he was active in the 1890s when he came back to Japan. He had studied abroad in America in the 1880s and sort of grew. He was always good at English, but he went to, Amherst College and then went off to Hartford Seminary before realizing—</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">Near Boston.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Chris</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">Near Boston, yes. Northeast. In the book, you’ll see a lot of references to northeastern literature and sort of abolitionist thinkers. He loved them.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">Yeah, actually that was fun for me because I grew up near Boston, so a lot of the things he’s mentioning only people in Boston know. Like Mount Monadnock, a mountain I climbed with my dad.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Chris</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">Does it look like Fuji?</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">Well, it stands on its own and it is kind of conical, but it’s really short. It’s not a very tall mountain at all. It’s more like a tall hill.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Chris</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">There you go. So even better comparison to how much more grandeur Fuji has, which he keeps referring to. But yeah, he loved the northeast. In his other book that was written in English called How I Became a Christian, or Diary of a Japanese Convert, he talks about his experiences in the northeast.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">How can you explain why Uchimura is important? Why should we care? That was a long time ago.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Chris</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">As one of Japan’s earliest modern Christians—I mean, his collected works are 40 volumes. He was an important thinker for the time period. Not only did he write in a Christian vernacular of the time, he attracted a number of future authors who would become aware of Christianity, at least in terms of their own understanding of the world. Even if they didn’t become Christians, they embraced a partially Christian worldview or romantic worldview. So from a literary perspective, which is what my main focus of my academic work was on how he’s an important literary figure, but I knew that he was an important Christian figure. And for Japanese theologians in general, anybody who’s going to seminary knows who Uchimura is and has read him. Now, the reason this book is important is everyone suffers, right? Everyone has a hard time. We get sick. Our wives get sick. People die. People we love are gone in an instant. We don’t know what tomorrow is going to look like. We can lose our job. We can get canceled because of the things we say and do. Even if we’re speaking the truth, we get punished for it.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">Mm-hmm.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Chris</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">Uchimura suffered for telling the truth as he saw it, and he was willing to take that on and be that lightning rod in a society that was quickly becoming anti-Western and anti-Christian. And especially in the mid-1880s when he was still in America, there was a big turn toward emperor worship and connecting the state to religion in a very strong way, and in the 1890s when the Imperial Rescript on Education came out and later the 1891 Constitution, they really pointed to the emperor as the Confucian father of the nation that everyone must worship and obey. And Uchimura’s like, “Look, I respect the emperor as much as the next guy. He is my sovereign, but I’m not going to bow down and worship him in that way.” And as a result, that made him become persona non grata. That turned him into an anti-patriot to like the worst of the worst, the most disloyal of the disloyal, and of course in a Confucian samurai heritage worldview, that’s terrible. Disloyalty is the worst thing, right? So Uchimura suffered as a result of his own public intellectual beliefs, and then as a result, he lost everything, and part of losing everything meant he had to reinvent himself, and so he became an author as part of that process.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">One of my favorite parts of the book is in the afterword where he’s talking about when he was writing the book and an American missionary, came in and said, so Mr. Uchimura, what are you working on? And he’s like, well, I’m writing this book. And he’s like, oh, what are you translating? He’s like, no, I’m not translating. I’m writing it, my own words. And the missionary was, was surprised and like, how can you be doing that? I mean, because Christianity came from the West, what right do you have as a Japanese to write? That was the attitude of the time.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Chris</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">Yeah, it was a very culturally bound enterprise, reproducing Western culture, civilizing the world, so to speak. And many Westerners didn’t think Japan was civilized. They had no idea how civilized it was.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">Yeah. And you were explaining to me earlier how he was trying to figure out what it means to be Japanese and be Christian because there wasn’t—</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Chris</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">It’s an identity issue.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">There wasn’t any literature at that time. They were only looking at translated Western literature. And so he was kind of delving into this to try to figure it out, right?</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Chris</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">That’s right. When he did become a Christian, the amount of stuff they had at Hokkaido University or Sapporo Agricultural College was so small. The amount of things they had to work with were so small. They were just some tracts, a few— they had a Western Bible, they had some parts of the Bible translated that was still in process, and they had things from many different denominations, so they didn’t know what was what and which one to ally with. And he became a Christian through the Methodists, but in Sapporo you had a Methodist church and an Episcopal church, and he wanted to work with both, and sort of create an independent Japanese church in Sapporo, but there was really no way to do that. They had to make it up themselves. And when the Western missionaries who they borrowed money from got wind of this, they were like, “You have to give us all our money back because you’re not part of us anymore.” So they scrimped and saved and did everything they could to pay it back. So there is this sense that independence, Japanese theology from a Japanese perspective became his life’s work.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">So Uchimura is part of the birth of the church in Japan. So to me, as a missionary here, it’s especiallyinteresting. This is the first time ever that this book is in English.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Chris</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">That’s right.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">I mean, it was published in 1893.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Chris</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">Yes.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">And it’s incredibly important to missionaries today, and yet there’s never been an English version. And you translated it from classical Japanese.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Chris</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">That’s right.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">So it’s really difficult Japanese.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Chris</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">It’s really difficult. It’s a long process of learning to be able to parse all that out. There is a modern translation now, but the original I thought was best to go from and take it from Uchimura’s own words.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">It uses a lot of characters that aren’t used anymore. You showed me your manuscript, which is a work of art, by the way, all your notes around all of his, all the earlier published version, but like, I don’t even know what to call that. I mean, just various characters that are…</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Chris</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">Yeah, kyujitai. Most Japanese don’t read it. I was talking to some students earlier today at a campus here, just kind of explaining that this book’s coming out and what it’s about, and I think maybe one or two knew who Uchimura was, and they knew about this fukeijiken or this incident of disloyalty to the emperor, or lesè-majesté as they call it, but they said they’d never read him, and when I mentioned it’s all written in this kind of really classical style Japanese, they’re like, “Yeah, we don’t really read that.” Yeah, I imagine not. He’s still unknown, so we can also help people understand that you can get a modern Japanese translation too, but I think Americans especially who want to know more about Japan at that time and about sort of authentic Japanese Christians and just from the perspective of a very sensitive soul who loves God and is searching for answers to his pain.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">Right, that’s what I love about this book. He’s not afraid to basically be cry out to God, Why are you allowing these things things? And trying to search for the answers as a Japanese person, not trying to look for pat answers, but asking in his context, really what’s going on, how can I apply to it? And it’s just so interesting?</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Chris</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">Right? Because one of the most important questions any human being will ever ask is, who is Jesus Christ and why does he matter?</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">Right.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Chris</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">And Uchimura knew who he was and why he mattered, but in the midst of this sort of dark doldrums of the soul why Jesus really mattered wasn’t just a nice, you know, it’ll all be okay someday, and just being a Christian makes everything all right. No, it’s like, Lord, you are my God, and I’m imploring you to give me an answer and give me strength and understanding to get through this situation.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">Okay, so now you touched on this briefly. It’s called Consolations of a Christian. Why is this book important to people who may have little interest in Japan?</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Chris</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">Sure, well, it certainly is full of what we call classical allusions to both Japanese literature, nature, history, and culture that are written for a Japanese audience. So he wasn’t writing it for us. So as a foreigner looking in on that, we can get a glimpse on the conversation which Uchimura is having with his own people about Christianity.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">And with himself.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Chris</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">And of course with himself, and with God, and all the other little demonic voices that are harassing him.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">You know, one of the things I thought was really interesting about the book, you’ve mentioned to me in conversation just how there’s a number of places where he lists scripture verses, but he doesn’t print it out.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Chris</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">That’s right.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">And you said it was your idea that perhaps it was because he was wanting people to open the Bible for the first time. Most of the people who read this book were not Christians.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Chris</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">That’s right.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">Because he wanted people who didn’t know anything about Christianity, very few did at that time, to read this and become interested in the God of the Bible. And he really makes that clear at the end of the book, right? Especially on the last two pages. “We looked at different answers throughout this book, but it’s clear the Bible is going to offer these answers that you really are searching for. God has those answers. Don’t stop until you find those answers.” That kind of thing.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Chris</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">That’s right. All of his literature points back to that. He doesn’t waver on that one bit. And in fact, he devoted his life to becoming a journalist for a while. He wrote for the Yorozu Choho for about 5 years, which was kind of like a New York Post or a LA Times kind of magazine, a little bit sensationalist but very political. He was the English language editor of that for a number of years until he decided to quit that and start his own work, which was called Seisho no Kenkyu, the Study of the Bible. And it was a magazine that he put out, which was all his own reading, parsing, interpreting the Bible and applying it to daily life.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">To the general public, right? Not only to churches or Christians, but to everybody?</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Chris</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">A lot of people were reading this even if they weren’t Christian. They were curious. Consolations of a Christian was a bestseller. And then as a result, he became hired as a journalist, then those copies of Yorozu Joho were also circulating, and then Seishun no Kinkyu as well. So, he really did use the words that he wrote as a way of reaching people in an evangelical way and pushing them to look at the Bible. That’s what all his life was about.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">Well, this book was very meaningful for me. The fact that he, in the lowest point in his life, that he would turn to writing, crying to God, and trying to bring the nation along with him to cry out to God. He didn’t fall into despair, but he gave that anguish to God.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Chris</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">Yes.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">And that’s just such an important message for all of humanity.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Chris</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">Yes.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">You know, anywhere in the world, we all suffer.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Chris</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">That’s right.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">And the fact that he writes a whole book addressing that and trying to help us turn to God through that is so important.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Chris</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">Yeah, because the Bible says God draws near to those who are suffering, and we suffer with Christ. But Christ was there with him in that suffering. In that moment, he knew it, but he had to put that anguish towards and use it for something. And that’s what’s really cool. He never wasted the experiences he had. He says it’s not my autobiography, but it’s a record of an authentic person who’s trying to struggle with being Christian. I think that’s gorgeous.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">So I hope many of you who are listening to this will download this book, either buy the paperback, buy the hardcover, buy the ebook, go get the Kindle. It’s such a blessing that you’ve done this. Thank you so much.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Chris</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">Thank you so much for working with me and giving me the opportunity.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">Yeah, so I guess we better get this party started.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Chris</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">Let’s enjoy this gathering around this table in many ways similar to what Uchimura would have done.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">All right, so thank you for talking with us now.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Chris</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">Thank you. Thanks so much.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p class="wp-block-paragraph">You’ve been listening to the Art Life Faith Podcast. You can pick up a copy of Consolations of a Christian by Kanzo Uchimura wherever you buy your books online. As we say in Japan, “Ja, mata ne!” We’ll see you next time.</p>
June 13, 2026
75. IziBongo Panel Discussion
<h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p>Welcome to the Art Life Faith Podcast, and I’m your host, Roger Lowther.</p> <p>We are recording live from the JCAMM conference in downtown Tokyo with the theme of “The Beauty of Japan・The Beauty of Heaven.” It’s a week-long conference from Friday, May 22 to Wednesday, May 27, 2026, where we are talking about the arts of Japan, the beauty of Japan, and how that helps us worship God. We’ve had so many amazing guests this week, and now I have the privilege of sitting down with one of our key presenters, a band like no other I’ve ever seen in the world called IziBongo. They sing not only in the various languages of the world, but they use the various instruments of the world and the various styles and genres of the world so people can see what it looks like for the nations to praise God and how that can lead us all in praise of God. So I wanted to sit down with them and have a conversation.</p> <p>I’ve also asked Akira Mori to sit down with us. He is our MC for the conference, and he’s a longtime friend and partner. We got to know each other very well through the 2011 earthquake, tsunami, and nuclear disaster. He’s the pastor of Global Mission Chapel in Iwaki, Japan, not too far south of the nuclear power plants in Fukushima. And his amazing church was one of the key centers for relief work for all of Tohoku. Through the years, we’ve gotten to know each other better, and I’ve so appreciated not just his encouragement and the way he leads especially movements of prayer in Japan but the way he’s encouraged me personally and for his friendship. And so I invited him to be the MC for this conference and also to be with us for this podcast episode. So thank you, all of you, for being here.</p> <p>Why don’t we start with a quick introduction? Please tell me who are you and where this name IziBongo came from. It’s kind of an interesting name.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Cory</h5> <p>Sure, Izibongo is a Zulu word which means praises intoned in honor of a person. It’s a kind of praise poetry. This is a second generation of the group itself, originally called the Wycliffe World Music Band, which came from Wycliffe Bible Translators.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p>Not as catchy…</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Cory</h5> <p>Yeah…, which came from Wycliffe Bible Translators.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p>Okay, so what do you do? Why did you form IziBongo?</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Cory</h5> <p>Originally, the Wycliffe World Music Band was meant to be an illustrative form of the music of the world and to promote Bible translation. That was one of the hopes for the people who organized it. We would go to Christian music festivals and perform there to show how the nations would worship or do their songs.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Paul</h5> <p>I might add that originally it was an ad hoc group of students in a particular class learning about some of these principles of music and worship around the world. The leader of that class was our mentor, Tom Avery. He would gather the students and throw instruments at them and say, “Sing this and let’s play this.” And so it was just to appreciate the worship around the world. This developed out of that educational starting point to more of a worship focus and whatever it is today.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Cathy</h5> <p>Another point that Tom would make when teaching us these songs was that music is not a universal language, it’s a universal phenomenon. But different peoples have different ways of singing. We think we might understand what they’re singing about. We might make a judgment if we hear another culture’s music and say, “That’s demonic,” or, “You could not praise God with that music.” But he was teaching us that we need to understand when we go into cultures their music systems. We can’t just go in and say, “No, you have to sing it this way.”</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Mary</h5> <p>And to follow up on that is the focus of outsider-insider, an outsider trying to understand from the insiders, “What does this mean to you? What is the content?” because as outsiders, we can really miss it and not understand what’s actually being expressed. So we have terms. We say etic and emic, outsider/insider perspectives, that we talk about in our courses and our learning.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p>Help us to see what this looks like a little bit more concretely. What countries, what groups are you representing, and what kinds of instruments are you playing?</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Paul</h5> <p>Well, I’m playing about 3 or 4 instruments here. One is a charango from Bolivia, which I bought on the River Walk in San Antonio from a real live player. I’m also playing a Moroccan oud, which we use for other instruments as well. We don’t carry 50 instruments, we carry about 10. And I’m playing a Greek bouzouki, but I’m using that to represent music from other parts of the world as well if the instrument sounds similar to the sounds. So again, we’re approximating all these. We’re never being exactly authentic. We are just Americans. We’re not trying to pretend that we’re something else. But we love the sounds of the world and the praises that they lift up. So we want to approximate those sounds so that you will learn to appreciate their music. As for the countries that we actually sing songs from, we could give a list if you’d like.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Cory</h5> <p>We do some from South America, so there’s Brazil, Venezuela, Bolivia…Ghana, Democratic Republic of Congo…</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Cathy</h5> <p>Nigeria…</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Cory</h5> <p>Egypt…</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Paul</h5> <p>Tunisia, Papua New Guinea, Bhutan, South Korea…We don’t have a Japanese song yet.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p>Okay, well, we’ll have to fix that.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Paul</h5> <p>Exactly! We’re working on it.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p>So tell me more about why you do this. What is your purpose in singing these different styles—using different instruments, different languages, representing different countries?</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Paul</h5> <p>Well, for myself, and I think for my wife as well, we were worship leaders in a local church and trying to find the most relevant ways to help people worship in our culture. It was mostly not a mixed culture. It was mostly just a normal American church in Texas, but still we had to wrestle with contemporary versus older styles and who was there and what kind of music they liked. In the South it’s a little more Baptist hymnal kind of songs, which I wasn’t that familiar with. So you always have to learn and find out from the congregation that you’re worshiping with, what helps them express their heart, because that’s really what a worship leader is trying to do, just help the people worship from their heart. So that was where we started, and when we ran into Tom and he was doing that in the jungles of Brazil, it sounded radically different, of course. So we learned from him how to approximate that sound so that we could present it.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Cathy</h5> <p>So the first time we performed this kind of music, we thought we were just going to give people an educational experience and say, this is what your brothers and sisters sound like over in Africa, or this is what they say to God in their songs. The people that heard us in Memphis, Tennessee, on that very first trip were crying. They said, “This is a kind of worship that we’ve never experienced before.” It wasn’t necessarily something they could participate in, but it was like when you look up at the stars and go, “Wow, God, that’s amazing.” And you get a glimpse of the worship that God is preparing for himself across the world. And it does increase your love for your brothers and sisters. So we wanted to give more people that kind of understanding and that kind of love for brothers and sisters that they’ve never met, maybe an experience that would have them want to pray for those brothers and sisters. And so when we go to a mission conference, we hope, too, that it opens people’s eyes to understand that we want to encourage authentic ethnic worship and not just press our Western songs onto others.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Mary</h5> <p>I was just going to say one word, beauty. Well, I’ll say a few more words than just that. We have a colleague who decades ago said, why would God have created birds that only sing one song? And so we think about the diversity of artistic communication and think about the beauty of how we can all be different and have different artistic expression, but that it can be unified in the worship of our Creator, and to learn to appreciate that, but also know that it’s perfectly great to have those styles and songs and ways that you can sing and worship that come really from a deep place in your heart. So, we want to get into what that is in each culture to lead people to that place of beauty.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Paul</h5> <p>It makes me think also the necessity that we feel of presenting things with authentic instrumentation as much as possible and with some costuming. It’s not like we’re not trying to appropriate someone else’s culture. We’re trying to represent so that you will have a deeper appreciation of those—the beauty, not just the sound, but the beauty of those cultures in their expression of worship.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p>I’m glad you all are talking about this because that was one of my next questions is like, why is this important? You know, when I first came to Japan, the first thing that people wanted me and my wife to do is, as musicians, help with worship. And there’s basically two choices you can do. Contemporary or you can do traditional. One or the other. If you play organ and piano, well that’s traditional. If you use the guitar, well then that’s going to be contemporary. Those are the only two choices, so choose. If you go back and forth between the two, then that’s blended, a little of both. So to hear what you all do is so far outside people’s expectations of what worship can be. And that message, I feel, is especially needed in Japan.</p> <p>I would love Mori-Sensei to comment on that. Have you heard anything like this in Japan, this group?</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Mori</h5> <p>No. That’s it.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p>And is it important then for Japan?</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Mori</h5> <p>Absolutely. Japanese people like to feel safe, I guess, and don’t want to be criticized. Therefore, they try to conform to whatever is the mainstream, whether it’s a small group of 3, 4, 5 or a bigger group of 50–100. But that’s what I sense, and that’s what I find in myself from the past. So, especially when you think about the Christian church. The gospel was brought by typically Caucasian Western missionaries, and I don’t think they had any other way than to just do what they were used to. And without being intentional, I believe a kind of very clear line between Christians and non-Christian Japanese was drawn. When I was a teenager and a church member, the pastor said secular songs shouldn’t be sung, not even for yourself when you’re alone. So there was a very clear line, and I think in every church it was the same. And if you dare to play jazz or, rock was not so much in Japan in those days, then you were looked at as unspiritual, not a good Christian. So naturally, for those reasons, the Japanese ethnic or original music was separated from the church.</p> <p>It is still very much the same, I think. Therefore, it’s very difficult to take different styles of music and even ethnic music into the church. We don’t have any group like IziBongo. I don’t know if any other countries do either, but it is great riches brought to the church.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p>You know, when I first came to Japan, I was in language school that first year. We made friends with a clarinetist, and she was feeling turmoil about being in the church because the church told her she couldn’t play. She was a professional clarinet player, but they would not allow her to play clarinet in church because that was not appropriate for Christian worship. But, they said, you can play the piano because we need someone to play the piano. She was like, but I’m not a keyboardist and don’t play the piano very well, and it was hard for her to worship while playing the piano. When we came in, they asked us as missionaries to come give a concert, and we invited her to join us. There were tears in her eyes because that was the first time anyone in the church had ever heard her play the clarinet, which was her heart language. And I was like, wow, well, maybe it’s just this church.</p> <p>Well, then we went and were helping to plant another church out in Chiba, where we met a pastor whose son played the saxophone. And it was the same story. He invited his son to play saxophone once in worship, and the church members got so upset. Saxophone is not appropriate for worship, they said. It sounds worldly. It sounds like jazz, you know. And we’ve come across stories like that over and over again.</p> <p>And I want to tell you one more. Sorry I’m talking so much! But there’s this other story when we met this koto player. She was featured in one of our videos during the conference. I think I’ve shared this in a past podcast episode, but we invited her to come and play koto in worship. That’s a traditional Japanese harp, and it was so beautiful. We loved it, but there were so many people upset afterwards. And there were so many meetings afterwards, not the kind of meetings that you really want to have happen, you know, like with the pastor and the elders. Okay, this person’s upset, and they felt like it was connecting to the non-Christian culture in Japan. They said, “You can’t use the koto in worship. You were distracting me from worship. I was not able to worship God because you had the koto there.”</p> <p>And, you know, the way—I’ve shared this with some of you before—the way that we were able to bring healing to that situation is when they realized how she was able to worship God through her heart language, through the koto, it drew them in and they were able to worship God by seeing how she was worshiping God. It wasn’t a gimmick, you know, it wasn’t like we’re trying to force something on the church, but that this is how she worshiped, and they were able to worship through her. It was that relational key that made all the difference.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Mori</h5> <p>Um, can I ask you a question?</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p>Sure.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Mori</h5> <p>That was your experience in the beginning. Is that still very much the same in the Japanese churches?</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p>I do sometimes continue to hear stories, yeah…</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Mori</h5> <p>This is my subjective, biased opinion, but around 20 years ago, God raised a young man and gave him song after song. An authentic Japanese young man, producing Japanese praise songs, worship songs, and they did some gatherings using yukatas and guitars on the stage, dancing and singing. And those worship songs created by those people, they have quite rapidly spread all across Japan.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p>Oh, wow. I’d like to hear them.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Mori</h5> <p>Yes. Oh, you know him. Taka. His songs, I believe, have changed the atmosphere of Japanese churches. Nagasawa Takafumi wrote that famous song, “Sono Hi Zen Sekai Ga” (“On That Day”). He started out as a worship leader in his father’s church. Now, he’s the senior pastor. But he was invited as a worship leader to a church in a different place, totally different place, and the pastor, as the congregation sang that song, proudly said to Taka, “Don’t you think this is an awesome song?” He didn’t know that Taka wrote that song, and Taka did not tell him. But today, more instruments are naturally taken into church services. Different styles are tolerated. Not every church, but, by and large, so many churches are resembling Western American churches, worship band in front and leading songs with guitars and drums and bass guitars and keyboard. And it’s spreading. And I just think that change has been happening. But still though, not Japanese authentic instruments or styles.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p>Yeah, that’s still pretty rare.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Mori</h5> <p>Yeah, because of the schism that happened, right in the beginning, the Christians somehow feel that those instruments are not theirs. And to me, that’s okay if Christians don’t play any koto or shakuhachi. Of course, they’re greatly considered by Christians to be a special genre of instrument.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p>Generally. Yeah, Cathy?</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Cathy</h5> <p>That’s one thing that seems to happen when we play. We had an experience in Singapore. A Japanese gal came up and talked to me afterwards and said, “This makes me want to go home and find what is unique from my culture that I can offer to God. It makes me want to go home and find or make something unique from my culture. And so, I think that IziBongo sometimes has that effect when we show what other cultures are doing.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p>Yeah, I also wanted to ask you all, I know that like sometimes I hear this word “appropriation” in the States, because you are not from those cultures, because you are Americans doing that music. If someone was to come at you and say, “Hey, that’s not appropriate for you to be doing that,” how would you respond to them?</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Paul</h5> <p>Well, it depends who it’s coming from, I think, is where we start. We have never had anyone come to us from those nations with a problem with us. In fact, all we’ve ever heard is appreciation that we at least attempted to sing in their language. And again, we don’t do it perfectly. We had one experience up at Prairie Bible College where we played a First Nations song, a Native American song, and there was one young gentleman there who was a young man from the First Nations, and he was so excited. He wanted to sing the song. It was very simple, so he wanted to lead it. It was so amazing to him that he could do that. And almost immediately, we got strong pushback from a missionary couple who’d been there for 30 years working with First Nations peoples who felt like that was very inappropriate for the church. So let me say it this way: What we do is not try to impose on the church what you should do. What we’re doing is saying praise is happening all over the world, not always on Sunday morning. In fact, most of this wouldn’t be in Sunday morning worship, but it’s worship. Some of it’s on the streets of Brazil, a samba. And it was a Christian song sung on the streets of Carnaval. I mean, that’s not Sunday morning. So again, what we’re presenting is just the various expressions of praise. Whether they fit on Sunday morning in the church, your pastor and your worship leaders need to work that out. And we shouldn’t be judging them. They’re the ones who are to guide and guard the flock. So pray for your pastors that they might have vision even when they have reservations.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Cathy</h5> <p>I would say it’s also not only praise, but Scripture memory songs, storytelling, telling of Bible stories, and historical things. So there are other ways to use the music.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Cory</h5> <p>And the use of the music that we do when we perform are based on relationships that we have with the communities themselves, either through a Bible translation project or actual one-on-one. So, we have gotten permission to do these songs according to the communities that we’ve come in contact with.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Mary</h5> <p>And I’ll say that coming back to the U.S. from West Africa and starting to hear this word appropriation, I was a little bit shocked because I was like, oh, what does that mean? You know, I had to say, what does that actually mean? Because to be in West Africa or in that particular culture, you dress with the cloth and you learn their songs and they are thrilled that you are learning their language and wearing their clothes. So appropriation is not about using these things for our own benefit, but it’s about lifting up and respecting that culture.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p>We are almost out of time, but I want to give Mori Sensei the last word. So, think about what you’re going to say. Let me just say that I’ve been moved by talking with all of you, you know, outside this interview, the stories you’ve told me about how people respond saying, wow, I had no idea I could worship God in that way through my culture, through my art, and how it’s encouraging them, empowering them really. You are empowering the nations to say, God has given you these gifts to worship him, and it’s just such an important message. Thank you so much for the time and money you’ve spent to come all the way to Japan to share this with us. We really appreciate it. Mori Sensei, do you have any final comments?</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Mori</h5> <p>Well, thank you very much. I’m so honored. Change is happening in the Japanese churches. It’s not only negative. In one church, 45 minutes away from Tokyo, they started using enka. Enka is very secular, many love songs. They were the songs church members’ husbands especially loved. So they invited the husbands and did a couples’ night. They served beer and they sang enka. And the people loved it. Actually, the wives loved it too. So, some changes are happening. Also, Japanese instruments—koto, shakuhachi, shamisen—are not widely used in the churches. I think that’s because nowadays Japanese people have grown up without those instruments nearby. But those who have, they should be invited to the churches to perform and make them feel at home. Still, the Japanese churches are very much under the control of pastors. So these gatherings would be excellent for the Japanese pastors to know and come attend, listen to, hear the stories. That’s probably the challenge for the near future.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p>Thank you. Thank you so much, all of you. I really appreciate it. God bless you.</p> <p>You’ve been listening to the Art Life Faith Podcast. To watch the video of this podcast or many other videos from the conference, please go to our website: www.communityarts.jp. As we say in Japan, “Ja, mata ne.” We’ll see you next time.</p></p>
May 13, 2026
Justice x Beauty
<div class="wp-block-image"> <figure class="aligncenter size-large"><a href="https://www.amazon.com/dp/1587436469/" target="_blank" rel=" noreferrer noopener"><img fetchpriority="high" decoding="async" width="1024" height="575" src="https://www.rogerwlowther.com/wp-content/uploads/2026/05/CAT-Beauty-x-Justice-middle-1024x575.png" alt="" class="wp-image-8845" srcset="https://www.rogerwlowther.com/wp-content/uploads/2026/05/CAT-Beauty-x-Justice-middle-1024x575.png 1024w, https://www.rogerwlowther.com/wp-content/uploads/2026/05/CAT-Beauty-x-Justice-middle-300x168.png 300w, https://www.rogerwlowther.com/wp-content/uploads/2026/05/CAT-Beauty-x-Justice-middle-768x431.png 768w, https://www.rogerwlowther.com/wp-content/uploads/2026/05/CAT-Beauty-x-Justice-middle-1536x862.png 1536w, https://www.rogerwlowther.com/wp-content/uploads/2026/05/CAT-Beauty-x-Justice-middle-2048x1150.png 2048w, https://www.rogerwlowther.com/wp-content/uploads/2026/05/CAT-Beauty-x-Justice-middle-200x112.png 200w, https://www.rogerwlowther.com/wp-content/uploads/2026/05/CAT-Beauty-x-Justice-middle-800x449.png 800w, https://www.rogerwlowther.com/wp-content/uploads/2026/05/CAT-Beauty-x-Justice-middle-713x400.png 713w, https://www.rogerwlowther.com/wp-content/uploads/2026/05/CAT-Beauty-x-Justice-middle-1568x880.png 1568w" sizes="(max-width: 1024px) 100vw, 1024px" /></a></figure> </div> <p>Next week, May 22-27, 2026, is our worship and arts conference <strong><a href="https://www.communityarts.jp/jcamm">“The Beauty of Japan・The Beauty of Heaven”</a></strong>. This five-day event is the biggest we have ever put on. Hundreds will join us here in downtown Tokyo with easy access to all the beautiful art and culture of our city. We will have over 30 presenters with short talks, testimonies, music, films, discussions, networking, prayer walks and activities around the city, an art gallery, and so much more. In this event, we celebrate all the nations being united across different languages and cultures to worship God together, and the taste of that we are receiving even now here in Japan.</p> <p>Even if you can’t be here, please pray for us, that God would do a mighty work here, leading people in worship, growing his kingdom, and building deeper connections between churches and ministries.</p> <hr class="wp-block-separator has-alpha-channel-opacity"/> <p>Welcome to the Art, Life, Faith Podcast, and I’m your host, Roger Lowther.</p> <p>This episode, I had the honor of sitting down with Haijin and Makoto Fujimura to celebrate the launch of their new book, <strong><a href="https://www.amazon.com/dp/1587436469/">“Beauty and Justice: Creating A Life of Abundance and Courage”</a></strong>. Haijin is the founder and managing partner of Shim & Associates Law Firm. She is also the founder of Embers International, developing the programs and partnerships to protect, restore, and empower the victims of injustice.</p> <p>Mako is well-known as an artist, writer, and speaker, who has also had a big influence on my life and on the ministries of Community Arts Tokyo. Mako was kind enough to sit down with me after the 2011 earthquake, tsunami, and nuclear disaster here in Japan, and listen to my heart, and suggest that I start this arts organization. So he is not only a long-time friend of this ministry, but one of the people who help it to get started in the first place.</p> <p>In this conversation, she and Mako urge us to not lose sight of the new creation, where the pursuit of beauty is an important part of true restoration, that working for justice is a working toward that perfect shalom that God has promised to bring into the world.</p> <p>After my conversation with Haijin and Mako, they led one of our Art, Life, Faith events for us. So many people came from outside our usual networks, and all of us there received new inspiration to go out into the city and make a difference, to make the vision presented in the talk a reality in our communities. This combination of justice and beauty is so important, and if you want to know more about it you can read their book and watch the event we recorded, which is now on YouTube.</p> <p>Now, here’s our conversation.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p>I’m sitting here with Haejin and Mako Fujimura for an event we’re doing tonight celebrating the release of their new book, Beauty x Justice. Thank you both for being here and being willing to talk with me.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Mako</h5> <p>Absolutely, excited to be here.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Haejin</h5> <p>Thank you for having us.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p>So, this topic is really interesting to me. This is the Art, Life, Faith Podcast. We believe that art isn’t just something that’s meant to be decorative or something if you have time to do, but it really affects every part of our lives and can change societies and people. And so to be able to talk about justice and what that looks like, I think is really fascinating. Can you tell us a little bit about this book?</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Haejin</h5> <p>This book is a result of Mako bugging me for months to do something that I wanted to do but was kind of putting aside. So I’m really glad that he encouraged me to write this book together. This book shares with the world what it means to understand beauty in the context of justice and vice versa, because we believe that beauty and justice are essentially two sides of the same coin. Of the Gospel. We need both beauty and justice, not as parallels but as an integrated whole, to have the kind of shalom that God intended us to have from the very beginning that we have lost.</p> <p>Thankfully, God not only gave us beauty, but God is beauty. God not only commanded every single one of us to seek justice, not just to lawyers or advocates, but he himself is also justice, right? So when we think about beauty and justice coming together, we kind of wanted to share a little bit about our life as a married couple, because essentially all my life, even way before I met Mako, or before we wrote this book together.</p> <p>I have been working through justice to pursue beauty, and Mako has all his life, as just an incredibly anointed artist, been pursuing justice. And when we got together, we were able to really name it, and we started to share that message with other people in the context of exhibitions, speaking engagements, team-building occasions. And then we really felt like we needed to share this with a wider public. So that’s when we decided to write this book.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p>Yeah, it’s great. I feel like in some ways justice doesn’t have a very good image right now, just for various reasons. I guess I had forgotten how many times justice comes up in the Old Testament, and it’s always with this good image. God isn’t just just, but through it he gives a picture of shalom and what we are all really yearning for, right?</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Haejin</h5> <p>Yeah, absolutely.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Mako</h5> <p>Yeah, justice is beautiful when it is fully manifested, and that’s always been God’s vision for the world. And yet we have created this tainted version of, or at least a version that we do not know the definition of what justice is. We talk about it all the time, but if you pursue asking the deeper question of what do you think justice is, not many people can answer it. We all know when something is lacking, you know, when we know justice is needed. But one of the things that I discovered in our journey together is that I have been speaking about beauty for all my life, it seems. I’ve written several books on it and have tried to help people understand why beauty is needed and essential for our lives. As an artist, as you noted, Roger, that many times the reaction that I get, well, that’s a nice thing to do, you know, when you have extra money or space and time. But especially for the church, it’s very hard to have a conversation where it is assumed that beauty is fundamentally not only necessary, but it is the most important characteristic of God’s presence in our lives.</p> <p>So it’s just a constant battle to help people understand that what I call utilitarian pragmatism has taken over all of our lives, not just the church, but our cultures. We tend to reduce the complexity of reality into simple false binaries so we can have a so-called understanding of it and have to take a position on it and create culture war-like rhetoric. And all of that comes out of this very simple premise that if God is beauty, and if God is love, then all things should flow out of that reality, including the church, including what we call the gospel, the good news, has to be filled with the abundance and extravagance of God’s love, has to feel like this is too good to be true. We will experience something that is so out of box, and extraordinary that we don’t have words to explain what that is. It just happens that when you experience true justice, not just restoration, you know, not just somebody who has been jailed wrongly is able to be released — that’s the first step in seeking justice — but when that person who has been trapped in whatever the circumstances because of injustice is able to see themselves as beautiful, that’s when the restoration of the whole person becomes real, not just that person but the whole community.</p> <p>And when you see that at work through Haejin’s work with Embers International, which she co-founded many years ago, we get to see actual examples of somebody who has gone through this very difficult process of restoration, and in their being, they hold this godly presence of beauty and justice together. And that’s when I, as an artist, I point to that reality and say, there is beauty here that I have been longing for as an artist to create, manifest into my work. And I continue to do that, but it really is that radical and that simple.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p>I was thinking about how you’re saying that people realizing what is justice for them, to realize their own beauty and to be able to see it. Mako, I think I’ve heard you say before how beauty can help us, artwork can help us kind of see, not just see, but experience the world in new ways. Like, I was thinking of To Kill a Mockingbird, to be able to go in someone else’s skin and walk around it for a little while.</p> <p>For example, in December I was giving a bunch of organ concerts around Japan. That usually happens at Christmas time, right? One of the pieces I was playing is one of my favorites by Maurice Durufle, a late French Romantic composer, called “Come, Creator Spirit.” And in it, in the middle of the work, there is this incredible dissonance and brokenness that just — it breaks your heart. And yet that isn’t the end. It starts with creation and gets to this breaking, and then he brings us beyond it to a hope, to a life where things can be glorious and rejoicing. And every time I play it — it’s a 20-minute piece, it’s a pretty long piece— to be able to celebrate what God is doing, it’s like I’m experiencing again and again through the artwork this truth. And so in a way, I think that’s like what you’re talking about.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Haejin</h5> <p>I think we forget to ask the question, what is the essence of all things, right? So what’s the essence of creating arts? What is the essence of justice? What is the essence of humanity? I don’t know about you guys, but I don’t think I was ever asked to think about the essence of things. It’s more of what is the quote-unquote the definition of it, what is going on, what is it, rather than what is the essence behind what we can just comprehend and observe on the surface. Because it’s a really hard question. You have to be willing to slow down to answer this question, right? You have to be willing to admit that we come with a lot of assumptions and biases. Otherwise, we cannot really get to the essence of things. So I think that, of course the industrialization, the pragmatism and individualism and all of those kind of things that in and of itself are not bad, but has kind of trained humanity to seek what is easy. Because we also have deep down in our hearts the lust for certainty, because uncertainty is so uncomfortable and it feels so risky and dangerous. But to think about the essence of beauty, arts, and justice and humanity, you have to be willing to be on the edge of the uncertainty and face the reality that there are things that we can’t quite comprehend. So, for example, we cannot comprehend God, right? If somebody says, I understand God, probably very little, if at all.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p>Exactly.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Haejin</h5> <p>But then we also know that God exists and God is love. We understand to a certain extent, and we get to experience the glimpses of his essence through beauty, especially through beautiful relationships when justice is in play. But I think we have to be willing, and especially the body of Christ, to be willing to really long for that essence of things.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p>Yeah, I think it helps too, that vision that you’re giving, that we can’t give up talking about it because we forget exactly what we’re searching for, what we’re yearning for. The image of what justice is can be so shaped by the news and the comfort of our situation in our part of the world, whatever it is. But to be able to keep giving people a vision for, like you do in the book, for the new creation. This is what we’re working toward and how to help people see it just coming out from a lot of different angles. It was really helpful.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Mako</h5> <p>Art and music has a capacity to do exactly that, to invoke this vista that most people have forgotten to look up to. And because we are so stressed and traumatized sometimes by realities of brokenness around us and within us, that we no longer actually lose the capacity to use our senses to listen well or to see something that is so beautiful that it’s mind-boggling and complex. And yet it is utterly needed for not just to seek the beauty, but to understand that as a standard of who we are as human beings is not built for this world in the sense that we get locked into our presuppositions and we get locked into what the media tells us. So we get locked into what the digital framework defines as reality. Our senses are such amazing instruments. When we behold something or when we truly do the hard work of deep listening, something happens where our brain rewires itself to regain that understanding of love at the heart of all complexities and chaos. And just like you mentioned in this music that you played, there’s this great tension in all beauty, and you can really try to find an answer that clarifies, or very much be certain that, you know, this is it, this is the good news of the Gospel, I want to give it to you, which is a fine notion, except that the mystery of the gospel, what Paul talks about, the mysterion, you know, the mystery of the gospel is far bigger than we think it is.</p> <p>And the more you understand it, the less you understand, but the more you understand it, the more that you are in awe of God’s presence. And art can give us that experience. So it doesn’t necessarily have to be Christian art because all human beings are created in the image of God, and however fallen we are, we have evidences throughout history of people who are horrible human beings, but they created amazing art that we can see, and as a viewer, we can glorify God with. So that kind of reality has always been part of human experience. And by the way, the church was the greatest patron to create this. And yet we have in recent times, because of pragmatic, utility and efficiency and industrial way that we began to measure what is good and successful, we lost sight of the transcendence and mystery of what human beings are capable of.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p>Thank you for reminding us of it in this book. We so need to keep hearing that message.</p> <p>I think we better stop there to get ready for the event tonight. But I am really looking forward to tonight. I’ve been getting a lot of emails. There’s going to be a lot of people here really looking forward to hearing what you have to say. So thank you so much for sharing this time with us.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Haejin</h5> <p>Thank you, Roger.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Mako</h5> <p>Thank you.</p> <h5 class="wp-block-heading">Roger</h5> <p>You’ve been listening to the Art, Life, Faith Podcast. You can continue the conversation by picking up your own copy of Beauty x Justice, available wherever you buy your books. As we say in Japan, “Ja, mata ne!” We’ll see you next time.</p>
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