Inside the $1.2 Trillion CLO Market | Shiloh Bates
Shiloh Bates is the Chief Investment Officer of Flat Rock Global, an alternative credit manager with about $1.6 billion in assets under management across three interval funds. Previously, he was a Managing Director at Benefit Street Partners and Head of Structured Products at BDCA Adviser. He is the author of CLO Investing and host of The CLO Investor Podcast.
We discuss how CLOs work, why CLO equity has disappointed over the last two years, how to compare CLO managers, why captive equity funds have hurt the market, what private credit CLOs do differently, and why he sees value in CLO equity and BB notes today.
Learn more about Shiloh and Flat Rock Global:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/shiloh-bates-186ab28/ (https://www.linkedin.com/in/shiloh-bates-186ab28/)https://flatrockglobal.com (https://flatrockglobal.com)
Read Shiloh's book, CLO Investing: With an Emphasis on CLO Equity & BB Notes:
https://www.amazon.com/CLO-Investing-Emphasis-Equity-Notes/dp/1642376566 (https://www.amazon.com/CLO-Investing-Emphasis-Equity-Notes/dp/1642376566)
Listen to The CLO Investor Podcast:
https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-clo-investor-podcast/id1738052032 (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-clo-investor-podcast/id1738052032)
Subscribe to Deepwell: https://deepwellco.substack.com (https://deepwellco.substack.com)
(00:00) Intro
(01:21) From political science to finance
(04:10) Learning CLOs on day one at First Union
(05:00) How a CLO works like a simplified bank
(07:43) When CLOs were a backwater
(09:11) Equity returns through leverage
(11:38) Why CLO equity has disappointed
(18:32) Six-month call protection, locked financing
(21:29) How to compare CLO managers
(29:02) How CLO equity gets marked daily
(33:00) The problem with captive equity funds
(38:11) What CLO ETFs mean for AAAs
(41:05) Why BDC and interval fund redemptions are rising
(45:32) Private credit CLOs vs broadly syndicated
(49:56) What he's watching into 2027
21 Sept 2026
How Families Govern, Allocate and Pass On Wealth | Stephan Roche, BanyanGlobal
Stephan Roche is the Managing Partner of BanyanGlobal Family Business Advisors, a Boston-based firm that has guided more than 250 family ownership groups across six continents on succession, governance and family office strategy since 2012.
Roche first worked with Banyan as a client, joined as a partner in 2025, and was elected Managing Partner in May 2026.
He previously served as CEO of Walton Enterprises, the Walton family office, and COO of Cascade Asset Management, the investment office for Bill Gates and the Gates Foundation.
As CEO of Sempervirens Fund, the venture firm that grew out of a family business whose board he sat on, he pushed the team to deliver cash rather than paper returns, reaching roughly 0.9x DPI on an eight-year-old vintage.
He began his career in brand management at Procter & Gamble and in strategy consulting, and holds a BA from Princeton and an MBA from Harvard Business School.
Learn more about Stephan and BanyanGlobal below:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/stephanroche/ (https://www.linkedin.com/in/stephanroche/)https://banyan.global/ (https://banyan.global/)
Subscribe to Deepwell: https://deepwellco.substack.com (https://deepwellco.substack.com)
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