Cloud Accounting promised to change the game for accountants, bookkeepers - but the majority of firms are still stuck, struggling to embrace change and adopt the tools the tools they've selected.
This podcast is all about helping saas vendors, accountants and bookkeepers to navigate the difficult process of change together, with tips and advice from some of the leaders in our space.
You Can Hand Off the Work. You Can't Hand Off Jail Time || Damon Anderson || Counting on Change
Learn the essential lessons from a 20-year career in the payments industry and tech sector. Get practical insights from Damon's journey.In this interview, Damon breaks down his professional trajectory, covering his time at major financial institutions like Amex, Visa, and WorldPay. Whether you are looking to navigate the complex payments industry or considering a transition into high-growth tech companies, this conversation offers a clear look at what it takes to succeed over two decades.We specifically look at his five-year tenure at Xero to understand how to maximise value during long-term roles. You will learn how to leverage your background to build a sustainable tech career and why strategic moves between companies like Visa and WorldPay shape long-term career growth. This discussion is tailored for professionals seeking actionable advice on managing their professional development in competitive fields.There is so much noise in accounting AI right now that most firms don't know where to start. Damon Anderson does.
He's an ex-Xero leader, former payments operator and author of the A to Z of Accounting Software, a report mapping 330+ companies across AI capability, modules and where they sit in the stack.
Read the report: https://atozaiaccounting.com/
Connect with Damon on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mrdamonanderson/
Counting on Change. Cloud accounting promised to change the game. Most firms are still stuck. This is the show about firms that don't want to be.
00:00 Introduction and Background
00:55 Challenges in Accounting Technology
02:53 Navigating AI in Accounting
05:46 The Role of AI in Research and Development
08:08 Accountability in AI Usage
09:36 Developing Frameworks for AI Tools
12:05 The Future of Accounting with AI
16:03 The Importance of Professional Oversight
17:16 Market Dynamics and Competitive Advantage
20:36 The Entrepreneurial Mindset in Accounting
24:28 Best Practices for Using AI Tools
27:23 Overview of the A to Z Report
28 Oct 2025
From Traditional Practice to SaaS Business: A New Model for Accounting? with Luke Farren
Is the "traditional" accounting firm still a viable model in 2025 and beyond? And what does its evolution mean for the entire Accounting Tech ecosystem?
This week, we're joined by Luke Farren, founder of The Modern Firm and a consultant who helps accounting practices navigate their own Digital Transformation. We explore the massive shift from people-heavy practices to lean, tech-first firms that operate more like SaaS businesses themselves.
We also debate the future of the profession, from data warehouses and AI in Accounting to whether AI bots create an "opportunity loss" by replacing the human touch.
Join us for a deep dive into the other side of the coin—understanding the accountant's world is the key to solving your own activation puzzle.
Follow Luke: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lukefarren/
The Modern Firm: https://modernfirm.co.uk/
Follow Counting on Change:
https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLF2J1WlIWLMywubuNZt2RFWZECtkF4cVi&si=FzQ37NC7AyqwurGW
https://www.linkedin.com/in/leighstallard/
Episode Chapters:
00:00 Coming Up...
00:53 Guest Introduction: Luke Farren's Journey (From in-practice to building a tech-first firm, getting acquired, and founding The Modern Firm).
02:28 The Evolution of Accounting Firms (The big idea: why firms are starting to operate and structure themselves more like SaaS businesses).
03:57 Impact of Technology on Accounting Practices (How tech is changing behaviour and why the pace of change is the real barrier, not the appetite for it).
05:54 Challenges and Opportunities for Firms (The #1 challenge for firms: well-structured data. Why it's a "garbage in, garbage out" problem for your tech).
09:11 Future Scenarios and Big Tech in Accounting *(Debating the future: will firms become "data warehouses"? Could Google or Amazon enter the accounting space?) * 14:14 AI and Automation in Accounting (The rise of AI agents for client queries and the "opportunity loss" of removing human interaction).
20:05 The Role of Accountants in a Tech-Driven World (Reframing automation: does it free up accountants to be proactive rather than reactive?)
22:40 Conclusion and Contact Information
25 Aug 2025
Can Dext's Playbook Save Your Tech Implementation?
Your activation rates are stalling and you're fighting churn. Before you blame the product, have you asked if your Customer Success team truly understands your customer's world?
What's the difference between a CSM who just manages an account and one who drives deep adoption and makes your product indispensable?
In this episode of Counting on Change, I talk to someone who has sat on both sides of the table: Katie Hawking, Head of Customer Success at Dext and a former accountant of 13 years. Katie shares an insider's perspective on building a world-class CS function that's built on deep industry empathy and a proactive approach to partner success.
✅ In this episode, we define what 'good' CSM looks like, including:
Why your CSMs must train the client's middle managers to prevent project failure and churn.
The critical difference between selling "practice benefits" and "client benefits"—and why your team must know it.
The leading indicators of churn (like low feature adoption) and how to spot them in the first 90 days.
A proven "workflow mapping" framework to unstick a stalled implementation and accelerate time-to-value.
How to build a scalable, one-to-many CS motion with webinars and on-demand content when one-to-one isn't possible.
This one’s especially useful for:
👉 SaaS Founders & CEOs defining their post-sale strategy to drive retention.
👉 GTM & Customer Success Leaders building and scaling effective, proactive teams.
👉 Onboarding & Implementation Specialists looking for new frameworks to increase activation.
👉 Sales Leaders who want to understand the customer journey post-sale to reduce churn.
👉Accountants and bookkeepers who aren't sure what to expect from post-sale support.
🔗 Connect with Katie: LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/in/katie-hawking-fmaat-baa6a071/
🔔 Subscribe for weekly episodes on SaaS onboarding, tech strategy, and client success.
Timestamps:
00:00 Coming Up
01:34 From Accountant to Head of CS: An Insider's Perspective
02:54 Why Your Customers Really Struggle with New Tech
04:52 The 'Middle Manager' Blind Spot in Your Onboarding Process
06:31 Defining 'Good' CSM: Key Implementation Strategies
10:44 Leading Indicators of Churn (And How to Track Them)
13:24 The Workflow Mapping Framework to Unstick Customers
18:42 Building a Scalable CS Motion (Even Without a Big Team)
23:16 Understanding the 'Why' Behind Customer Resistance to Change
25:31 How to Connect with Katie
9 Jun 2025
Miss This Step & Your Tech Implementation Might Fail Before it's Begun
Digital transformation consultant Bethanie Hawkins explores why accounting firms often fail at change initiatives, emphasizing workflow mapping and securing internal buy-in, in this interview episode.
26 May 2025
The Dubai Cloud Connection - Ayman Kaouri
Ayman Kaouri, former Xero EMEA strategy lead, discusses Dubai's rapid adoption of B2B SaaS tech in accounting, influenced by legislation and AI, in this interview.
12 May 2025
THE Standard for SaaS Customer Success - Aleisha Hales
Aleisha Hales, ex-Xero, explores the critical role of customer success and digital transformation in accounting, highlighting strategies for effective change management and vendor-firm collaboration in this interview.
5 May 2025
Transformation-as-a-Service (aka Digital Services)
Turning a challenge into a service line - how accountancy firms can take their digital transformation lessons and turn them into new service lines - and why this might be more crucial than you think.Ryan Pearcy shares his journey from a small firm to leading digital transformation teams, discussing the major hurdles firms face, the importance of AI, and the shift from compliance to assurance. The conversation covers the need for a strategic approach, the critical role of communities and collaboration, and the intrinsic link between internal and external digital initiatives. Learn what steps firms can take to stay ahead and why digital transformation is set to become the cornerstone of future success in accounting.00:00 Introduction to Digital Transformation00:02 Challenges in Implementing AI and Digital Transformation00:40 The Evolution of Compliance in Accounting00:58 Career Journey and Building Digital Transformation Departments03:47 The Art of Digital Transformation05:06 Balancing Risk and Growth in Digital Services07:49 The Future of AI in Accounting12:33 Steps for Firms to Embrace Digital Transformation20:38 The Importance of Collaboration and Niching24:27 Practical Steps to Start Digital Transformation26:15 Conclusion and Final Thoughts
28 Apr 2025
The AI Revolution in Accounting: Opportunities and Threats with Billie Mcloughlin
In this captivating episode, Billie Mcloughlin, an ACCA qualified accountant, looks into the explosive growth of artificial intelligence and its transformative impact on the accounting profession.
With 16 years of experience, Billie shares insights on how AI models are evolving at unprecedented rates, predicting that 90% of Google's code will be written by AI within the next year. She discusses the current state and future implications of AI in professional services, revealing how firms can stay ahead of the curve and mitigate potential threats.
Billie also emphasises the importance of a mindset shift and intentional action to harness AI's benefits effectively. Tune in to discover practical advice, the challenges and opportunities AI presents, and why missing the AI train now could leave you stranded.
00:00 Introduction to the AI Revolution
00:59 Meet Billie McLaughlin
01:41 The Rise of AI in Accounting
03:52 AI's Impact on Work Hours and Job Security
05:32 Training and Adapting to AI
06:33 The Future of Compliance and Advisory Services
08:36 Getting Ahead with AI: Practical Steps
11:52 The Rapid Evolution of AI
15:58 Cutting-Edge AI Applications in Firms
19:58 The Importance of Starting Early with AI
22:46 Career Opportunities and Specialisation in AI
27:16 Final Thoughts and Connecting with Billie
21 Apr 2025
Creating the Conditions for Change - Andy Collings
Counting on Change is the place to learn about how to embrace change and digital transformation in the accounting tech space.
This episode I'm speaking to Andy Collings, who has a strong background in getting tech into large and enterprise-level practices and businesses, and is currently driving rapid growth at Active Workpapers, where he's trying to disrupt one of the few very few processes in accounting firms that has largely remain untouched over the last three decades.
31 Mar 2025
What Accountants REALLY Want From Vendors (& Their Account Managers)
Join us as Stephen shares his experiences and lessons (sometimes painful ones) of dealing with Vendors.
Stephen and his firm Valued Accountancy are bone-fide early adopters - with a ‘fastest growing partner’ award at Xero’s first UK Xerocon in 2012 as proof. They’ve dealt with all manner of vendors and account managers from the best in the business to… well, not the best.
We discuss the importance of resisting that tempting urge to mass-apply solutions and how crucial clear communication with your team and vendors is.
00:00 Coming Up…
01:03 This week - Stephen Paul
02:58 Defining a vision for the firm
05:53 Getting the team behind the vision
09:00 Red flags with Vendors
13:43 Trust and honesty
19:43 How to manage your account manager
25:03 Being upfront with vendors
29:03 Top advice to young account managers
34:19 Who would play you in a film?
24 Mar 2025
AI - For better or worse - Phil Hobden
This episode - The Podfather Part 2.
Phil Hobden returns to share what's changed (and what hasn't) in the accounting tech space in the last 18 months.
Crucially, we discuss who will helped - and who will be hindered - by the coming wave of AI tools.
Should you be pushing on with AI tools, or would you be better served by working on your strategy or foundational tech?
Listen in to find out!
This podcast is powered by Nomad Video.
21 Nov 2023
The Secrets of Great Account Management - Darren Glanville
This episode - Darren Glanville
Darren was one of the very first people to start selling saas accounting software to clients. Since then he’s influenced a generation of tech-focused accounting and bookkeeping firms, countless account managers and has led successful sales teams in a number of roles.
Darren’s advice will be invaluable to saas account mangers, sales leaders - but also to accounting firms who engage with account managers. His advice will help set the bar for what should be expected from an account manager.
We cover:
🔸 Changes in over a decade of saas implementation
🔸 How to be a great account manager
🔸 Lessons that firms can learn
🔸 Selling beyond goods and services
6 Sept 2023
The Surprising Data On Accounting Tech Adoption - Ian Phillips
As Head of Sales at Xero UK, Ian Phillips has direct and indirect access to thousands of accounting and bookkeeping firms, so he knows a thing or two about tech adoption.
Ian is an incredibly thoughtful and observant guy, who absorbs data, combines it with his own anecdotal experience and grounded common sense - and churns out incredible insights.
So who better to sit down and discuss the hard data on UK accounting tech adoption.
We discuss:
🔸 Xero’s 2023 accounting and bookkeeping industry insights report
🔸 How mid and large firms are out-performing small and micro firms on adoption
🔸 Insights that challenge our understanding of tech adoption - built on a combined 20+ years experience in accounting tech
🔸 The experience that new entrants to the accounting profession are (sometimes) getting
Find Ian here:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/ian-phillips-303288b/ (https://www.linkedin.com/in/ian-phillips-303288b/)
https://twitter.com/Ipips101 (https://twitter.com/Ipips101)
Find the report here:
https://www.xero.com/content/dam/xero/pdfs/accounting-and-bookkeeping-industry-performance-report-2023.pdf (https://www.xero.com/content/dam/xero/pdfs/accounting-and-bookkeeping-industry-performance-report-2023.pdf)
29 Aug 2023
Where Vendors Get It Wrong - Phil Hobden
This episode - Phil Hobden.
Phil is highly regarded in the accounting tech space - having held influential roles at a number of companies - including Futrli, Capitalise and Wolters Kluwer.
He's also a regular speaker at industry events, a podcaster and co-founder of a vendor community.
We talk how firms challenges to adopt tech sometimes lie outside of the firms walls. We cover:
🔸 Being honest about what vendors are really after
🔸 What accountants and bookkeepers should look for in a vendor
🔸 Solving problems not symptoms
🔸 3 pillars of great partnership
15 Aug 2023
Leading Through Change - Heather Elkington
This episode - Heather Elkington
Strong, effective leadership is pivotal to effective change, so we discussed some of the fundamental tactics to:
🔸 Jolt the business out of inaction
🔸 Get the team to step up take initiative
🔸 Getting out of your own way
And lots more.
Heather is quickly emerging as a go-to expert on leadership in the accounting tech space - so this episode is packed full of actionable insights to help you get your team and business moving in the direction you want it to go.
How to find Heather:
inthemakingleadership.substack.com
https://www.linkedin.com/in/heather-elkington/
https://www.tiktok.com/@leadershipheather
https://www.instagram.com/leadershipheather/
8 Aug 2023
The Future of Advisor / Vendor Partnerships - Rishi Ruparelia
This episode - Rishi Ruparelia.
Rishi Ruparelia (https://www.linkedin.com/in/ACoAAAlX7vsBDG4i9J12DUIfyoTzQAReIyfi4tM) - possibly the UK's most loved account manager - discusses his view on these things in the return of Counting on Change - plus:
🔸 Lifting the curtain on vendors' priorities
🔸 Lessons learn from successful firms
🔸 Just offer the blue pill? Or blue, green, pink and... earthy green.
1 Aug 2023
Make Leaders Choose - Ket Patel
This episode - Ket Patel.
Ket Patel is a change manager with a vast amount of experience.
We talk about the change management lessons that accountants can learn, to make their digital transformation efforts run more smoothly.
We look at:
- Getting change started in your organisation
- Does your project need change management?
- Whether line managers should push back more
Ket has spend more than 12 years leading change and transformation within the Finance, Tech and Consulting Industries. He’s a volunteer and former co-lead of the Change Management Institute’s UK Chapter and some of Ket’s clients include EY, The Home Office, International Coaching Federation and Cecil Housing Trust.
1 Aug 2023
How to Avoid a Tech Splat - Tony Stevenson
This episode - Tony Stevenson
"We wanted a Tech Stack, but we ended up with a Tech Splat"
Tony Stevenson FCA is a man who knows his way around the sharp end of tech adoption in accounting firms...
Having worked with over 1,000 firms, Tony has a *boatload* of experience, lessons and more than one or two funny stories to share.
It was great to catch up with him to learn:
- what mistakes firms are making
- what make a great cloud champion and
- what's changed in the years leading up to his current role as Digital Enablement Manager at FreeAgent
There's amazing value here for firms who're struggling their way through #digitaltransformation.
1 Aug 2023
What Makes A Great Cloud Champion? - Emily Deakin
This episode - Emily Deakin
The Cloud Champion is a critical role in Digital Transformation, but the question is "What Makes a Great Cloud Champion?"
🧠 What the best personality type is for a Cloud Champion?
✨ How to develop and offer incredible client experiences?
👩🏻🏫 How to engage the rest of the team for effective training?
Recently I caught up with Emily Deakin who is the #Cloud Accounts Specialist at Moore Growth Accountants to go over some of these themes.
Emily also shared some great advice for Cloud Champions OR Practice leaders looking to hire for a #CloudChampion role.
Who has been a guest on Counting on Change
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Bethanie Hawkins
Ayman Kaouri
Aleisha Hales
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Podcast Authority Score: 45 / 100
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