Foundations & Functions

About Foundations & Functions

Dr. Amich and Dr. Pabla explore their philosophy on treating the root cause of illness. When looking for answers to your health problems, it can feel as if you're on your own. Your health and happiness are our top priorities. We're here to help you identify the source of your problems and get you back on track to feeling healthier and happier. Functional medicine, IV infusions, and functional aesthetics are just some of the methods we utilize to get to the bottom of your health issues and help you get back to feeling your best. Each week we dedicate a podcast to your health! Disclaimer: The information provided in this podcast is for educational and informational purposes only and is not intended as medical advice. The content is not a substitute for professional medical care, diagnosis, or treatment. Always seek the advice of a qualified healthcare provider with any questions you may have regarding a medical condition. If you would like more detailed medical information, please contact Integrative Medicine through their website at https://integrativemla.com/

Publisher

Integrative Medicine

Category

health & fitness · health & fitness

Language

en

Explicit

No

First episode

2 Apr 2025

Latest episode

17 Aug 2026

Latest episodes

10 episodes in the feed.

1. 

   17 Aug 2026

   Health at the Core with Dr. Amich

   Show Description What if your fatigue, poor sleep, digestive issues, brain fog, changing hormones, inflammation and metabolic health aren't separate problems—but pieces of the same story? In this episode of Foundations and Function, Dr. Amich explores why persistent symptoms can leave patients feeling fragmented as they move from one specialist to another, and how looking at the whole person can reveal important connections. Dr. Amich discusses some of today's biggest health and wellness topics, including gut health and the microbiome, cortisol and stress, nervous system regulation, insulin resistance, GLP-1 medications and peptides, hormone imbalances, menopause, sleep optimization, chronic fatigue, inflammation and longevity. It's a conversation about looking beyond individual symptoms to better understand the foundations of your health—and how those foundations function together. Show Disclaimer The information provided in this podcast is for educational and informational purposes only and is not intended as medical advice. The content is not a substitute for professional medical care, diagnosis, or treatment. Always seek the advice of a qualified healthcare provider with any questions you may have regarding a medical condition. If you would like more detailed medical information, please contact Integrative Medicine through their website at https://integrativemla.com/ Show Transcript 00:00:00,100 --> 00:00:32,700 [Speaker 0] [instrumental music] Welcome to Foundations and Functions Weekly Podcast, where we return to when medicine actually made you better. The information provided in this podcast is for educational and information purposes only and is not intended as medical advice. The content is not a substitute for professional medical care, diagnosis, or treatment. Always seek the advice of a qualified healthcare provider with any questions you may have regarding a medical condition. Today's episode features Dr. Jason Amick. 00:00:32,700 --> 00:01:46,400 [Speaker 1] [instrumental music] Hello, and welcome to Foundations and Function. This is Dr. Amick, and I'd like to thank you for spending time with me today. I'm gonna tease a little bit here and share with you that there are some exciting changes coming to our practice, so stay tuned for that. I wanna start with a question, what if it's all connected? I mean, modern medicine is excellent at identifying and treating many diseases, but people with several persistent symptoms can still feel fragmented. You see one provider for sleep, another for digestion, another for hormones. What those symptoms may share when we examine all the things about you as a person, your history, your lifestyle, the environment that you live and work in every day, and your own personal physiology, it's all one connected story to us. Look, current wellness coverage and online conversations seem to be centering around some major themes. For example, gut health and the gut microbiome, cortisol and stress symptoms, nervous system regulation, inflammation, metabolic health, insulin resistance, continuous glucose monitors, GLP-one medications and peptides, hormone imbalances and menopause, 00:01:47,560 --> 00:02:40,820 [Speaker 1] sleep optimization, sleep studies, sleep apnea. Longevity and health span are important topics that are out there right now. And, and I wanna kind of clarify that. What we think about when we hear the word health span is really how to live longer, healthier, how to go a longer period of time and longer into your life without serious disability. Other topics that we know that are out there and talked about quite a bit include brain fog, chronic fatigue. How about supplement overload, huh? Look, the question here becomes, you know, which specialist owns the whole story? I mean, imagine that you're exhausted. Your sleep is unpredictable. Your digestion is changing. You have bloating. Maybe you wax and wane between diarrhea, constipation. Maybe your skin's breaking out. Hey, maybe your blood pressure is creeping up a little bit. 00:02:42,060 --> 00:05:34,940 [Speaker 1] You may see one provider for your stomach. You might see another for your skin, another for your sleep, and perhaps someone else for your blood pressure. Each visit may be appropriate, and they're important, and each provider may be doing exactly what they were trained to do. But who's asking whether any of these symptoms belong to the same story? That's the question I wanted to start with today. I wanna be clear. Connected doesn't necessarily mean that one hidden condition explains everything. It means we should be willing to examine the relationships before treating every symptom as an isolated event. Your body is connected. Your physiology is connected. And so that's how we should approach any condition or any concern that you have. People are searching for information about things like cortisol, inflammation, gut health, hormone balance, insulin resistance, sleep medicine, and longevity. The interest is real, but the information is often quite confusing. People turn to readily accessible information. They look at search engines. They look to AI. They even look to social media. And what they hear typically on social media platforms are, uh, typically explanations that are singular in nature. "Well, it's your cortisol," you might hear. "Oh, it's just your gut." "Oh, everything-- it's all inflammation-related." Or they might hear, "It's hormonal." How about this? "You need a detox." Or more often, "You need supplements. In fact, you should buy my specific brand of tonic or secret sauce," right? [laughs] The answer is not to replace one silo with another. We don't wanna blame everything on the gut any more than we wanna assume the gut has nothing to do with the rest of the body. Our approach is to look at how a person's symptoms, medical history, nutrition, sleep, stress, medications, environment, and daily habits can all interact. It asks not only what diagnosis fits, but also what factors may be contributing, maintaining, or aggravating your problem. Because look, the whole timeline matters. When did the symptoms begin? What changed beforehand? Systems interact. We know that. Sleep can influence appetite, blood pressure, mood, pain. Digestive problems can affect nutrition and even medication tolerance. The same symptom can have different causes. 2 people with fatigue may need completely different evaluations and completely different plans of how to address their problem. And one point I wanna try to make is that personalized care isn't permission to abandon evidence. You've gotta use the best evidence available and the best treatments available. Sometimes that's traditional medicine. Sometimes it's not. Individualized treatment should be safe, it should be measurable, and it should certainly be medically responsible. I wanna give you some examples of what connected care sounds like. 00:05:36,040 --> 00:06:45,968 [Speaker 1] So 1st of all, I will say fatigue is not a diagnosis. We see that quite a lot. Fatigue, that's the diagnosis. Person with fatigue might need other things considered. For example, whether or not they have sleep apnea or inadequate sleep. Maybe they have anemia or an iron deficiency. What about a thyroid dysfunction? Are there medications that could be affecting this? I'm gonna elaborate here a little bit and talk a, a moment about polypharmacy and the rule that once you get beyond 3 or 4 medications, almost every medication beyond that is really just used to treat- The side effects of all the other medications. And that's something that we pay attention to. We've actually helped our patients address not only polypharmacy, but also polysupplementation. Depression and anxiety can cause fatigue. Blood sugar problems. You don't necessarily have to be a diabetic to have blood sugar problems. Menopause and other hormonal transitions. Chronic pain can cause fatigue. So can post-infectious diseases, for example, Lyme disease, Epstein-Barr disease, and even post-COVID. The functional question here isn't which supplement or which medication treats fatigue. It's really what kind of fatigue is this 00:06:47,428 --> 00:07:08,148 [Speaker 1] and what clues have we not connected yet? The next example would be the gut-skin conversation. I mean, look, there's a gut-everything connection, and I'm a big fan of gut health and, and addressing gut issues, but it's not always the only answer. A patient may have digestive symptoms along with acne, eczema, rosacea, and psoriasis. 00:07:09,388 --> 00:07:17,848 [Speaker 1] It doesn't prove that the gut caused the skin condition, but it might justify examining diet, medications, immune conditions, 00:07:19,208 --> 00:07:40,488 [Speaker 1] things like food allergies, food sensitivities, you'll hear me say that a lot, stress, nutrient status, and the timing of symptoms. Another example would be sleep apnea and blood pressure. This is well-documented connection between sleep apnea and blood pressure. Someone may be taking medication for high blood pressure while an unrecognized sleep disorder is adding to the problem. 00:07:41,528 --> 00:07:48,168 [Speaker 1] Treating the blood pressure remains important, but investigating sleep may reveal another actionable part of the picture. 00:07:49,278 --> 00:08:33,768 [Speaker 1] This is an especially strong example because it shows that connected care can involve conventional diagnosis and treatment rather than just replacing them. And we should also put trending terms through an evidence filter. For example, cortisol. You have a cortisol issue. This is all cortisol. Instead of hearing things like, "All of your symptoms are caused by high cortisol," we ask, "How are you sleeping? What's your stress load? What about medical conditions that may contribute to cortisol? Is cortisol testing actually indicated, and was testing done at an appropriate time?" Inflammation is a big topic that's out there. Instead of hearing things like, "Well, you're just inflamed," we ask, "Look, is there evidence of a specific inflammatory condition? What does that mean to be inflamed? Could infection, metabolic disease, autoimmune illness, 00:08:34,948 --> 00:11:55,208 [Speaker 1] smoking, poor sleep," again, we throw that in there, "or are there other factors that could be involved?" Again, food allergies, food sensitivities. Under the heading of hormone imbalance, we hear that quite a bit, and we hear things like, "Well, your hormones are out of balance." And frankly, we don't always know what that means. We ask, "Which hormone? When are they out of balance?" Go back and listen to my podcast with Gracie Norton and one that I specifically did about our four-point hormone panel. These will give you a little more insight about how we, uh, think about and address hormone issues. But we want to know what symptoms suggest that you have a hormone imbalance, what life stage is the patient in, and what stressors and what activities led up to the change in hormones. What testing is actually clinically appropriate, and when should that testing be done? And then more importantly sometimes is what was going on before you noticed a change? Was there an illness? Were there medications that you were taking that might have led to changes in your hormones? This one's personal to me, your gut health. And again, sometimes we have patients come and say, "Well, I was told I just-- I, I have gut issues," or, you know, "Everything starts in the gut." Well, look, the, the gut influences lots of things about your health, but it's not automatically the source of every single symptom. You could have digestive medical issues. You could have those food allergies and sensitivities. You could have a nutrient deficiency. And of course, the gut microbiome may be in a state of dysbiosis. But again, we want to dig deeper and find out what level of dysbiosis, which residents of the microbiome are overpopulated or underpopulated. The last topic that I throw out there has to do with GLP-ones and peptides and metabolic health. This is really central to folks who are looking for longevity medicine, uh, have interest in optimization of, of their body, and who are really looking for a long health life. And look, these medications have changed the conversation and landscape about weight and metabolic disease. But medication, nutrition, muscle preservation, sleep, side effects, and long-term follow-ups still belong in the same conversation. These medicines, while they often have a very safe profile, are still not without risks and dangers, and monitoring them and monitoring your health while on them remains paramount. So what functional medicine and integrative medicine should not be, it should not be a situation where you're ordering every available laboratory test that is available to you. We don't want to assume that every symptom has one root cause. We don't like blaming every problem on toxins, molds, parasites, or the microbiome. It shouldn't be about selling supplements and supplement packages to every patient. It certainly shouldn't be about telling patients to stop prescribed medications without some sort of coordination. It shouldn't be about ignoring established diagnoses or necessary specialist care, and we shouldn't assume that treating things, quote, unquote, "naturally" is automatically safe. Look, a longer test list is not necessarily a better investigation. The purpose of personalized care is to reduce confusion, not create an expensive new version of it. At our practice, connecting the dots begins with listening. We look at when symptoms started, what came first, what makes them better or worse, what medications and supplements do you take, how you sleep, what you eat, 00:11:56,488 --> 00:13:55,436 [Speaker 1] how your body has changed over time, and which evaluations have already been completed and where are there gaps. We want to perform an extended health history. And really pay attention to it. We want to look at a symptom and life event timeline. We want to review all your medications and supplements. We want to review previous lab results and, again, find and identify gaps in lab testing that needs to be done. We want to really take a deep dive in your sleep, nutrition, activity, stress assessment, stress management. We'll coordinate with specialists or your primary care doctors. We focus on targeted testing when it could change the actual management of your condition. And then we want to present you with a stepwise plan with measurable goals and results. The case for our philosophy is not that every symptom has one magical root cause. It's that a person is more than a collection of separate body parts and their care should reflect that. Sometimes the symptoms are connected. Hey, sometimes they're not. Sometimes they're very separate. The important thing is to ask the question carefully, investigate responsibly, and follow the evidence wherever it leads. And like I said before, sometimes the Western medicine, the traditional medical model that we live in in the United States is the right answer. Sometimes it's not the right answer, and sometimes it's somewhere in between, balancing the 2 approaches to healthcare. I want to explore the possible connections between gut health and skin, sleep apnea and hypertension, stress and digestion, menopause and metabolic health, and chronic pain and poor sleep. Don't assume everything is connected, but don't stop looking just because the symptoms showed up in different places. Our focus is to get you healthy safely. We place at our core the philosophy to return to when medicine actually made you better. We'll point you in the right direction and help you gain a better health life. Thanks for listening today. I hope this was helpful. And if you're struggling with lots of symptoms or wondering if this is all connected, I hope that you reach out to our office and let us be a part of your healthcare journey. 00:13:55,436 --> 00:14:29,196 [Speaker 0] The information provided in this podcast is for educational and information purposes only and is not intended as medical advice. The content is not a substitute for professional medical care, diagnosis, or treatment. Always seek the advice of a qualified healthcare provider with any questions you may have regarding a medical condition. If you would like more detailed information, please contact Dr. Amick or Dr. Pavla at Integrative Medicine through their website at integrativemla.com. [upbeat music]

2. 

   21 Apr 2026

   Ketamine Therapy Through the Therapist's Lens With Ethany Michaud, LCSW

   Show Description In this episode of Foundations and Functions, Dr. Jason Amich is joined by therapist Ethany Michaud to explore ketamine-assisted therapy from the therapist's perspective. Together, they unpack how ketamine is being used as a powerful tool for people struggling with treatment-resistant depression, anxiety, PTSD, trauma, grief, and other deeply rooted emotional challenges. Ethany shares how traditional talk therapy, medication, and even deeper somatic approaches can sometimes fall short, and why ketamine, when paired with skilled therapy, can help patients access new pathways for healing. The conversation also dives into how neuroplasticity works, how therapists screen for the right candidates, and why safety, trust, and a strong partnership between doctor and therapist are essential for success. Dr. Amich and Ethany address common misconceptions, including fears about addiction, personality changes, and safety concerns, while highlighting the hope many patients experience when long-standing patterns finally begin to loosen. This is an insightful, reassuring episode for anyone curious about how ketamine-assisted therapy works and why it may offer new possibilities for healing when other treatments have not gone far enough. Show Disclaimer The information provided in this podcast is for educational and informational purposes only and is not intended as medical advice. The content is not a substitute for professional medical care, diagnosis, or treatment. Always seek the advice of a qualified healthcare provider with any questions you may have regarding a medical condition. If you would like more detailed medical information, please contact Integrative Medicine through their website at https://integrativemla.com/ Show Transcript 0:02 Welcome to Foundations and Functions Weekly Podcast, where we return to when medicine actually made you better. The information provided in this podcast is for educational and information purposes only, and is not intended as medical advice. The content is not a substitute for professional medical care, diagnosis, or treatment. Always seek the advice of a qualified health care provider with any questions you may have regarding a medical condition. Today's episode features Dr. Jason Amich, in a continued discussion on ketamine therapy. Thank you, everybody, for joining us today. Welcome back to Foundations and Functions. This is Dr. Amich. 0:43 I'm here with Ethany Michaud, who is a therapist that we collaborate with for our ketamine -assisted therapy. We had a great response to our last podcast with my friend Micah that talked about ketamine -assisted therapy from the perspective of the patient. So today we want to talk about ketamine -assisted therapy from the perspective of the therapist. So we're happy to have her here. And so I just want to take a second to welcome you, Ethany. Thank you so much for taking the time to join me. And just give us a quick intro. Tell us a little bit about yourself and about your practice. Yeah, thanks for having me. Yeah, so my name is Ethany Michaud. I own Circle City Alliance Therapy and Consulting. My office is in like Northwest Indianapolis and pretty close to Carmel, so luckily very close to where you guys practice as well. I have been a therapist for about 10 years now and kind of started working with Dr. Amich and Dr. Pabla on ketamine -assisted psychotherapy, what, two or three years ago now? I think so. Yeah. And it's been a really cool experience. Kind of what I specialize in is taking clients that have tried just traditional talk therapy, all the, you know, medication management, and it's just not working. 2:13 And I take them a little bit deeper. And so I specialize in ketamine -assisted psychotherapy and in brain spotting, which is pretty similar to EMDR. Um, often people will be more familiar with what EMDR is, um, and kind of search for that. Brainspotting specifically is, um, similar, but a little bit more, um, flexible. And so I like that about it, uh, versus EMDR specifically, because I can really just kind of meet the client wherever they're at and go from there. Um, so yeah, that's kind of what I do. And who's, who's your typical client or, I mean, do you see. You know children all the way through adults or do you kind of have a special demographic range that you stick to? Yeah, I work with adults at this point. Um, and mostly I specialize in trauma addiction, um, grief, anxiety and depression. Um, but most of my clients have had some sort of trauma. 3:10 Great. Well, not great. Not right. Great that it aligns with this so well. And so I'm excited to jump into this. So. Let me just kind of start off by saying, you know, ketamine is a very interesting thing to me. And so I often kind of think about how did this party drug become one of the most promising treatments for things like treatment -resistant depression, anxiety, even PTSD. And so I say that with a little bit of jest because it really didn't ever begin as a party drug. So what I describe as kind of the evolution of ketamine from hero to villain back to hero. 3:49 And really the story of ketamine started before 1960, but 1960 was kind of the sentinel year for ketamine use. And it wasn't until 1970s that the FDA actually approved ketamine as an approved medication in the United States. The World Health Organization has had ketamine on its list of essential medicines for decades. Even as far as in the year 2000, Yale School of Medicine was doing some random controlled trials with ketamine and were having some great results. Fast forward that to its villain concept. So, unfortunately, in the early 2000s, ketamine emerged as a street drug, party drug, and unfortunately a date rape drug. And so it was being used indiscriminately, even in inpatient mental facilities. Fortunately, it caused quite a bad stain on ketamine and its usage. Now we return to its hero story, where we realize with continued study, with these continued RCTs, which are the gold standard of science inquiry here, we're seeing this amazing set of data emerge, describing and demonstrating ketamine's role in treatment of treatment -resistant depression, anxiety, and even PTSD. 5:08 So the FDA has approved ketamine for, or a form of ketamine for, treatment -resistant depression, which is something that you talked about. Some of your initial clients were folks that have, you know, been dealing with it for a while. Can you talk a little bit about treatment -resistant depression and what that sounds like? Yeah, absolutely. I work with treatment -resistant depression, anxiety, the PTSD, kind of all of those symptoms can eventually be treatment -resistant. Sure. Yeah, a lot of my clients will have tried traditional talk therapy. They've tried all the SSRIs, you know, and either, you know, that doesn't go well for their specific body chemistry or they're allergic to it or some other kind of thing where they just simply can't take that medication. and it just doesn't work for them. Some clients it makes anxiety worse or depression worse or suicidal thoughts. And there are definitely some clients that truly the medication aspect just doesn't work for them. And I kind of view it as more of a band -aid. It doesn't really fix the underlying issue. The underlying issue really lives in their nervous system. And so I do, I get a lot of clients that will come to me saying you know I've been in therapy for on and off for my whole life or for years and years and we just talk in circles and it's not really going anywhere. 6:22 What I will usually start with is brain spotting because it is a less invasive approach kind of based on eye positioning and so we kind of know that with our eye positioning we can kind of unlock where your body is holding the trauma or holding its unhelpful belief systems or whatever we have that we're dealing with and so We kind of line up your eye positioning a specific way. and your body will process for you, which is very cool to see. But sometimes even that level is not enough. And so when I've encountered that in my practice, and I'm like, okay, we're trying all the things, we're going deeper, you know, we're working with the nervous system, not just our frontal lobe, where we're just, you know, making connections and thinking through it, we're feeling through it. And if that is also not enough, then we need to think about moving into ketamine assisted treatment. And so Sometimes people's brains just really don't want to budge and maybe that's because these specific patterns these behaviors have kept them safe After a trauma and so not actively resistant to change but their bodies just won't allow it to happen and that comes from a Survival standpoint and that's that's a pretty deeply ingrained survival instinct to have yeah, that's where ketamine can kind of come into play And we've seen really good results with that. 7:44 So if we need to go even deeper than a somatic type of therapy on top of talk therapy, then we'll bring in ketamine. That's great. And I like, you know, that you are focusing on the brain, the body and the emotion part, kind of bringing all that in. So real quick, I'm just going to do a quick overview of how ketamine works. And I want to jump into that because you brought something up when you said these patterns of behavior and it's kind of these rigid thought patterns. So we'll jump into that. But it's kind of the beauty of how ketamine works, specifically in that area of neuroplasticity. And so if you really want to get the deep dive into the biochemistry, I say jump back and listen to that podcast that I did with my buddy Micah. But just for today's, you know, 30 ,000 foot view, you know, the skinny of it is that ketamine focuses and acts on the NMDA receptors. And what this does is it regulates glutamate. Glutamate is the number one excitatory neurotransmitter in our brain. And what's really kind of a cool paradox of how ketamine works is that initially it actually blocks that receptor. 8:54 It actually slows down glutamate. But really, the end result is it actually kicks up glutamate. It's like slow down so you can go fast. And in doing that, when you get that surge of glutamate, it really opens up those neurons to want to reach out and find new pathways and find new connections. And so that's where neuroplasticity, are you comfortable talking about neuroplasticity? Absolutely. So tell me, what's neuroplasticity? Yeah, so it's it's kind of a trending word right now. And that's great. I think that more people are kind of getting on board and learning about this. 9:29 I talk about it with my clients in the realm of like rigidity. And so sometimes, consciously, they can know that their, their reactions, their thoughts, their beliefs, you know, core beliefs, what their body believes, is unhelpful at this point. But they just cannot seem to overcome that. And so when I talk about petamine treatment with them, I kind of talk about how it'll loosen up how rigid your body is. you know, holds on to these beliefs, these patterns, these behaviors, and that gives us access then to rewire a little bit. I do prefer to know my clients pretty well, have really good rapport with them, feel, hopefully they feel really safe in session with me so that we can really pick out, okay, what kind of core beliefs or behaviors, attitudes would be more helpful for you at this stage in your life, where you're hopefully safe, where, you know, you've overcome, you know, come through the trauma, and that's not gonna be reoccurring for you. 10:30 Really working to kind of rewire when the ketamine treatment kind of puts their brain into a state where it's more pliable and we can move things around. Yeah, I kind of see it in my own head as, you know, you have these paths, right, maybe these trails in this forest of life, and we forge these trails and we We're comfortable with them. We know where they lead. We know how to navigate them and get to them. You know, I think it was Robert Frost that said, right, that what if I came to a fork in the road and I took the path less traveled. That's made all the difference. Well, I don't want to take the path, you know, that's less traveled. I want to stay on the path that I recognize that I'm safe, but I know where it's going to go. And sometimes our brains do that even when it's not good for us. 11:17 And so I feel like ketamine kind of opens up your perspective to say, hey, this trail here, this may be a new path to take. That's actually going to get you to a better place or get you to a healthier, safer location than always ending up at the edge of the cliff somewhere, you know, and not knowing. you know, how you're going to react to that. So that's just kind of in my brain when I think about neuroplasticity and how ketamine helps break some of those old patterns and opens up your mind for or new opportunities for, you know, connections to memories, connections to behaviors. So often our patterns of behavior, our patterns of thought are so, like you said, rigid that it's hard to believe that there's anything other than. Yes, absolutely. So talk to me a little bit about your screenings and selection process, how you go through Kind of determining which patients you feel like may be good candidates for ketamine, maybe some that maybe ketamine may not be good for them right now. 12:21 Yes. So I will do a full screening. So if I don't know the client in front of me, they're new to me, I will do what's called a bio -psycho -social assessment. It kind of just looks at all their whole life, all of their life domains, their spiritual, their social, their medical, mental health, just kind of a full spectrum assessment of their whole life. Look into psychological history. One contraindication that we want to avoid is psychosis. And so if they have a history of psychosis or, and I know that there are some Issues with like certain cardiac things, you know, if I if I clock any of that in the in the intake specifically, I would probably talk to you about that just for safety reasons. But most of the people that I have kind of done an intake with. have been generally in a good headspace. They're not in an acute crisis. We don't want their whole life to be falling apart and then to dose them with ketamine and then try to rewire. We want them to have generally a stable safe place to kind of return home to, that sort of thing. 13:33 So good support systems, people that have done the work or they've tried all the medications and are still feeling stuck, like therapy alone hasn't moved the needle. for them. Again, we kind of talked about treatment -resistant depression, complex trauma, anxiety, that CPTSD, you know, that goes deep, usually into childhood. It doesn't have to, but oftentimes it does. You know, the only contraindications are really psychosis, and then some physical health concerns, which I always defer to you to kind of check that out. But yeah, most of the people that that we have worked with together have just been feeling really stuck and having trouble kind of overcoming that. 14:14 Yeah. And again, that kind of goes back to that neuroplasticity and being able to break that mold of behavior and thought. One of the things that I found has been really cool in partnering with you and other therapists and folks that are coming to us, first of all, is the strong partnership. And that's really important in our practice that our ability to provide ketamine in a safe environment absolutely requires that they have an active relationship with a therapist ongoing. That's for number one. Number two is I really like to see the improvements in their GAD scores, their PHQ -9. 14:52 So I know those are kind of really popular things out there. So can you explain what, what a GAD is or what a PHQ -9 is? Absolutely. Yes. Um, so the GAD score, um, it is a screener for anxiety, um, and it's a generalized anxiety disorder. Yes. Um, that's what GAD stands for. And then the PHQ -9 is for depression. So they're very similar screeners. It'll feel to a client like a quiz and you get a score at the end. and they're evidence -based, you know, they're backed by science. and we kind of use these frequently throughout treatment. 15:28 So I'll get a baseline before we ever do a ketamine intervention, we'll get a baseline score, and then what we want to see is that we want to see those scores change. And essentially, the higher the score on those screeners, the worse you're feeling. And so if, you know, you're an 18 on the GAD, you're not feeling good. You've got a lot of anxiety. If you're a 21 on the PHQ -9, you're very depressed and it's hard to get out of bed and things like that. And so we want to see those scores go down over time. 16:00 And truthfully, in our time working together, we have seen Significant change in those scores. Are there any other screeners anything else that you do? Yeah, we will have specific goals Like if we're working on let's say they have a core belief of I can't let people Too close to me because I'll just get hurt, right? That's a that's a pretty common one. Unfortunately, you know, a lot of people are hurt by other people with trauma And so they have trouble making friends and trusting people to get close to them in their life We will you know find a specific marker to see how intensely that is coming up for them. 16:34 And so I usually use a scale, you know, zero to 10. And so if, if 10 is the worst you could ever feel about a friend spending time with you, for example, you know, that's a 10 is you're, you're having a panic attack about that, right? That person wanted to give you a hug goodbye and you just couldn't. These are just examples, but sure. If that is a 10 out of 10, then I want to see that number go down too. I want to see, you know, some exposure therapy after, after ketamine, like let's, practice giving our friends a hug and and see how that feels in your body. And, you know, does that, you know, bring up the same pressure in your chest? Does that also make you want to cry every time you do? And if we see those symptoms go down, you know, it's a subjective score. But if we see that number go down, that's what we want to see that, you know, happening there, too. I use a lot of scores. My clients are very used to giving me lots of numbers of things. But yeah, we look for specific goals and progress toward those goals as well. 17:27 And I think those scores are helpful. In some of the patients that I've discussed those scores with, you know, even from our angle, from the administration of the ketamine, sometimes it's been interesting to hear them be surprised at the score. They may not necessarily feel differently, necessarily, but then when they kind of look back and go, well, you, again, you were at 21. Now you're at nine. Right. And they can say, yeah, wow. Yeah. I didn't realize that. One of the questions on the GAD will ask, over the last two weeks, how often have you felt that you could not Stop or control worrying. Really, we've had clients that would rate three out of three nearly every day. That's what that score means. When we kind of go through it, you know, month after month or even every two weeks or so to make sure that we're on track, I'll say, you know, two weeks ago you rated that out of three and today you're at a one. 18:18 What's that feel like for you? Like, where are you noticing that difference? And you'll kind of see the light bulb moment where you're like, oh my gosh, you're right. Wait, I went a whole day without worrying about something. And then we'll kind of reflect on that. What was that like? How does that, you know, show up, you know, meaningfully in your, in your life, in your relationships at work, at school or whatever you're doing. And it's, it's really cool. It's cool for us to see because we don't see the client every day. I see them, you know, once a week or, or whatever the, the structure looks like. And so they look. vastly different to me, but they live with themselves every day. And so it's really cool to reflect and look at where they started and where they've ended up. And that's something I talked with him about is saying, look, give someone permission, give your spouse, give your best friend, give someone permission to let you know how you're doing and check in with you. 19:10 A lot of patients will ask me, well, you know, how often do I have to come get ketamine or am I doing it every day? for the rest of my life? And the answer is, I honestly don't know. It's going to be very specific to the patient, but I will say the patients that we have on maintenance doses of ketamine, very interesting how often a spouse might say, you know, maybe you should think about getting another dose. Or a child would say, mom, okay, I think you might need a little touch up on ketamine. And they've allowed that. 19:39 And so they may not necessarily see some of those reverting back to some of the old habits other folks had. And they, without question, without exception, all of them that have use that feedback, really get great results with it and really enjoy their time with their families more and kind of who they are. I think it's interesting in some key points to make about ketamine -assisted therapy has to do with some of the research on patients who've had treatment -resistant depression, PTSD, and anxiety. So in some of the studies, up to 91 % of folks who were screened positive for symptoms of generalized anxiety disorder, that's what that GAD score kind of helps, 91 % fell into a milder category or had significant clinical improvements. 20:25 Folks that were screened for depression, so 79 % of people who screened positive for symptoms of depression who combined ketamine -assisted therapy with their current counseling therapy, whether that's psychotherapy, EMDR, you know, whatever else we might be trying, DBT, CBT, all the things. Yeah, all the things. They had significant clinical improvements and reductions. 86 % of people that tested positive for PTSD left the program. screening negative for PTSD. Negative. Not an improvement, better. Gone. So, I just, and then 92 % had some significant clinical improvements in their life, in work environments. So, I think those are really important too. you know, highlight here when we're talking about how ketamine -assisted therapy can be an adjunct in a tool in your toolbox for you know, changing some of those, uh, longstanding behaviors, longstanding thought patterns and kind of getting out of that rut. Absolutely. There's, you know, I'm, I'm sure eventually I'll, I'll hit a point with a client where it's not helpful, but so far in the last couple of years, a hundred percent of the clients that, that we have shared have, have come back and had significant change and improvement. 21:43 And it's just really, really cool to see. And that, that kind of confidence going in is really helpful. So I'm going to put you on the spot a little bit here. I know I promised I told you I wouldn't do it, but I am going to do it. That's okay. And that is, what about some of those that are kind of on the bubble? Tell me about some of the folks who are maybe hesitant or if they have some misconceptions. What, what do you, do you have some that you're kind of like, you wish they'd do some ketamine, but maybe there's some resistance. Tell me about that. Absolutely. Um, yes, there are a number of, of hesitations that people will bring up when I say, Hey, you know, we've been working on this for a year or more and we're just really not I'm not seeing even brain spotting, which is very deep. I love brain spotting. Very deep work. Very positive for a lot of people. But even that is not moving the needle enough. I'll bring it up to the client. And so many clients have asked me, is this going to change who I am fundamentally? 22:36 Is this going to make me a different person? I'm afraid that if I try this, that I'll become addicted to it. I'm afraid that it'll, you know, make me have different interests or change my personality. Absolutely not. That has not been my experience. I don't know if that's been your experience either. The things that it does help with is kind of reducing their negative symptoms, right? The symptoms that they are struggling with, you know, hypervigilance or they're having difficulty sleeping at night, they wake up all hours of the night in a panic attack, the brain fog of it all, you know, just their nervous system is just on all the time, because they feel like they have to be to stay safe. It's usually, you know, PTSD is kind of what that looks like. And so what it does do is help give our brain the opportunity to form new healthier connections. 23:28 What it does not do is change who you are as a person. Not to be too, I don't know, blunt about it, but isn't it kind of the point to be a little bit different than what you have been? Yes. In some ways, yes. But I think I understand the question is, you know, who I am fundamentally. Yeah. That's a misconception that I think is easily, you know, erased from looking at the data and just talking to people that, you know, it really kind of makes you better at who you are and who you want to be. 23:55 It gives you more space, more capacity to live your life in the way that you want to. I even had somebody recently ask, um, is this going to make me like, for example, not love my husband anymore? Am I, am I going to be, am I going to feel so different that the things I love now won't matter to me anymore? Scary. Those were scary things, right? Oh yeah. And that's just, again, not been my experience. I haven't seen that. And in fact, the opposite, what I have seen is that it. allows people more capacity to, instead of, you know, focusing on survival every moment of every day, of protecting themselves constantly, they're able to kind of relax a little bit more. They're able to, you know, dive more into the relationships that they want to foster, um, with safe people, of course. Sure. That's, that's a pretty common misconception. 24:44 People are very afraid of what it will kind of turn them into. And, and that's valid, I think, you know, especially for people who've been traumatized I would expect some hesitancy, you know, walking into something this deep and not really knowing what the outcome will be. That makes sense. I remember one, one patient telling me through the ketamine experience, she said, you know, I had this, I kind of relived this moment and it wasn't a big deal in the moment. But now that I've kind of had some time from it and with the ketamine, I realized, wow, I think that affected me a whole lot more than I realized. And I would never have thought about that. I haven't thought about that situation my entire adult life. But now that I've kind of gone through this, I kind of sat back and went, wow, that's really been something that's affected me. I'm going to work that out. I just had to sit back and say, okay, that's great. So yeah, I really love that evolution with ketamine. What other misconceptions or what other things do you hear from your patients? other main misconception is that they feel like ketamine is new. 25:49 And so maybe my my client that's that's, you know, on my couch, didn't go through the party drug, you know, era with ketamine. And so they think that it's a brand new drug on the market, and that there's not enough research behind it. And we don't really know how it goes. And obviously, as you described earlier, That's just not the case. And so that's a pretty common misconception as well. And then I have a two page APA style reference list. I'm happy to share with them. I love it. APA nerded out on. But yeah, the only other misconception is that they think that they're going to, I guess, not come down from a high, right? That they'll get stuck there and now they're in active psychosis for the rest of their lives. And obviously, you and I would not be doing this if that were a concern. And so, yeah, I think just educating people and kind of talking through what our experiences have been has been really helpful in kind of dispelling some of those scary rumors. Yeah, and I talk a lot, you know, I still do some critical care work. I use ketamine, I would say, really just about every shift where I'm at least thinking about ketamine as an option for patients by 26:55 every shift that I do. And it's a very different way of dosing it for this than in an ICU or an emergency department setting. And we're going to use a lower weight base dose and we're going to give it over a longer period of time. So the nice thing about ketamine is it acts quick, but it doesn't stick around for a long period. So typically within an hour, after the infusion. I kind of equate it to people sometimes like this is think about when you get the nitrous oxide or the laughing gas at the dentist, right? I mean, you kind of just don't care about what's happening during that moment. And then, yeah, once you're done, we don't like people driving themselves home. But, you know, yeah, it's not these lingering, you know, side effects. As far as, you know, addictive nature of ketamine, again, the dosage that we're using and the frequency we're using it and the intentionality that we're using it really keeps it at an extremely low level. You know, and what I tell people is, you know, during the ketamine infusion, I've had people say, is it just getting high in my doctor's office? 27:53 Is that right? Well, it's not the goal. People do experience some pretty intense, emotional and sometimes uncomfortable experiences. And what's fascinating is when I asked them, How was that? Across the board, it's usually very difficult for them to actually describe what they experienced, put it into words. So it's a lot of visual kind of descriptions that they use for that. But that's the typical experience that people have getting the low dose. And we do IB, ketamine, and again, my my previous podcast, we talk a lot about, you know, why we do IV versus intranasal versus oral. There's a lot of good information about that. It just has better bioavailability and it's a lot more controllable from that perspective. And then finally, kind of the idea of, you know, is ketamine dangerous? And there's been some things in the media and people worry about. the dangers. 28:50 One of the reasons I like it in the critical care and emergency medicine setting, it doesn't have the dangers of a lot of the other drug options that we have. It doesn't depress your central nervous system. It doesn't slow down your breathing. It doesn't have as much impact on your cardiovascular system or your blood pressure, heart rate, that sort of thing. So from that perspective, It actually has an extremely safe profile compared to other medicines that you may hear about being used in hospitals in emergency and critical care settings or anesthesia settings. Ketamine is kind of a go -to drug. for a lot of those environments because of how safe it is. And I always tell people, anything can be dangerous in the wrong hands in the wrong step. You know, for our practice, you know, you are monitored the entire time. There's a clinician in the room with you the entire time. You know, we're monitoring your blood pressure. We're monitoring your heart rate. We're monitoring your oxygen saturation. You know, these things are probably overkill, but I do know I've had some patients give feedback that other places they've gone, there isn't that level of monitoring. 29:57 The psychology, I think, of kind of being just left alone, given this thing, you're out here kind of on your own to manage all the things that are happening is really unfortunate. And so that should not be the norm. So that would be my message for anyone out there. If that's the situation, ask these kinds of questions. How are you being monitored? Who's monitoring you? And what their training and background is. Sharing some experiences, both as you as a clinician and maybe some specific patient experiences that you've had. ahead of the last couple years. Absolutely, yeah. Yeah, some things that I've really noticed with lions been a little bit different based on when I've seen them. I will usually try to get them in within 24 hours after their dosage, and then I can tell when I've seen them directly after their dose, they're maybe still a little bit out of it. 30:45 Not in a bad way. They're actually very calm, very relaxed, very happy, very chill. Like, you know, kind of like, that was so cool. It's just, you know, so calm. And of course, we've gotten all the feedback that they just feel really safe with you guys. And it's just been a really good experience. If I see them like, you know, the hour after they get their dose, it's a little harder to do some of the deeper work. But if I see them at least half a day after or that next morning, that's kind of the sweet spot I've found. You know, of course, it really depends person to person. But yeah, what I've kind of noticed with clients is just kind of like a loosening of their rigid thought patterns. You know, if the week before I said, hey, let's really work on this core belief that you hold that you're unlovable or unworthy of love. 31:30 and you kind of see them physically tense up, their shoulders, you know, basically on their ears, you know, and they just tense up and you see their eyes darting all over the place. And you can kind of visually see their nervous system trying to protect them, but then when they come after their dose with you and then they walk into my office and I say the same thing, hey, how comfortable do you feel talking about this belief that you're unworthy of love today? The loosening of all of their nervous system responses has been just really, really cool to see. 32:03 Their shoulders stay relaxed. They're kind of melted into the couch a little bit. They're just like, sure, whatever you want to talk about, let's do it. And then we kind of work to rewire, you know, let's look at the evidence. And that's just, you know, the traditional psychotherapy piece. You know, what makes that belief true? Is that belief true at this point? You know, do we have other pieces of evidence that make it not true? Is there a different core belief or can we challenge that core belief a little bit? Again, that's traditional psychotherapy. There are other things we can do with like DBT, dialectical behavioral therapy. 32:37 Maybe we need to work on accepting certain core beliefs. And we'll, you know, it's a case -by -case basis. I think the biggest coolest thing that I've seen is just the physical signs of relaxation. Their expressions are softer and, you know, instead of sitting up on the very edge of the couch, you know, straight back, they're able to like relax a little bit and kind of cross their legs and kick their feet up a little bit. That pressure, that weight that they felt in their chest for most of their lives is lessened. And do you feel like you're able to get in and reach in? to those core beliefs a little bit easier in that state? Absolutely. They're more willing to go there. They're more comfortable going there. It doesn't feel as scary to them to talk about that stuff. It's just the openness is very cool to see. And they're able to focus a little bit easier. And so sometimes trauma will make it look like we have ADHD when we don't. And our brain is just kind of jumping all over the place. People are always very focused. They will come in and They're very present. 33:40 They're very, you know, aware of their bodies and, you know, not kind of disconnected anymore. It's just kind of an ideal situation for therapy. Do you find some aha moments? I mean. Absolutely. Sometimes people have those aha moments, you know, while they're kind of getting the ketamine at your clinic and then they'll come talk about it. We really. You know, it's been that time kind of linking like, okay, well, that makes sense because of this and okay, well, let's let's adjust this and you know, what kind of evidence can we look for over here? And so lots of aha moments and they'll they'll report feeling like Pope and and like peace. It's so interesting. We haven't talked about that. We haven't but that word. Yeah. Yeah. I would, I mean, so often, uh, you know what, I'll just ask a closing follow -up question, you know, Hey, so overall, how do you feel? 34:34 Right. In some places. asking more for clinical reasons, you know, hey, any headaches or dizziness or nausea, you're going to throw up on the floor. How's it going? It's so odd and interesting and beautifully odd that so many different people from all walks of life would use the word hope. And I love that you just said that because you're hearing that too. So that's, that was a really, I wanted to make sure I pointed that out because it's such a cool thing to hear when someone looks you in the face and say, you know what? I have hope for the first time. Yeah. Like it removes that block of, you know, where our brain has said, Nope, this is how I'm going to be forever. This is it. This is my reality. And, and it doesn't have to be. Yeah. So feeling that hope can be really empowering. 35:19 Yeah, awesome. I would definitely say find a team that you feel safe with. On the therapy side of the world, we know that at least 90 % of our helpfulness as therapists is the therapeutic relationship. And so feeling safe in my office, feeling safe to tell me anything that's coming up for you, knowing you're not going to be judged, knowing I'm not going to be like, wow, that is crazy. I'm never going to think that. I'm never going to say that. And just really feeling safe with the people that you're going through this with because these are some of the deepest kind of darkest experiences of a person's life. And to share that with somebody, that somebody needs to be a safe person. The other side of the same coin, I think finding a doctor who you also feel safe with, because that doctor is going to be in the room with you, hopefully, as Dr. Amick suggested, is going to be in the room with you and going to be walking through this journey with you as well. 36:19 And so finding a treatment team that you feel confident and safe with, I think is the number one Indication that this is going to go well for you. Okay, imagine you're in a room full of therapists who are maybe kind of interested in starting their patients or clients on ketamine, but maybe they're not sure. What would be your one piece of advice that you would give the room to say, this is what you need to know as a therapist about ketamine -assisted therapy? Yeah, I would definitely recommend that they talk to you, and I actually have been in a room even recently with a group of therapists, and they were asking me all of these questions about it, and I said, you know what, yeah, so you probably need to talk to Dr. Amick and just kind of demystify it a little bit. I hail from a long line of dual diagnosis therapists, and so we were kind of trained to treat addiction and mental illness together. 37:12 And we were trained to do that in a community mental health setting. And so, you know, thinking about giving a client that is, you know, struggling with being homeless and addicted and, you know, having an A -score of 10 out of 10, which is another one of those screening tools that gives us information about PTSD. A 10 out of 10 means you've had a lot of trauma. You know, for a lot of those therapists, thinking about giving somebody ketamine or even considering ketamine can be really scary. And so I think really kind of demystifying it, doing some research, talking to safe doctors like yourself, maybe even asking if you can kind of shadow over a day if that's an option, of course, if the client patient is comfortable with that. I think once you get into this, it's a lot less scary. Yeah. And I think for people like you and me, it's easy because we've seen the outcome. 38:09 We've already seen the outcome. Yeah. And it's so worth it. Definitely. And before you can get to that, you have to take that trusting step. I think that's great advice. So let's chat a little bit about how we do work together, kind of the system that we work in. balances that we have in place. So again, I mentioned that we want to make sure that You know, not only do patients have access to therapy, but they're actively involved in therapy. We don't do standalone ketamine infusions in our practice. Patients can come in a couple of different ways. 38:43 They may come to us, specifically to our practice, and we say, gosh, this would be a good candidate for ketamine. And so we would refer them to a therapist if they don't have one already. But then talk a little bit about your side, when if someone comes to your office and how we can kind of go back and forth about how that flow works. So the trigger would be, ah, this person would be a good candidate for ketamine -assisted therapy. Yeah. So once I receive that referral from you guys, then I will do an intake assessment. I kind of talked about the biopsychosocial assessment that I'd complete. Make sure that everything checks out on our end, they have good supports at home, that everything is stable, they're not in an acute crisis. Kind of coordinate with Dr. Emick here and kind of find a schedule that works for them. And then I would work them in so that they could see me. at least 24 hours after each dose. We've got kind of down to a science, it works pretty well. On the other hand, if I've been working with somebody for a while and we've been trying other things and it's not working, I might bring that up to the client and say, hey, you know, I found that on my end, you're a good candidate, but I want to make sure that we clear you medically for this. 39:54 And so then I would send them over to Dr. Amich for a full medical workup and make sure that they're a good candidate. And that's so important for Dr. Pabla and my partner and I, we both really want to look at you know, root causes. We really kind of focus on that functional medicine, you know, mindset of, okay, what else could be going on? So we want to make sure there's nothing medically wrong that needs to be addressed, whether it's a thyroid condition, you know, any other kind of, you know, medical problem that they're having or something that might set them outside of the parameters for, you know, safety for ketamine -assisted therapy, you know, uncontrolled hypertension is one of them. Recent stroke might be one of them. You know, we should make sure, okay, let's make sure that from a medical perspective, this person is safe to receive this This therapy so I think again for us, you know That just makes perfect sense to ensure that we're gonna cover it kind of the medical clinical side the body side Yeah, and we want you to cover the kind of the behavioral Psychosocial side of that. 40:53 I think that's a really important piece. It's a it's a non -negotiable for our practice yeah, which I I think is is really important to note that there are kind of a an uptick of clinics that will just, you know, mail ketamine to somebody's house. Don't get me started on that. We don't have enough podcast space for that. We don't. And it just, you know, it either can be dangerous or, you know, uncontrolled, unmonitored. Unmonitored, right. But then on the other hand, you're also not creating new connections in your brain. And so it's just not really going to change much for you. 41:28 So, Yeah, I think the partnership that we have works really well. We make sure that we're covering all of our bases, and we kind of leave no stone unturned. And one of the things that Dr. Pabla and I really, really believe in is making sure that we get you healthy safely. There are many things you can find through AI or through internet searches, or you can find, you know, quote unquote, you know, influencer experts on different topics. And we're like, well, maybe, but let's get you healthy, safe. And that's a physical perspective. And I know we really enjoy working with you because I feel like that's how you believe as well, from a behavioral perspective. 42:06 We want to get there, but we got to get there safely every time. You know, this is really just about the brain's ability to adapt, change, and ultimately rewire itself. And then we used to think that neurons are fixed and non -regenerative and kind of once they're set, they're set. And what we know now is that's not necessarily true. And we know that because, you know, patients who have had strokes before or certain specific types of brain injury or trauma, we know that, you know, other neurons can kind of take over for that. So there's, there's some evidence out there already that neurons can, can do some pretty cool stuff on their own. And we can help rewire that effective for us. If you want to form new memories, recover from injuries, if we want to break thought patterns that are unhealthy or unhelpful. and that the key here is that ketamine causes a temporary state of enhanced neuroplasticity. 42:56 That's such a key point to make, that it's this narrow window of enhanced neuroplasticity, where again we can rewire those thought patterns or behaviors, we can address experiences that seem stuck or rigid, and it just allows for new paths to be forged when they're combined with therapy. Thanks so much for spending time with us and helping your patients and clients reach their best potential. So tell us a little bit, where can we find you? Yeah, absolutely. You can find me at ccatherapy .com. Again, my business is called Circle Steady Alliance Therapy and Consulting. I'm here in Northwest Indianapolis, but I am licensed throughout Ohio and Florida so far, so I can I work with people virtually, probably not with you with ketamine if they're in Florida. But yeah, you can also find me on Instagram or TikTok. I am at CCA therapist. Again, my name is Ethany Michaud. That 43:52 is spelled E -T -H -A -N -Y M -I -C -H -A -U -D. It's like Bethany without the B on it. I'm pretty easy to find if you Google me. Great. Awesome. Thank you so much for your time and for listening today. If you have any questions about this, please feel free to reach out to us on our website, www .integrity .org. .com. But thank you for spending time with us today and we hope that you find a way to get healthy safely. The information provided in this podcast is for educational and information purposes only, and is not intended as medical advice. The content 44:26 is not a substitute for professional medical care, diagnosis, or treatment. Always seek the advice of a qualified healthcare provider with any questions you may have regarding a medical condition. If you would like more detailed information, please contact Dr. Amich or Dr. Pabla at Integrative Medicine through their website at integrativemla .com.

3. 

   3 Dec 2025

   Ketamine Infusion Therapy - A Powerful Story With Micah Miller

   Dr. Jason Amich interviews Micah Miller, a paramedic and military veteran, about his personal experience with ketamine infusion therapy for treating trauma, anxiety, and depression, revealing the science and emotional journey of this emerging mental health treatment in this interview.

4. 

   13 Jun 2025

   Testosterone Replacement Therapy

   Dr. Jason Amick discusses testosterone replacement therapy, emphasizing the importance of proper lab timing to understand peak versus trough levels for informed treatment decisions, and highlights that snoring is not normal.

5. 

   31 May 2025

   GLP-1 & Fertility

   Dr. Jason Amick and Rachel discuss how GLP-1 medications impact fertility, highlighting risks to birth control absorption and pregnancy safety, while Rachel shares how GLP-1 therapies support energy and cardiovascular wellness; this is an interview.

6. 

   21 May 2025

   May is National Food Allergy Awareness Month

   Show Description In this episode of the Foundations and Functions Weekly Podcast, Dr. Jason Amick and Dr. C.J. Pabla dive into a critical—and often misunderstood—topic: the difference between food allergies and food sensitivities. As part of National Food Allergy Awareness Month, the doctors explore the science behind the immune system’s varying responses, highlighting how IgE antibodies cause immediate, potentially life-threatening reactions (think EpiPens and ER visits), while IgA and IgG antibodies trigger slower, more insidious symptoms like fatigue, bloating, joint pain, and brain fog. Using real-world examples and patient stories, they explain how something as innocent as broccoli could disrupt your life days after eating it—and why conventional allergy testing often misses the mark. Listeners will also learn about the rise in food sensitivities, the impact of modern food production on gut health, and how to navigate confusing lab results with an elimination diet strategy. The episode is packed with practical advice, including common trigger foods, symptom tracking tips, and why working with the right practitioner is key to uncovering hidden root causes of discomfort. Whether you're battling IBS, unexplained rashes, or chronic fatigue, this episode offers a fresh, functional lens on how what you eat might be eating away at your health. Disclaimer: The information provided in this podcast is for educational and informational purposes only and is not intended as medical advice. The content is not a substitute for professional medical care, diagnosis, or treatment. Always seek the advice of a qualified healthcare provider with any questions you may have regarding a medical condition. If you would like more detailed medical information, please contact Integrative Medicine through their website at https://integrativemla.com/ Show Transcript 3 0:00 Welcome to Foundations and Functions Weekly Podcast, where we return to when medicine actually made you better. Now, here's Dr. Jason Amick and Dr. C.J. 1 0:14 Pabla. Thanks everybody for taking time out to listen to our podcast. You may not have realized it, but May is actually National Food Allergy Awareness Month. So we wanted to take some time to talk a little bit about food allergies versus food sensitivity. And those are two big topics that we see in our practice quite a bit. So remember, a big goal that we have through our education and our talks here is to help 1 0:41 you get healthy safely. So, Dr. Pabla, real quick, let's get into what's the main difference between a food sensitivity and a food allergy? 2 0:54 So, when we look at the immune system, there's actually five antibodies, but we really don't talk about IGD. And really, they're mediated by different components of the immune system. So allergies are mediated by an antibody known as IgE, and food sensitivities are mediated 2 1:15 by the part of the immune system that deals with IgG and IgA. And that's kind of the best way to kind of describe it, and we're going to get into the details of how that presents clinically differently. 1 1:29 Yeah. So when I used to teach this and I've talked to people, I think I tell them, think about IGE, think emergency room, think EpiPen. That's correct. These are the real emergency, true allergies that are life-threatening. Yes. And so this is the other way that I describe it pretty colorfully is I say, 1 1:49 think of like your drunk cousin, Teresa, right? Where she has a little bit of wine and she's just out of control. You know, so sometimes when you have a food allergy, your immune system, your IgE, just becomes completely out of control, 1 2:05 completely, you know, where I say, the, her idea, the IgE's best solution to protect you and save you is to kill you. 10 2:14 Yeah. 9 2:15 Yeah. 2 2:17 Yeah, so, yeah, allergies can, are usually manifested fairly immediately. You'll, you can present as a skin rash and some redness all the way to something that's life-threatening, anaphylaxis. Right. 1 2:31 And that tends to be progressive. 4 2:32 Right. 1 2:32 Sometimes the first time you're exposed to something that activates IgE, maybe you get a small rash, maybe you don't feel so well. But as you continue to get exposed to that allergen, that protein triggers a stronger response from that IgE to the point that anaphylaxis, now, but sometimes anaphylaxis can show up immediately. 2 2:49 Right, yes. And it's mediated through IgE, which actually binds to the allergen and then connects with a cell called the mast cell. And the mast cell releases histamine, other chemicals, and that tends to cause the rashes, then the cardiovascular changes, and even can compromise air the rashes, then the cardiovascular changes and even can compromise airway. 1 3:08 Right, okay. So now, so that's allergy, everyone knows allergy. Everyone knows peanut allergy. Again, it's that someone gets exposed to that, their throat swells, their tongue swells, they've got to do the EpiPen 1 3:19 and they got to get to the ER right away. And again, like you said, it tends to be rapid onset and very life-threatening. Sensitivity though is a little bit different in that it's rarely life-threatening. It tends to be a little slower onset. But let's talk a little bit about how that IgA can mediate that. 1 3:39 So here's the pop quiz. Where is IgA found? 2 3:43 Yeah, so IgA and IgG are the ones that tend to mediate food sensitivity. IgA tends to be in more mucosal surfaces, sinus cavity, vaginal mucosa, GI tract. And 80% of our lymph nodes are essentially in our GI tract, you know, in the lower portion of your small bowel. 2 4:05 And so, you know, they're kind of sampling what I say when I tell patients it's inflammation. So when these antibodies and immune cells are activated, they tend to cause more insidious type symptoms that aren't necessarily immediate, but can be delayed by hours, days, and it's sometimes real hard 8 4:26 to figure it out. 1 4:27 And that's one of the things we talk about is sometimes you could be sensitive to something, food for example. You know, you eat some broccoli on Tuesday, and you might not have a symptom until Thursday or Friday. Right. And so it's hard to track that back to say, oh, it was because of something that happened 1 4:44 to me days ago. And so that's why you mentioned the IGA, we find a lot of mucosal tissue, including our GI tract. That's why a lot of food sensitivities manifest with some sort of GI presentation. 7 4:58 That's correct, yeah. 1 4:59 So we'll talk about bloating and abdominal pain later on. So some of the key facts we talk about with food sensitivities, 20% of the world population have some sort of food sensitivity. In the United States, one in 13 children have some form of food sensitivity. 1 5:16 And in the last couple decades, the incidence has just gone up, right? So we're seeing more and more of these foods. Now, we might do a whole nother podcast about why that is, but the short answer is our food supply is just different. It's different today than it was 1 5:35 when our parents were young, and of course when their parents were younger. So the mass production of food, and the alterations of our crops have really fed into that. So let's touch a little bit about some of the most common food sensitivities or foods that cause either allergy or sensitivities. 2 5:57 Yeah, so you've got dairy, wheat, and everybody kind of classically talks about gluten and celiac disease, which is an enteropathy or inflammation, which is a type of food sensitivity. Soy, eggs, peanuts, tree nuts, those are the big ones that can cause sensitivities. Obviously any food can cause a sensitivity based on the reaction of your immune system, but those are the classic ones. 1 6:25 Yeah, and so we know that, again, I'll tell patients, go do a deep dive in your refrigerator. Look at all your sauces. Everything that's in the door of your refrigerator, finding dairy, wheat, gluten, soy, it's ubiquitous. 2 6:40 Yes, it's in everything, absolutely. And it's hard to avoid. And you've got flowers now that have higher gluten concentrations. So that's, as you mentioned before, the food supplies change, our gut biome has changed. All of that has mixed together to increase our food sensitivities and our reactions to the foods that we eat currently. 1 7:03 Yeah. And so one of the main strategies, obviously, with these food sensitivities is really just avoidance, right? Trying to either dramatically reduce or remove these irritants from your food supply. So we talk about keeping a food diary, and that goes back to what we talked about, that sometimes these things show up days later, you know, once you actually ingest them 1 7:25 or get exposed to them. So, but let's talk about some of the symptoms, right? There are some common symptoms that we see. Patients come see us in our practice and say, gosh, you know, I've got all these weird symptoms going on. So what do you think is the most common thing 1 7:40 that we see from patients? 2 7:41 Right, so food sensitivities present obviously in the gastrointestinal tract, so the simplest ones are a lot of bloating, sometimes you get constipation, diarrhea, abdominal cramping, but then you get some systemic symptoms too, such as fatigue, joint pain, and that's because your immune response, right, your immune system is in your GI tract. And these white blood cells are living in these lymph nodes and they're sampling this inflammation and then releasing chemokines and cytokines, 2 8:12 which can cause systemic symptoms as well. So you might get some joint pain with that, muscle aches, skin rashes, brain fog, migraine headaches, beyond the classic gastrointestinal symptoms. 1 8:27 I think some of those, so we'll see a lot of patients that come in, you know, gosh, and they say, man, every time I eat, every time I eat, within minutes of eating, I am uncomfortable. I have significant bloating. You know, there's always kind of the joke, you know, 1 8:44 at the family gatherings, the Christmas or Thanksgiving of wearing the spandex pants or the loose pants, but this is different than that. This is a daily battle that people have where they have very uncomfortable bloating. We saw a picture recently of someone, 1 8:59 of a young lady who within 20, 30 minutes of eating looks like she's six, seven, eight months pregnant. I mean, she just has that much and it's very painful. 4 9:07 Right. 2 9:08 And, you know, and we're going to talk about this in our other podcast, but there could be a subset of that called SIBO where you actually have bacteria that overgrows in your small bowel that can cause more immediate bloating. But the bloating related to this tends to be more delayed, but absolutely can be immediate as well. But we'll subset that out and talk about that 2 9:33 at a different time. SIBO standing for small intestinal bacterial overgrowth. 1 9:38 Yeah, that's a whole podcast. 2 9:40 Whole nother podcast, but definitely foods exacerbate that as well. 1 9:47 And so, again, one of the things we talk about is, is your gut killing you, right? Are you having a lot of GI symptoms from the foods that you're eating? They're disrupting your daily life. 2 9:59 You might come in with the term irritable bowel syndrome, right? What does that mean? I think that's kind of a basket term catch-all, a clinical diagnosis of, you know, chronicity, of bloating, sometimes alternating constipation, diarrhea, but how much of that could be just related to food sensitivities? Obviously, there's other pathologies that kind of merge under that umbrella of IBS, but we try to stay away from that term. 2 10:26 We understand that term, it's a clinical diagnosis, but we try to really find the root cause of that. This might be one of the root causes of irritable bowel syndrome. 1 10:36 And that's where, you know what, what we do when we look at things from a functional lens and we pull those together, a lot of these can be kind of vague symptoms and they don't always show up at the same time. You might have some nausea and maybe some diarrhea 1 10:48 and then next time you don't, you just have the joint pain. And so they kind of can be really vague and often patients have really good, reasonable explanation for them. You know, well, of course I'm fatigued. I'm busy at work. 1 11:00 I've got a lot of stress with some deadlines coming up, or I just moved, or fatigue, brain fog is another one. Well, maybe I'm just getting older, that's why I'm a little confused more often. And so pulling all of those symptoms together and looking at it from a wider lens helps us really get down to what are some of the issues. I talk a lot about skin and skin reactions, you know, whether that's acne or rosacea 1 11:27 or some sort of inflammatory response from just at the skin level. And we think, well, someone might come and see us go, I have a skin issue. No, you have a gut issue. 6 11:36 Right, right. 1 11:37 You have a gut issue. That's showing up as a skin problem. 2 11:41 But this is really more of a gut issue. Yeah, and one of the caveats is there's a lot of companies that do these tests, and we like to correlate this data clinically. There tends to be a lot of false positives in these food sensitivity panels, so how we manage that is once we kind of determine your level of reaction, we essentially will do elimination diet, and then usually six weeks or so, 2 12:12 six to eight weeks to get the inflammation down, and then we can do a reintroduction to verify the data. So just because you have a food sensitivity panel that's positive, is it true positive, right? 5 12:24 And Dr. Emick and positive, is it true positive, right? 2 12:25 And we're, Dr. Amick and I, we really want to, you know, you don't necessarily just treat labs, you treat patients. So we want to verify that data and just want to put that out there. There tends to be a lot of false positives with these tests, so you've got to be with 1 12:39 the right provider that understands that and then can help you verify that data. And on the flip side, we've seen kind of what I would call maybe some false negatives where patients don't understand what we talked about before was the IgE versus Ig. If you've had a, if you've gone to a dermatologist or an immunologist and you've had the skin prick test, most likely that is an IgE food allergy. 1 13:01 So some patients might say, well I had a food allergy test and it was negative. Well, it was negative for the IgE, the anaphylaxis, but did they really test the IgG, IgA, IgM? And then the other side of that is you and I get pretty fussy about the quality of testing and how the lab is actually testing. 1 13:20 We had one lab quite a while, when we first opened the practice, and they were using the crab, remember that? They were using the crab shell, right? As their source of sensitivity. Well, who eats the crab shell? 1 13:32 No one eats the crab shell. But it was cheap, it was easy to get to, and so we're like, well, you gotta be careful of what test you're choosing in the lab 2 13:40 and how they validate those tests. So there's a lot of disparity between those. And foods can have multiple different components. Like milk can have multiple different components of proteins in them, right? So how do you prepare that when you do your analysis? How well are you digesting it? Are you breaking it down to X amount of amino acids? 2 13:59 And so that changes the test, how you're actually preparing the sample. So, we take that all with a grain of salt, but it's a starting point, right? It gets us a rough idea, then you can do an elimination and then reintroduce that food one at a time and verify, oh, yes, I reintroduced, let's say, pineapple, and now I broke out in a rash and I felt more bloated. 2 14:23 And now your clinical symptoms correlate with the lab that validates the test, right? So you just, you know, you might get your food sensitivity panel back. You did it in the mail and say, oh my gosh, I'm allergic to all these foods or excuse me, 2 14:38 intolerant to all these foods. That's not necessarily true. You got to verify that. 1 14:43 And I think a lot of folks get intimidated when they hear elimination diet, because they'll say, gosh, well, what am I supposed to eat? I can't eat anything. And so helping folks understand which are the crossover sensitivities, 1 14:55 which are true allergies, true sensitivities, and then again, that whole process of going through, reintroducing some foods at some time, and then understanding what your tolerance level is for that 2 15:06 Can be really important and and we're gonna talk more about gluten sensitivity and and then celiac But you know, these antibody tests are all indirect. The gold standard is a duodenal biopsy So I just want to put that out there but we're gonna talk specifically about a type of sensitivity called gluten sensitivity or celiac and that once again that'll be another podcast. 1 15:28 Right, and then the other thing we can talk about another podcast, keying that up, would be histamine intolerance. Yes. What does that mean? And so a lot of folks suffer from that where we have to remind them that, listen, your body makes histamine naturally and there are some foods that just naturally 1 15:45 are high in histamine. So if you're either making too much histamine or you're ingesting too much histamine, you can definitely have some symptoms from that. So those are coming down later on in our podcast journey. So I think kind of recapping a lot of this, 1 16:03 the first things we talk about is food allergy and food sensitivity are different beasts. There are different body responses to them. One is true immunological, IgE mediated and could potentially be life-threatening. Sensitivities tend to be- 2 16:22 More insidious. 1 16:23 Yeah, more insidious, not necessarily life-threatening, but very life-disruptive. 4 16:27 Right. 1 16:28 Yeah, so timing and onset are issues. Allergies tend to be more rapid. Sensitivities tend to be more slower onset, like you said, insidious there. And then the type of reactions that we get. And then the plethora of symptoms. 1 16:44 Again, I think that the ones we see mostly are the abdominal pain, bloating, migraines, fatigue, skin rashes, brain fog, even kind of nasal congestion, like, oh, I just have some hay fever, some allergy. It could actually be a food sensitivity issue. So if any of that connects with you, if you feel like that might be something that has been kind of elusive to you, certainly reach out. 1 17:09 We're happy to help and see you for that and get you some testing and help you interpret that testing so that you can wrap your hands around your health. If any of those symptoms seem like things that you deal with on a regular basis, we want you to reach out. Our office can help get you scheduled. We can work through that allergy testing and sensitivity testing and really help educate 1 17:35 you about what's going on inside your body. Because remember, we want to return to when medicine actually made you better. And a big part of that is helping you understand how your body works. 3 17:50 The information provided in this podcast is for educational and information purposes only, and is not intended as medical advice. The content is not a substitute for professional medical care, diagnosis, or treatment. Always seek the advice of a qualified healthcare provider with any questions you may have regarding a medical condition. If you would like more detailed information, please contact Dr. Amick or Dr. Pablo at Integrative Medicine through their website at Amick or Dr. Pablo at Integrative Medicine through their website at IntegrativeMLA.com Rate your transcript:

7. 

   17 Apr 2025

   Four Point Hormone Panel

   Show Description In this episode of Foundations and Functions, Dr. C.J. Pabla and Dr. Jason Amich dive into the groundbreaking Four Point Hormone Panel—a tool they've developed to bring clarity and insight to women struggling with unexplained hormonal symptoms. Drawing from personal experiences and years of clinical practice, the doctors explain how traditional hormone testing often fails to account for the natural fluctuations in female physiology. By testing key hormones four times throughout the menstrual cycle, they’re able to map a more accurate picture of what's really happening in the body—and finally validate what so many women have been told to ignore: "Everything's normal" doesn't always mean everything's okay. Dr. Amich and Dr. Pabla break down the science behind the panel and share how it's transforming the way they help patients address symptoms like anxiety, depression, infertility, and fatigue. From hormone behavior to root causes like thyroid dysfunction, PCOS, and even environmental toxins, this episode is packed with eye-opening insights into how functional medicine can restore balance and well-being. Whether you’ve been dismissed by traditional care or you’re simply curious about a deeper approach to hormonal health, this episode will help you ask better questions—and understand your body like never before. Disclaimer: The information provided in this podcast is for educational and informational purposes only and is not intended as medical advice. The content is not a substitute for professional medical care, diagnosis, or treatment. Always seek the advice of a qualified healthcare provider with any questions you may have regarding a medical condition. If you would like more detailed medical information, please contact Integrative Medicine through their website at https://integrativemla.com/ Show Transcription 3 0:00 Welcome to Foundations and Functions weekly podcast, where we return to when medicine actually made you better. Now here's Dr. Jason Amick and Dr. C.J. 6 0:14 Pabla. 2 0:16 This is Dr. C.J. Pabla with Dr. Jason Amick. Welcome to our Foundations and Functions podcast. Today we're going to be talking about the Four Point Hormone Panel and kind of like why we decided to do the Four Point Hormone Panel. So I'm going to pass it on to my partner, Dr. Amick. Why don't you tell us kind of how you came up with this concept and how it really has 2 0:40 helped our patients? 1 0:41 Dr. Amick Morse Yeah, thanks so much. So, you know, one of the things that I say pretty frequently is, you know, I'm a girl dad, and constantly in my life, you know, I've been faced with situations, you know, with my daughters and my wife, and I just think, wow, dudes don't put up with that. 1 0:58 You know, a dude would never go through that the way you guys do that. And so, you know, in seeing a lot of our patients, female patients who come in really frustrated, and they hear kind of the same thing, like, well, you know, I haven't felt well, I haven't felt well, and my doctor just tells me everything is normal. My labs are normal, my hormones are normal, but I don't feel well. And you know, I kind of thought about that for a while, and it occurred to me, biologically, dudes 1 1:30 are dumb. I mean, from a biological perspective, our hormones are really pretty basic. You're 10 years old, you're 12 years old, boom, you hit puberty, your testosterone spikes, kind of hangs out there. Yeah, maybe in your late 30s and 40s, your testosterone may waver a little bit, 1 1:47 but female physiology, their hormones change daily. Daily, and it's a cycle that they go through every single month. And so, one of the things that I thought of was, what does normal mean when you talk about an estrogen level? So we know the range of estrogen can be, depending on where you are in your cycle, 4 to 400, 1 2:14 generally speaking. And that's a huge range. And so I applied that and I thought, well, gosh, 71 is normal. But is it always 71? Is 71 the highest that you get? Is 71 the lowest that you get? 1 2:32 And so, yeah, I mean, it would be great to, as scientists and as nerds that we are, to get as many data points as possible. But it's really hard to get people to come in and get blood drawn every day for 28, 32 days. 5 2:46 Right. 1 2:47 So really we work with our lab. We've got a great relationship with our lab that keeps a lot of costs down for patients who pay out of pocket. And so we're able to actually put together this panel that includes an estrogen level, progesterone level, luteinizing hormone, follicle stimulating hormone, prolactin, and testosterone. 1 3:07 And we can actually sample that on a patient four different times during their menstrual cycle for really low cost. And what that does for us is it allows us to graph that. Now it took me some time. I had to go back and remember my Excel and logarithmic functions to put all that on a graph. But really, it was eye-opening. 1 3:28 I remember when you and I first looked through that graph and went, wow, this is kind of out of a textbook. We know how the hormones are supposed to fluctuate throughout the different – the luteal phase, for example. We know kind of where estrogen should be in relation to progesterone. And so we've been able to take that graph and really give patients a lot of data and 1 3:53 help them make it make sense. And so there are patients that we've definitely sat across from and said, you know what, right, all of your lab values are within the normal range. But the behavior of these hormones are not normal. And so, validating that, I think, means a lot to a lot of patients that say, you know what, you're right, you don't feel well. 1 4:14 You're not crazy. There's nothing wrong with you. You're not broken. You just have some physiology that's off and that manifests in emotions, anxiety, depression, sometimes infertility even. And so using that data set and what we know about physiology helps us really paint the picture for our patients and put them on the right track, know what questions to 1 4:39 ask. And then sometimes that means going back to their OBGYN or going back to their primary care doctor and saying, hey, here's this graph. And I know in my experience, most of those providers have never seen a graph like that. 4 4:52 Yeah. 1 4:53 The current insurance model just would never allow a primary care doctor using insurance to order the same five or six labs four times in a month. Right. You know, and cover those costs. to order the same five or six labs four times in a month, you know, and cover those costs. So we're able to do that, and because of that, we can provide a lot of insight into, you know, what's happening with someone's hormones. 1 5:17 And so from there, you know, some of those patients may choose to see us from a functional medicine perspective, right, where, you know, they see you, and we start kind of digging down that root cause path of why is that? choose to see us from a functional medicine perspective, right, where they see you and we start kind of digging down that root cause path of why is that? Why is your progesterone flat? 1 5:31 So that may indicate you're not ovulating. Well, why would that be? So then we can kind of talk about some of the reasons that someone may have hormone 2 5:43 dysfunction. Dr. Darrell Bock Yeah, polycystic ovarian syndrome. You could have thyroid dysfunction. So those can affect high androgens. Elevated prolactin can suppress ovulation. So there's several root causes that we can look up and kind of try to determine, like, why are you not ovulating? 2 6:04 And you know, how many times have you had people come in and said, well, I have my hormones checked and I'm like, okay, where were you in your cycle? Like, I don't know. And I said, well, then this data makes no sense because your hormones change so much throughout your cycle. And so I think just helping women know that there's not a linear response to your hormones throughout all 28 days. They change. 2 6:25 And I think that's kind of like their aha moment. They're like, oh, okay, now that makes sense to me. And then that's why we're looking at four data points so we can follow this curve. So yeah, I think the four-point panel has really helped a lot of our women kind of understand what's going on throughout their cycle and their responses to their hormones. 1 6:45 Darrell Bock And then we take that lens and we broaden that lens because, again, we go back to where do some of these hormones come from? What are the foundations of these hormones? And so, again, we go in and we look at gut health. We look at toxin load. We look at chronic viral infections. 1 7:01 And we really kind of figure out, oh, it may not be PCOS, it may not be a thyroid, it may be something going on with your environment. It could be a heavy metal toxicity, it could, mold exposure, we talk about that a lot. A lot of these things can affect your physiology in lots of different ways. 1 7:19 So that's kind of where we started down the path with these four-point hormone panels. And man, it's one of my favorite things to do with patients and helping them really gather good quality data that really helps explain their physiology. So if you are someone who thinks, gosh, I just don't feel well, I want to get my hormones checked, the questions to ask are are what hormones are you getting checked? 1 7:46 When are you getting them checked? Maybe a good option would be to come to our office and let's do a four-point hormone panel and just take a look at how your hormones are behaving, not necessarily what their level is because one of the things I explain to people too, it seems like no one really kind of knows what a normal estrogen level should be. That's going to be different person to person. 1 8:08 So it's about the behavior though. So hopefully that helped make it make sense. And thanks for listening today to our Foundations and Functions podcast with Dr. Pabla and Dr. 3 8:21 Amy. The information provided in this podcast is for educational and information purposes only and is not intended as medical advice. The content is not a substitute for professional medical care, diagnosis, or treatment. Always seek the advice of a qualified healthcare provider 3 8:38 with any questions you may have regarding a medical condition. If you would like more detailed information, please contact Dr. Amick or Dr. Pabla at Integrative Medicine through their website at please contact Dr. Amick or Dr. Pabla at Integrative Medicine through their website at integrativemla.com

8. 

   17 Apr 2025

   Understanding Foundations & Functions

   Show Description Foundations and Functions is a weekly podcast hosted by Dr. C.J. Pabla and Dr. Jason Amich that challenges the current medical model by returning to the core of what medicine was meant to do—make people better. Drawing from their extensive experience in emergency medicine, critical care, and integrative health, Dr. Pabla and Dr. Amich dig into the foundational principles of human physiology and the root causes of chronic illness. Whether it's unraveling the mystery behind hypertension, uncovering hidden mold toxicity, or connecting seemingly unrelated symptoms to gut health, each episode offers insightful, real-world discussions grounded in science and practical clinical experience. Designed for patients who feel unheard or stuck in a system of short visits and fragmented care, the podcast is a deep dive into personalized medicine that values time, thoroughness, and education. Dr. Pabla and Dr. Amich believe true healing happens when we make sense of the body's signals, ask the right questions, and have the freedom to connect the dots. Through compelling cases and thoughtful analysis, Foundations and Functions offers hope, understanding, and a roadmap for anyone looking to reclaim their health by addressing what truly matters at the root. Disclaimer: The information provided in this podcast is for educational and informational purposes only and is not intended as medical advice. The content is not a substitute for professional medical care, diagnosis, or treatment. Always seek the advice of a qualified healthcare provider with any questions you may have regarding a medical condition. If you would like more detailed medical information, please contact Integrative Medicine through their website at https://integrativemla.com/ Show transcription: 3 0:00 Welcome to Foundations and Functions weekly podcast, where we return to when medicine actually made you better. Now, here's Dr. Jason Amick and Dr. C.J. 8 0:14 Pabla. 2 0:16 Welcome to Foundations and Functions with Dr. C.J. Pabla and Dr. Jason Amick. Dr. Pabla, why the name, foundations and functions? 1 0:25 Well, kind of like the foundation of a house, right? It starts from the ground up. The foundation is not strong, the house is not strong. So just like in science, foundational things like the structure of a protein, you change the structure, its function changes, right? So that's kind of what we wanted to get through in the podcast is, these are very important concepts, and we want to kind of weave this concept through all of our podcasts. 2 0:57 Darrell Bock And it speaks a little bit to how we think and talk every day in terms of, you know, patient conditions, patient issues, is, you know, we understand that the foundation of homeostasis and the normal physiology people are supposed to have. And so getting back to, you know, fundamental foundational clinical science, clinical medicine, and understanding how what we do every day affects the function of our body. 2 1:25 So when you have symptoms, it's letting you know that there's something off with maybe the function. And so we can tie that into the foundations. What are the root causes? What are the basic principles of physiology that we can apply to help people get better? 2 1:43 And so, one of the goals that we have, and we always say is do we want to 1 1:50 return to when medicine made you feel better. 2 1:53 So talk, tell me about that. Talk about that. What does that mean to you when you when you 1 1:57 say we want to return to when medicine made you better? You know, when somebody presents to our office, instead of just kind of looking at, you know, the basic symptoms and consider maybe, you know, medicine for short term, which initially may help stabilize symptoms, we want to kind of work upstream, right? We want to get to that root cause. For example, if you come in for hypertension, maybe you need an antihypertensive medicine to stabilize that. 1 2:25 But what are the reversible causes of hypertension? Sleep apnea, hypercortisol, multiple other things that we can look at. So obviously addressing weight, lifestyle, caffeine toxicity, right? So foundational stuff is really working upstream and really trying to address those root causes. And I think this is one thing that, you know, I think we do well in our practice. We spend enough time. And I think that's the key is really spending that time 1 2:57 with a patient unraveling the mystery. 2 2:59 Yeah. And I think we both have a lot of experience in medicine, in emergency medicine, critical care, hospital administration. And I think some of this, for me, helps remind us that the American health system that we currently have really doesn't do a great job of actually healing people. It used to be, used to be focused on that quite a bit and I think now when we look at all the statistics and data, despite the fact that we spend a tremendous amount 2 3:33 of money on healthcare compared to any other first world country, we have some of the worst outcomes, infant mortality, maternal mortality, diabetes, obesity, heart disease, all these things. And no doubt, we do a phenomenal job with acute care, trauma, strokes, heart attacks, best in the world hands down. But actually making people better or what do you always say about type 2 diabetes? The best way to treat type 2 diabetes is? 1 4:04 Dr. Darrell Bock's don't get it. 2 4:05 Don't get type 2 diabetes. So we can get to that level of returning to when medicine focused on, not necessarily just even preventative care, but avoidance care. How do we keep you from getting a disease anyway? So with that in mind, let's talk a little bit about who our target audience is. 2 4:29 When we do this podcast, because we talk a lot amongst ourselves, and we do a tremendous amount of education with our patients, what's something that you could point to to say, look, this is who we want to reach? 1 4:41 This is our target audience. Well, I mean, I think that's a broad range. I mean, men and women, you know, children. I think, you know, our target audience is people that might have had chronic issues that aren't being addressed necessarily. Not just, you know, talking about preventative care, but, you know, maybe they've gone to multiple providers and they have this mysterious illness, and, you know, the 15-minute to 20-minute medical model isn't working because they have multiple symptoms and no one's connecting the dots, you know. 1 5:17 They might see a different specialist for each one of these symptoms or each one of these disease processes, and no one, unfortunately, is connecting the dots. And that's kind of like what we see. So you know, obviously, we do do acute care medicine, we do some urgent care in the office, and we love doing that. 1 5:34 But really addressing those people that have gone to multiple different providers, and you know, haven't really, no one's really addressed their root cause. I guess that's kind of the general audience we really appeal to quite a bit. 2 5:49 Yeah, and I think two things that come to mind. One of those patients that come in, like I've had, for example, high blood pressure for the last 15 years. I'm about to start my fourth blood pressure medicine, but no one can help me figure out why I have this 2 6:04 or what I need this for. And then I think the other side of it that sets us apart is that audience, you know, that patient, that medical consumer. You know, like you said, you know, 9 to 11, 9 to 15 minutes, that's the average time that you spend face-to-face with a provider in the United States. 2 6:20 And you know, one of the things you always say is you can't solve complex problems, you know, in 10, 15 minutes. Dr. John Alder Reid Right. Dr. John Alder Reid You need more time to really dig into that. And so I think, you know, this will be a whole other podcast someday, but from a, you know, even an insurance model, you know, I think the fact that is looking at that, you know, they're paying out of pocket and going, what am I getting for this? What did I just pay for in that office visit? 2 6:50 So I think that's a big chunk of drive for patients who come see us because they want their questions heard, they want answers, and they want to feel like that there was a value in this visit that they just had with us. 1 7:06 So, right. Well, I think the other big thing is we limit the complexity by seeing, you know, much less patients and knowing them in depth, you know, getting all their data, reviewing their data well before seeing the patient and not, you know, having to see 30 to 40 patients a day, which is driven by unfortunately insurance issues. And so we have the freedom to really spend that time. 1 7:31 And I think that's where the, a lot of our patients get resolution of their symptoms because we finally connect the dots. And you know, that can take an hour. That can take two hours, you know what I mean? 7 7:45 Dr. Darrell Bock Yeah. 1 7:45 Dr. Robert Pulsner But I don't think, no matter how intelligent of a physician you are, I don't think 15 minutes is going to solve that problem. 2 7:52 Dr. Darrell Bock Yeah. And I think one of the things that sets us apart is this concept that we carry around with making it make sense. Even today, we had a patient that we were just spitballing about, like this is their lab value, doesn't seem to make sense with their symptoms, so where else should we be looking? What else can we be doing to help them? And just kind of throwing out a neurological basis, 2 8:18 an endocrine basis, what are all the possible reasons that this person could be having the symptoms, but at the end of the day, how do we help the patient understand the symptoms they're having, why they're having them, and what the next best steps are for them? So yeah, we definitely spend a lot of time with patients. Education is very key for us because again, we just love treating every patient like a 2 8:39 research case. 6 8:40 Yeah. 1 8:41 Yeah. You know, and then also having access to, you know, other biotech companies that can really help us dig into the mystery. Like sometimes the mystery is you have multiple symptoms and no one bothered asking the patient, oh, by the way, do you have water damage in your home? Oh, by the way, do you have mold in your home? 1 9:00 You know, mold toxicity is one of those mysterious illnesses that can cause multiple symptoms. And so really then helping not only educate the patient, but then demonstrating to the patient, yes, you have mycotoxins because we've done the appropriate test. So I think that's the other thing that we figured out over the years in our practices, who's our go-to to help us figure out some of these mysteries. And I think that takes time to find the companies that are going to give you valid information 1 9:30 so you can share that with the patients. And that's important, not only to help the patient, but then they can actually see, oh yes, my mycotoxins are very elevated. And yes, this correlates, maybe not not causation but correlates and is 2 9:46 resulting in some of your symptoms. And digging through those symptoms you know you know near and dear to my heart is gut health and and gut dysbiosis and so one of things I share with patients is sometimes you have these 12, 15, 17 random symptoms that don't I call them just white noise and you know if we can tie that back to your gut health we can get your gut healthy, sometimes we can reduce those symptoms or even eliminate those symptoms completely. 2 10:11 Now what's left are the two or three symptoms that are really at the heart of your discomfort and issue. 5 10:18 So... 1 10:19 Yeah. I use the term dust settles a lot with the patients. I said, you know, you're coming in pretty ill, multiple symptoms. Let's walk you, you know, to 30 to 40 percent better. See what symptoms peel away because, A, you know, we address your gut issues first, and then, you know, when these symptoms go away, then we can follow the other symptoms, you 1 10:40 know. So we're really big on looking at that. Patients can be overwhelmed. Well, how am I going to get better when I have 20 different symptoms? Well, that's for us to try to focus on those core symptoms first and address that core issue first. And then, you know, they come back a couple months and they feel really great and they say, but I still have insomnia and I still might have some fatigue, but hey, these are gone now. Okay, well, now we have another subset of core symptoms that we're going to look at 1 11:06 to address those issues. 4 11:07 Dr. Darrell Bock Yeah. 2 11:08 So I think it's a great introduction, and hopefully we've given you a little bit of insight of how we think we can get better medicine through foundations and functions. So ultimately, again, we just want to return to when medicine made you better. Thanks for spending time with us today. Thanks for listening to our podcast. There are going to be a lot more coming. And so please stay tuned. And we'll talk to you soon. 3 11:36 The information provided in this podcast is for educational and information purposes only and is not intended as medical advice. The content is not a substitute for professional medical care, diagnosis, or treatment. Always seek the advice of a qualified health care provider with any questions you may have regarding a medical condition. If you would like more detailed information, 3 11:58 please contact Dr. Amick or Dr. Pabla at Integrative Medicine through their website at Integrative Medicine through their website at integrativemla.com.

9. 

   3 Apr 2025

   A Personalized Approach With Rachel Phillips

   Patient Coordinator Rachel Phillips gives an overview of the personalized approach to discovering the root cause of illnesses. We use an integrated clinical approach to combine functional and traditional medicine to go further and identify the root cause of our patients’ problems. Functional medicine addresses the full range of physical, emotional, mental, social, spiritual and environmental factors that influence a person’s health. We often see clients with chronic issues who haven’t been getting better with traditional treatments. Unique to Integrative Medicine, Laser and Aesthetics in Carmel, our providers will create individualized whole body health, 360-degree plans based on genetic testing, functional/integrative lab assessments, nutrient deficiency testing and your patient history. Often we spend over two hours with you during your initial visit, asking questions and actively listening. Here is what you can expect as a new patient: Patient schedules an initial appointment and completes preliminary questionnaires. Our doctors review and research your history and records prior to meeting you. On your first visit, you will have a full exam with Dr. Pabla and further discuss concerns. You receive a custom action plan and review it with Dr. Amich to implement. We continue to meet every 2 months to treat the root cause of your medical conditions. Learn more about our approach Integrativemla.com/ Disclaimer: The information provided in this podcast is for educational and informational purposes only and is not intended as medical advice. The content is not a substitute for professional medical care, diagnosis, or treatment. Always seek the advice of a qualified healthcare provider with any questions you may have regarding a medical condition. If you would like more detailed medical information, please contact Integrative Medicine through their website at https://integrativemla.com/ Show Transcript Welcome to Better Medicine, a return to when medicine made you feel better. Now, here's patient coordinator, Rachel Phillips. Welcome to Better Medicine, where we return to when medicine actually made you better. We are looking to deep dive into the root cause of health issues and explore how our personalized approach can help you achieve better health. I'm your host, Rachel, and today we're going to talk about something that affects so many people but is often misunderstood. It's the connection between gut health, hormones, and your overall well-being. Have you ever wondered why you don't feel quite like yourself? Why no matter what you do, your health issues just aren't improving? Well, there's a good chance you might be missing a key piece of the puzzle, and that's where we come in. At Integrative Medicine, Laser, and Aesthetics, our doctors specialize in root cause analysis, a way of looking at your health that focuses on identifying and addressing the underlining factors contributing to your symptoms, not just masking them. It's a powerful way to get to the bottom of what's truly going on inside your body. Let me introduce you to Dr. Amick and Dr. Pablo, our top specialists who are transforming the way we look at health. Dr. Amick is an expert in gut health and hormone balancement. You may not know this, but your gut health and your hormones are connected. Issues like bloating, digestion discomfort, fatigued, or even skin problem could be linked to imbalances in your gut and your hormones. Dr. Emick is dedicated to helping you understand and treat these underlying causes, leading to a healthier and more vibrant you. And then there's Dr. Pabla. When you see Dr. Pabla, he doesn't rush through your appointment. He takes his time, sometimes up to two hours long. He studies your symptoms, understanding your health history, and gets to the root cause of your health issues. Whether you're dealing with fatigued, persistent pain, or unexplained weight gain or loss, Dr. Pabla is committed to digging deeper to figure out what's really going on in your body. And if future testing is needed, he will order any diagnostic testing or screening to ensure nothing is overlooked. Did you know that we offer a full functional medicine blood panel right here in our office? Right after your visit with the doctor, you can get it done. That's right! No need to go to an outside lab anymore. Everything is handled in-house, making it quicker and easier to get the answers that you need. If you're a woman struggling with hormonal imbalances, you'll be especially interested in what we offer. Our 4-point, 6-point, and 8-point hormone panels are designed to help uncover issues with everything from infertility to your monthly cycle. If your hormones are out of balance, you may be experiencing fatigued, mood swings, weight changes, or even difficulty getting pregnant. Our comprehensive hormone panel gives us valuable insight into what's really happening and helps us develop a personalized treatment plan just for you. We believe that health is more than just treating the symptoms. It's about understanding the entire picture. We are the top practice here in Indiana that can order specialty testing to find food sensitivity, mycotoxin testing. So how does the process work? Well, it's easier than ever to get started. Here's how to connect with us. Just give us a call or schedule online. Our friendly front desk team is here to assist you. We are here to help you find the best time that works for you. Once your appointment is scheduled, you'll receive an email with all the important details about your visit. This includes any preparation you might need and a link to sign up for our online patient portal. Did you know that once you set up the patient portal, you can send us lab panels, medical records, or any other important information you'd like Dr. Pabla and Dr. Amick to review? It's a great way to save time and ensure that your doctor has all the information that he needs before your appointment for your best care. We believe putting our patients first, and that means ensuring your experience is as smooth as possible. By using our online patient portal, you'll help us create a more personalized and effective care plan that is tailored to your needs. Whether you're dealing with chronic conditions, want to improve your overall well-being, or you just want to explore a more natural approach to health, Dr. Pabla and Dr. Amick is here to guide you every step of the way. Their extensive experience at Integrative Medicine allows them to combine traditional treatments with advanced therapies, giving you the best of both worlds. So what are you waiting for? Take the first step towards a healthier, more balanced life today. Call us now or go online to schedule your appointment with Dr. Pabla or Dr. Amey, our top leading doctors at Integrative Medicine, Laser, Laser Anesthetics. Thanks for listening. My name is Rachel top leading doctors at Integrative Medicine, Laser, Laser Anesthetics. Thanks for listening. My name is Rachel and this is Better Medicine.

10. 

    2 Apr 2025

    Meet Dr. CJ Pabla & Dr. Jason Amich

    When looking for answers to your health problems, it can feel as if you’re on your own. Your health and happiness are our top priorities. We’re here to help you identify the source of your problems and get you back on track to feeling healthier and happier. Functional medicine, IV infusions, and functional aesthetics are just some of the methods we utilize to get to the bottom of your health issues and help you get back to feeling your best. Whether you live in Carmel, Zionsville, Indianapolis, or the surrounding areas, we are here to help. Disclaimer: The information provided in this podcast is for educational and informational purposes only and is not intended as medical advice. The content is not a substitute for professional medical care, diagnosis, or treatment. Always seek the advice of a qualified healthcare provider with any questions you may have regarding a medical condition. If you would like more detailed medical information, please contact Integrative Medicine through their website at https://integrativemla.com/ Show Transcript Welcome to Better Medicine, a return to when medicine made you feel better. Now, here's Dr. Jason Amick and Dr. CJ Pabla. Hello, this is Dr. CJ Pabla. This is Dr. Jason Amick. Welcome to Better Medicine. This is our first podcast. We're excited to do this, to start this endeavor, to share kind of our thoughts, our philosophy, and a lot about our practice, and to talk about things that are relevant and important to people every day. So one of our big philosophies at our practice is returning to when medicine actually made you better. And that has so much to do with our integrative approach to medicine and healthcare in general. So, Dr. Pawa, tell us a little bit about why you started the practice, how you developed functional integrative medicine mindset. I practiced emergency medicine for 18 years and this is where Dr. Amick and I kind of connected, but, uh, we'd see a lot of chronic stuff in the emergency department. Not necessarily acute stuff. Uh, women that had gut problems, multiple CT scans, and, uh, no one can really find what's wrong. We could tell them what it's not, but what was it? Right. So I started thinking about like, why are so many chronic stuff in this country just handled with just medication. So that was kind of the philosophy, could we work upstream and find root causes to these problems if we dug a little bit deeper. So that's kind of the philosophy behind that practice. We're not anti-medicine. I think medicines are great for stabilizing symptoms and getting people kind of stabilized, but you know, we kind of look at it as a band-aid. And then, you know, what can we do to work upstream? So that's kind of my philosophy and Dr. Amick's philosophy, and we know the gut is linked to many things. Dr. Amick can kind of speak about that, but so that's kind of why I decided to get out of emergency medicine and deal more on the chronic side and look at more root causes for patients. I think we both had some personal experiences we can talk about, but I you know, I can remember a long time ago we work in the ER. We would have patients come in with sometimes pages, two, three pages of medicines. I can remember even back then kind of thinking to myself that, gosh, you would think that if medicine solved problems, the more medicines you were on, the healthier you would be. And it was never the case. The more medicines they were on, the worse off they were. So I know early on, we started kind of questioning our training and the standard medical model, you know, 20 years ago, kind of going, nah, does this really kind of make sense? And so, you know, from my perspective, you know, I kind of stumbled into integrated functional medicine just through, you know, lots of different experiences that I had, including some hospital administration roles and really getting to see what happens behind the scenes, you know, how the insurance model affects healthcare, how it drives clinical decisions in healthcare organizations, looking at different types of healthcare models, you know, from emergency medicine care, under MTALA and all those things, all the way to cardiac and cardiovascular care, you know, acutely and chronically, you know, in those two areas, I would say in a lot of areas, the United States, we surpass every other country with our acute care model when it comes to trauma, cardiovascular, you know, heart attacks, strokes, you know, when, when an insult occurs to people, we, we are bar none the top of the world in managing those. Yeah. But when it comes to preventing those things, we really, it's sad and embarrassing how terrible we really rank against other countries, even some of the countries that aren't necessarily considered first world countries. So, from that perspective, I kind of, you know, really took into account, okay, so what else is out there? And that's kind of why I stumbled into functional medicine, integrated medicine, and really understood, going into it, that this is an approach where you start with basic physiology, basic biochemistry. Like, how do we actually make people better? You and I talk a lot about the systems biology approach, right, the whole body is connected. So you don't have a liver problem, you've got a body problem that manifesting in the liver, that sort of thing. So that was kind of my experience. And then also understanding the healthcare model today, I think as a lot of people are acutely aware, isn't really about making you bad at it. So that's kind of where I came from. And I think you had some personal first-hand experience maybe with some back injury or back pain. And so tell us about that a little bit. Yeah, so, you know, like Dr. Amick said, chronic care, we basically manage symptoms and do we actually get patients better? You know, I snowboarded for many years and was having a lot of chronic low back pain and, you know, went the traditional medicine route, did an MRI, which is important to look for structural issues, saw a back surgeon and really wasn't getting any better until I saw a doctor that did myofascial release and that made a world of difference. So you know, getting that done, getting look at muscles that were inactivated, that weren't functioning right, made a big difference in my pain management and I was able to get back into working out and being healthy. So, you know, besides my personal journey, you know, I realized that, you know, what can we do to affect change? And, you know, as a physician, I really didn't know a lot about nutrition, right? So, you know, you study a little bit of it in medical school and I realized that the countries that do it well, the core is changing the way you eat, you know, eating not only so what does it mean to eat healthy and we can get into that down the road but you know, eating not only, so what does it mean to eat healthy and we can get into that down the road, but you know, really eating whole foods and avoiding foods that tend to be inflammatory and you know, and it's harder and harder to eat healthy. And so, that's kind of our take on it, you know, really establishing a core of, you know, good foods, some proper supplementation, and then really focusing on gut health. Yeah, and you know, I've said for a long time, I continue to say, and I think the two worst things we say in medicine and healthcare is, eat better and exercise. Yeah. Because no one really knows what any of that means. Right. And so, we have to take a really broad look at, what does it mean to eat better. Well, it's not just, you know, removing processed food and things that are bad for you, but it's also understanding how your body reacts to the foods you are putting in your mouth. Because again, from a systems biology approach, I mean, every single organism on this planet, and you can take a good hour and watch some really good TV programs about nature, and what you learn from just watching, whether it's a butterfly or a snail or a Capuchin monkey or whatever, you know, they're intimately tied to their environment and what they eat How they eat and what's available to them and that's something that you know from a biological perspective. We've gotten away from yeah and so there's absolutely a recourse when you're eating processed foods and chemicals and things that just aren't natural to your biology, and that has some long-term effects. So we see a lot of things in our practice, and we manage a lot of that, not just, you know, from a food and nutrition perspective, but a lot of chronic diseases. We talk a lot in here about inflammation, inflammatory processes. We do a lot of disease management for patients. And I think one of the things that sets us apart from a lot of other practices is our deep understanding of the physiology, but also our ability to explain physiology to our patients and educate them. Yeah. And you know, emergency medicine gives you a broad perspective on a lot of different pathology because, you know, as a ER doctor, you might see trauma in one room and then you got a heart attack in another room and you got ortho in another room so it gives us a broad perspective and also in graduate school I studied a lot of physiology and biochemistry and really I think the battle is won when you look at the cellular level you know how does toxins how does inflammation affect the cellular level? And, you know, we spend a lot of time on Dr. Emick on whiteboards, kind of nerding out and, you know, drawing formulas and looking at organic molecules and looking at different pathways that are interrupted by inflammation or interrupted by, you know, toxins in our environment. And so, I think, you know, this is not just some pseudoscience. This is actually science at its best, I believe, where you really have to understand the pathways. For example, B vitamins, I mean, what are they? Well, they're cofactors. They make enzymes more efficient. Minerals, they make enzymes more efficient. So, when people tend to say, well, vitamins and minerals,, do they really impact you? Well, reactions in the body slow down when you don't have the cofactors. And a slowed down reaction could develop symptoms, which ultimately could develop disease. So, you know, I think that's kind of our philosophy. We really like to research our patients and impart change. And this is where the philosophy comes in, is working upstream, looking at root causes. You know, you come in with hypertension. Has anybody looked at sleep apnea? Has anybody looked at other secondary reversible causes? And we try to do that. So we're not just gonna stop your antihypertensive because that would be not healthy. But if we can impart change and do the other things, then maybe we can wean you off the antihypertensive. Yeah. So, you know, returning to basic fundamental physiology and biochemistry. Returning to basic physiology and biochemistry means, you know, not being afraid to revert back to the basics, you know, and again, we keep saying, we tell people, we're not anti-medicine, but, you know, understanding things like vitamin D and what does vitamin D do to your body and all the things, remember, vitamin D can be, it can act like an enzyme, it can act like a hormone, it should act like a vitamin, it's kind of a multiplayer. And so a lot of times when we see patients that have issues, we want to know, hey, what's your vitamin D? No one has ever checked their vitamin D level, right? They're on a bunch of different medicines or gels or creams or shots for this, that, or the other, and we look and their vitamin D is in the tank. And so, you know, we say, gosh, if we fix those things, maybe you don't need to be on five medicines, Right. Um, you know, maybe you just need one, one low dose daily medicine that is actually helpful to you. Right. Uh, because remember the, the rule of polypharmacy, once you get above three medicines, I think everything else is interacting with each other and causing more problems. So, uh, again, I think that's where we really latch on the idea of getting back to when medicine and not just medicine pills, but medicine care, medicine health, actually makes you better and gives you a longer health life. Exactly. How long do you live well? That's what we're trying to shoot for, improving your quality of life. Going back to the vitamin D, low vitamin D can cause mood disorders. So you're on antidepressant, but maybe once we correct your vitamin D, you could get off the antidepressant or the antidepressant becomes more effective. I think a lot of people in the end can relate to that because everyone realizes they feel better about July, August, when the sun is out and they're happy, they're outside, they're feeling better. But just not understanding how that, that, that vitamin D actually plays a big part of all year long throughout our whole healthcare. Yeah. So, I mean, that's kind of our philosophy is, you know, really digging in and really trying to find root causes to help you. So this was kind of our beginning podcast. It's going to be a little clunky. So thanks for sticking in there with us and being patient. We're going to perfect our sound and our mode as best we can, but really, we just want to share who we are and what we do, and if that is helpful to anyone, that's God's work, and it's really what we're about. So thanks for listening. There's going to be so much more coming over the next few weeks and months, and we look forward to doing this for a long time. Yeah, absolutely. And don't hesitate to reach out to us and say, hey, can you talk about vitamin D metabolism? Can you talk about gut health? And we're more than happy to look out there. And what are people searching? What are people interested in, and we're more than happy to talk on that subject matter. All right. So, again, thanks so much for spending time with us today, giving us your time and your attention for better health. attention for better health. So, thanks again, and we'll sign off.

Reach and audience

Public platform figures. Ratings count people who left a rating, not total listeners.

Apple Podcasts (US)

5.0 / 5

7 ratings

Spotify

5.0 / 5

3 ratings

Podcast Authority Score: 18 / 100

A composite of feed quality, social presence, YouTube performance and engagement. Read the methodology.

Quality

23

Social presence

0

YouTube

0

Engagement

32