Halls of Power

About Halls of Power

Brought to you by Legislata, in this newsletter and podcast we bring you stories, tips, and tricks for a career in the political world. We trade hot takes for advice on how to navigate one of the most difficult industries to make a living. hallsofpower.substack.com (https://hallsofpower.substack.com?utm_medium=podcast)

Publisher

Legislata

Category

business · news

Language

en

Explicit

No

First episode

28 Feb 2023

Latest episode

5 Aug 2024

Latest episodes

8 episodes in the feed.

1. 

   5 Aug 2024

   Who will win the forecasting model wars?

   While Vice President Kamala Harris was wrapping up the Democratic nomination, I spoke to a group about how we should forecast this election, given that the uncertainty and unprecedentedness of the 2024 race was already testing the limits of models built on historical data. Here’s a recording of that presentation, which you can also view here (https://www.loom.com/share/a51d0d2e2ddd434389a348253a51b51f?sid=ba5d68f0-1460-4fd2-ab25-08757fc0faf1). Get full access to Halls of Power at hallsofpower.substack.com/subscribe (https://hallsofpower.substack.com/subscribe?utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=CTA_4)

2. 

   3 Oct 2023

   Running as an unaffiliated mayoral candidate with Gene Kininmonth

   Running for office is difficult, but it’s even harder when you don’t have the support of a party apparatus behind you, or even someone else who can serve as the treasurer of your campaign. On this episode, we’re talking to someone doing just that. Gene Kininmonth runs a rowing program in High Point, North Carolina, and threw his hat into the ring on the day before the candidate deadline. We talk about what led him into politics, what it’s like being an unaffiliated candidate in a non-partisan-in-name-only race, and his tactics to break through. Get full access to Halls of Power at hallsofpower.substack.com/subscribe (https://hallsofpower.substack.com/subscribe?utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=CTA_4)

3. 

   18 Jul 2023

   How does the budget actually work with Liz Powell of G2G Consulting

   One of the themes of this show is that the Schoolhouse Rock version of a bill becoming a law is no longer an accurate depiction of reality (if an anthropomorphic piece of paper ever was). So what is the real version? In this epsiode, I talk with Liz Powell of G2G Consulting (https://www.g2gconsulting.com/), which specializes in helping businesses and nonprofits access government sources of funding. She’s working inside Capitol Hill, in the House of Commons, and has seen the inner workings of the appropriations process (which those in the know apparently call “approps”). We talked about how budgets have become the most important legislative vehicles, why lobbyists are valued for their knowledge, and how to stay bipartisan in a partisan town. Get full access to Halls of Power at hallsofpower.substack.com/subscribe (https://hallsofpower.substack.com/subscribe?utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=CTA_4)

4. 

   12 Apr 2023

   From interviewing al-Qaeda to mapping ESG, with Justin Vela

   I doubt that this episode will ever be matched in terms of the sheer diversity of experiences we discuss. I’m joined by a former colleague, Justin Vela of the ESG consultancy GEOSTREAMS, to talk about his career. As you’ll hear, he started freelancing on a major diplomatic incident, later snuck across the Turkish-Syrian border, became uneasy at the geopolitical aims of his employer, and eventually created a firm that helps companies manage their ESG goals. There were a lot of twists and turns for him and we talk about his thinking along the way and what he sees as the current state of freelancing in conflict areas, among other topics. You can learn more about Justin’s current work at geostreams.org (https://geostreams.org/). Get full access to Halls of Power at hallsofpower.substack.com/subscribe (https://hallsofpower.substack.com/subscribe?utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=CTA_4)

5. 

   30 Mar 2023

   Navigating the Senate with Jason Smith

   We all know that School House Rock’s version of how a bill becomes a law is no longer the whole truth. Now, policies often pass because they’re tacked on to a must-pass piece of legislation, a budget, or a reconciliation bill. So what does that mean for staffers? How do they do their jobs effectively if they now need to work a different process than what they learned in elementary school? For that, I spoke with Jason Smith, a veteran Senate staffer who has worked for Sen. Mark Begich of Alaska, Sen. Patty Murray of Washington State, and Sen. John Fetterman of Pennsylvania. We talked before he took a job with Sen. Fetterman, so when he talks in the interview about how much he loved working in the Senate, know that he was a few weeks away from returning to it. An edited transcript of the interview is below. Jason Smith Chris, it's a it's a real pleasure. I appreciate you having me. And I'm happy to be here. Chris Oates Well, let's just start off, how did you get involved in the political world? Jason Smith It was a little bit of a strange story. So I'm originally from New Jersey, and my parents were not political people. But I was always interested in politics and policy, even at the local level. So you know, in, in high school, I was volunteering with my local Democratic Party to do poll watching. In college, I was on the local planning board because I thought land use policy was really interesting. And after I graduated from law school, that while in college, I interned in the Senate office of John Corzine, who would later become governor of New Jersey. But following law school, I was already to start my career as a real lawyer and my best friend who we actually went to college with called me and said, hey, there is a Senate campaign going on in Alaska. Do you want to go on an adventure? We need a lawyer. We need someone who can do research. And I said, Sure. And I took a break. I told the firm that I was going to go work for that. I needed to push back and they said, Sure. And I went up to Alaska, and I started working for the Democrat in a three way race. And I knew we were going to lose the whole time. But we got to experience firsthand what a real Senate campaign is, and there, I met Senator Begich he was a Democrat from Alaska, at the time, and it was not his race, but I met him and a bunch of his staff and said, Wow, I really like these people. They're not what you might think of a stereotypical political people. They have heart, they have a soul, and they care about actual Alaskans. I think I want to do this. For real I, you know, I think I want to go work in the Senate. And, you know, we lost the race to Senator Murkowski. But I told Senator Begich and his people, Hey, if you ever have an opportunity, if you ever have an opening that might be suitable for me, let me know. Two years later, his chief of staff called me and he said, you know, we have this job on the steering committee that I think you might be interested in. I said, Great, I'll take it. And he said to me, well, don't you want to know what it is? Or how much money it is? And I said, well, I need to get my foot in the door. I like you people. I trust you. out, you know, I'm sure I can figure it out. Chris Oates 2010 was not a good year for Democrats, and also Murkowski got a lot of Democratic votes. What is it like to work on a campaign where you know there's almost no chance of victory? Or is that just in hindsight at the time, you always think there's a, there's a fighter's chance? Jason Smith So this, this campaign was actually very bespoke, in the sense that I'm not sure there's anything really comparable. And here's the reason why, when I agreed to do the campaign, it was going to be we thought, my candidate Scott McAdams, great guy, Scott McAdams, and really somebody who became a great candidate who has an incredible skills and knowledge. But he had never run statewide. And, you know, he was sort of put up there as the Democrat who would take on Senator Murkowski. But, you know, she's very popular and is an institution in the state. And so when I signed on, I said, Okay, this guy probably doesn't have a chance against Lisa Murkowski. But, you know, I, let's, let's have this experience. After I accepted Senator Murkowski lost her primary to Tea Party Joe Miller. When she lost to him immediately, we said, oh wait, we could win this race. Because even though Alaska is in many ways a conservative state, this is extremism. You know, there was involvement with Militia and separatists and all sorts of strange things. Now, maybe it was a week after she lost her primary, Senator Murkowski said that she was getting into back into the race, running third party running as a write in. And she was able to do that with the backing of this is the first election first federal election after the Citizens United decision. And she was able to run her write in candidacy because there was a group of corporations that came together to create a group called Alaskan Standing Together, and they funded it for several million dollars. And she had by far the best resourced campaign in the field. I've never seen a campaign. She was everywhere, she was on the air on the billboards, they had handouts with her name on it, they had bracelets, they had all sorts of stuff, they were paying for snow machines to take people to the polling places out in the villages. So when that started, you know, the hope died? Because I said, Wow, but the X factor was this is a write in campaign, how could you win this as a right and somebody has to bubble in and write in Lisa or Lisa Murkowski or something like that. So we actually had litigation that went up to the Alaska State Supreme Court, it was the whole thing was wild. But in the end, we did come in third in a three way race. In terms of one part of your question about, on was this a try out was this sort of like a, an interview, you know, one of the the important parts in politics, whether it's on what we call the official side, so actually in a senator House office, or on the campaign side, is that you need to see people operate under pressure to really understand who they are and what their capabilities are. And, and, you know, for any given job that is open, like we had a job, we had jobs in Senator Murray's office that were lower level jobs, that you get 400 resumes for single openings. And how do you? How do you possibly come to good decision making with that sort of volume of people? Right, it's, it's, the odds are worse than getting into Yale Law School, or Harvard. And so actually, being in the trenches with someone goes a long way toward letting you know about their real performance. And that is, that is part of politics that I think it's important that people don't the people don't get confused about, which is, yeah, there are there's a certain style of politics and a certain part of national politics, where it's the same people moving around, sort of, you see this, you see the same names over and over again, and you say, oh, no, like, this is the same old, same old, but, and I can't get it doing what a lot of you know, something that a lot of people think is I can't get a job unless I know somebody or less, I'm important. And I didn't know anybody, and I'm not important. But what you have to do is you have to find ways to show people that hey, I'm not just another one of these people who thinks they want to be on the West Wing or they want to be on some, you know, fictional political show, I want to do the work. And that's that's the importance of performance. So that's a way of distinguishing, like, hey, it's it's not always about pull, you know, or, or things like that. Chris Oates I don't have nearly the experience that you have on a campaign, but the one campaign I was on, it was amazing how you get into the office nd within a few days, you're seeing people do stuff that wasn't on the job description, but needed to be done. You just see the people who are happy to do it and happy to pitch in and do what's needed for the campaign for the team. And those who, let's say, are less, less amenable to it. Jason Smith Yeah, it's as if you can have a campaign, you know, there's glamorous work, oh, you know, I get to help write a speech for a senator or a candidate. You know, that's, that's glamorous. That's cool. I'll never forget one day. I was in campaign office for Senator Begich in 2014. And I was writing, I don't know, it's like writing our fish policy or something. And they were about to cut a television ad. And the ad maker decided, Oh, I really want a picnic bench that looks this certain way in this ad, because it looks like this other ad and whatever. And everybody's saying, how do we get this bench? I said, I'll go find it. You know, we got we have to get this done. I'll go figure it out. You know, give me a truck and two guys, and we'll go figure it out. And we did. There can be no task too small. You know, if, if Senator so and so it was running to a hearing and is like, oh, boy, I could really use a coffee. I'll go get your coffee. You know, that's there's there's no task that has beneath anyone who's really on the job. Chris Oates So you're working a legal job, and then you get the call, and you start working for him? And then what was that like when you you first show up in the Senate? Obviously you know a lot about politics. You're a smart person about policy. I'm sure you've read the news, you had your campaign experience. But what was that like, you know, the first week of you now work in the United States Senate. Jason Smith It was incredible. It was total sea change. It was like nothing I'd ever experienced before. I'll never forget my first day was the day after Labor Day, in 2012. And I showed up 830, I walked into the building the Hart Senate building, got my suit on, and I was so excited. I gotta go find out, you know, where my cubicle was. And I went up to the, the seventh floor where the steering committee office was, and the lights were out and the doors were locked. And I said, Okay, well, it's 830. I guess I'm a little early, but okay. Yeah. So I stood outside the office. 15 minutes goes by 20 minutes goes by half an hour goes by nine 915. I say to myself. Did I screw this up? What am I not understanding here? And at about 930, one of our tech guys walks up and he's wearing jeans and, you know, polo shirt. And he looks at me and he says, so you must be the new guy. Yeah. And he said, Nobody told you it's recess, did they? And I was like, I What? What is that? I don't even know what that means. And he looks at me and he says, so you've never worked on the Hill before, have you? And they said no. And he said, Okay. Recess is when the senators are not here to vote. And we don't wear suits and we certainly are not in the office at 9am. So I knew that this was a place of where work humility would be very important because there are a lot of things I didn't know. Chris Oates And how long before you felt kind of confident in your, your ability to do the job? Jason Smith Everybody's different in this, but for me, you know, being a mediocre cisgender, heterosexual white guy, I had a great deal of confidence that I probably shouldn't have that I would be able to do whatever duties that were assigned to me. On the hill, it is truly the case that you are going to use muscles and have to do things that you never really anticipated in a very dynamic environment, with some very unusual personalities, and some unexpected and unpredictable requirements. So the most important thing is to understand that you will screw things up, you will not know how to do things. And you will have to ask other people who have that experience and who have been through unusual situations for advice. And to take that with humility, and to actually do things about it. But personally, you know, in the jobs that I've done on the Hill, I would say usually, the first three months are a whirlwind, an absolute feels like you're drinking from the firehose, your head is spinning, there's a never ending list of things to do. And it's madness. And at about the six month mark, you hit your stride. And then, you know, after, you know, after you've been through an entire year, you get used to the cycles and the rhythms, how the appropriations cycle works, how the budget cycle works, when the recesses are, when the the moments in the calendar that are right before the recess where something's going to get jammed in there to make sure that it gets done, how you anticipate whether those are going to be things that you have to work on or somebody else's problem. You pick that up after about a year. Chris Oates You mentioned something that I've wanted to get into. And this is something that I find I find fascinating from the outside is that DC is obviously full of smart people. And yet, it seemed in my previous career as an analyst from the outside, you'd see them doing things or acclimatized them think to themselves, these things that are just inherently stupid. The debt ceiling is the best example. If you're not familiar with the debt ceiling, basically, the US Congress and the President signs the legislation to determine the federal government's revenue in spending, and any greater spending than revenue has to be financed by debt. But then there's this separate piece of legislation that authorized the Treasury to issue the debt, and it's from 100 years ago, and it was basically an expedient, and there's no reason to have it, it doesn't really affect our spending or our revenue. It's almost like there's this big grenade at the heart of the US economy, that every two years Congress has to vote not to pull the pin out. And it's the sort of thing where I remember hearing, it was like the plot of a West Wing episode. And you think, oh, that's like something obscure that Aaron Sorkin's researchers found and it's kind of makes a good thing. But there's no reason to have it. It doesn't actually affect policy. It’s not a conservative or a liberal agenda. It's just this weird, like legislative quirk that has hung around for the last 100 years and no one's gotten rid of it. And yet, I don't see other than recently, one New York Times opinion columnist, and some other academics, people saying like, Hey, this is doesn't accomplish anything other than cause a lot of mess and waste our time? Why don't we just get rid of it? And I'm thinking of this more from, like an ethnographic perspective of working on the Hill? How was it that you get in there, and something would appear to you. And if it’s your first time you see it or hear it, you’d be like, well, that's a that's a dumb thing to do, we shouldn't do that. It's not a good way of running our government. And yet, it just so quickly becomes an assumption, baked into the system. Jason Smith Yeah, no, I, that's a great question. And what I would say is that maybe you've experienced this in academia. Certainly, this is a phenomenon that I witnessed, just as an observer of the financial crisis and the legislative response in terms of Dodd Frank, and other regulatory actions after the financial crisis, which is a lot of people, particularly in, in politics, or in like high level journalism, you know, the New York Times Washington Post, The Wall Street Journal, your big institutional journalism, their minds become sort of acclimated to a discourse that is set in a very narrow frame. It's an echo chamber of talking about a problem all in the same way. And that is cyclical, and it's, it's, you know, an ouroboros, it's just you, it's a chicken or egg, we don't know if we are mired in this problem because of we are only comfortable talking about it in this way. Or, you know, vice versa. And so, I think in most places, and, you know, on most issues, like the debt ceiling, there's no one person, there's no one committee, there's no one chamber that can determine or lead, or get anything done without the, you know, without the acquiescence of everyone else with respect to the debt ceiling. So even if you were to come out and say the debt ceiling is unconstitutional, we should get rid of it, the debt ceiling doesn't make sense, we should get rid of it the debt ceiling and XYZ, which, you know, personally, I think that it's true, most politicians aren't going to want to go engage in that part of the debate, because the the mainstream of the conversation is not out there. And you can be too easily tarred as, oh, this person wants to get rid of the debt limit, because they're a reckless spender, or because they believe we should just put it on the quote unquote, credit card, which is the worst metaphor for, you know, the debt limit and the national debt that there is. So it becomes a question of, is the juice worth the squeeze? Is it worth being prominently out there, saying we should get rid of the debt ceiling when the President has certainly not engaged in any of the more - I don't want to say, the more academic in a pejorative way - but the more academic discussions about does the 14th Amendment make this make the debt limit unconstitutional? Can you mint the platinum coin? If the President is not going to engage on that level, what is the point in house member X or Senator Y engaging on that? You're just really poking your head up to get smacked in the media or on Twitter, for being out there. So it's not really worth it. Chris Oates In academia, and I think in the media, but certainly in academia, the incentive structure is to be the leader on a new idea. Every single paper an academic writes, there's usually one term or piece of jargon that they're trying to coin because they will want to be known as like, oh, he was the first person, she was the first person to think of that idea. And I think in probably the media, you want to be counter programming, you want to be standing outside of everyone else. Because that gets you the attention. I guess what you're saying is that, that is the complete incentive reversal for members of Congress or anyone else. Because if you almost it's almost like you only have so much reputational capital, and you don't want to spend it on something unless it's going to immediately deliver policy, when you could save that for something else. Jason Smith That's right. And I think that the concept of reputational capital is a very important one, in terms of both what issues politicians decide to engage on publicly, but more importantly, at least, for the work that I do, what they do legislatively, and how they are able to be or not be successful at a legislative level because it is about gaining capital and spending capital and and helping your colleagues and asking for help and how that process works to ultimately achieve real legislative change that that impacts people's lives. Chris Oates People are skipping past the distraction because they really want to pass legislation. How do you do that? Like, let's say you have a policy you really believe would make the country better? How do you that? How do you start strategizing to go from it's in your head, maybe a lot of people agree with you to it is the law of the land Jason Smith There's there's not one way to do it. There's not one way it happens. But the there are a couple sort of hallmarks of how to go about the process that position you better for success. I'll give you an example. In 2013, the Supreme Court gutted the Voting Rights Act in the Shelby County decision which is, in my opinion, one of their historically worst decisions. Democrats came up with the Voting Rights Advancement Act, which was meant to fix the problems identified in the Supreme Court case and restore the protections of the Voting Rights Act. Now, that bill was written in a way to try to get some bipartisanship out of a hope, by leaders that there were still some Republicans who actually believed in voting rights, because just in 2006, there was an overwhelming vote to reauthorize that bill that almost all the Republicans voted for. But in the course of writing that Democratic bill, unfortunately, the way that they structured it left out Alaska, which had been covered by the Voting Rights Act, because many Alaska Native communities have limited English proficiency, and they have every right to be able to vote in their own language and understand the choices made for them. So my boss saw that his state was going to be left out of these important protections, and that his constituents who faced historic discrimination were going to be left out. So we worked with litigators in that community, members of the Alaskan Native community, national voting rights lawyers to figure out how do we write a bill that restores the protections that apply to Native people, not only in Alaska, but across the country. And we came up with the Native Voting Rights Act of 2014, which we introduced, and it's the thing I'm most proud of, during my entire time in the Senate. And, honestly, we got a lot of pushback, even from within the Democratic Party, even from within the civil rights community. Because, you know, I was told by DC based civil rights leaders that this would distract from the main Democratic bill. And our response was, this isn't about the Democratic bill, or helping it or hurting it, this is about protecting people who need protection. And your bill didn't do it. So ours well. And this was not a pleasing thought to the DC based civil rights community. And we took a lot of flack for it. But after that Congress after they have realized that there were no Republicans who were going to sign on to help them restore the Voting Rights Act, and they rewrote the Voting Rights Advancement Act into the John Lewis Voting Rights Act. Now, the provisions of our bill are in that bill. So now, when we get to the point, that we pass the Voting Rights Act, and it is the John Lewis Act, we will get in those protections for Alaska Native and Indigenous people across the country. So we haven't gotten success on those measures yet. But we have set up a situation in which it is hard to see that problem being addressed with out the specific solutions that we came up for indigenous people being in it. Now, to sort of talk differently about most things, you have to attach it to appropriations bills. Because, as we've seen, the legislative process well, I will say the last Congress achieved an incredible amount of bipartisan major, major legislation that I never would have predicted, you know, I never would have thought that they would be able to pull over the line all those major bills from the inflation Reduction Act to the bipartisan infrastructure law, but in the prior years, the legislative process has broken down so badly that essentially the only major bills you're going to pass are appropriations bills. And in that context, you come up with your idea for what you need what your state needs. And then you have to start going and educating people about it, and talking about it. And that is not only talking to staff about it, but more importantly, you figure out who's writing these bills. So an appropriations bill is written by the appropriations committee. Certain parts are written by different subcommittees. You need to figure out where the thing you want goes. And then you need to go to whoever runs that subcommittee and explain it to them, and show them why it is meritorious, and explain to them why it's not a waste of time or money and how it fits with the principles that their boss has. And so in that way, you're really not only the idea creator, but then you have to be the hype person for it. Chris Oates You're framing this because both when you talk about the voting, indigenous and native voting rights, as well as getting things in appropriations bill, it's not the typical process where we would introduce legislation, it would have a committee hearing, people would ask questions to advocates about it, then there'll be a vote in the committee, and then it would go to the floor, and then would have a vote, which is a very public process. You lobby individual senators or representatives on it, to support it one way or the other. We assume that every legislator is almost an individual unit, where they either say or yes or no, for and against. What you're describing is that you are the advocate for the policy. And the real decision maker, in a sense, is the Appropriations Committee Chairman, who's writing the bill. I'm not saying that your boss has no power, because obviously you can vote for it. But given that these bills are generally must pass bills, it seems like as soon as it is written and said, it's basically an all or nothing. Let's face it, you're in the majority, this is what your leadership has decided, along with the White House and the House. You're voting for it. So the real, the real question is, does it get into that appropriations bill in the first place? And that's either yourself or yourself and your boss lobbying that member? So do you think that it's, you know, in a sense, the really the power of in the Senate these days, and I'm sure in the House as well, the power really lies in who gets to decide what is in and out of those must pass bills? Jason Smith Yeah, and I think like the normal legislative process, as we conceive of it, as you just mentioned, with a committee markup, hearing markup, and passage in and out to the floor for consideration. I mean, that does still exist, it does happen. And in fact, like there are many bills that have really productive markups. And then they go to the floor, and oftentimes they just pass by unanimous consent at some point, because they're not going to get days on the floor to be considered and amended and so forth. But ultimately, yes, I mean, when when we're talking about appropriations bills, what I always say is you want to bake the cake early, and then have them have somebody have to decide whether to eat cake or not. Right, rather than haggle over what type of cake we're baking. What also has changed? I mean, as as a structural matter, right. And this is something I think you and I probably had the same history of Congress class in college, right. And they talk about, it was certainly in the House, it's it was, you know, is there a weak speaker or a strong speaker, or the committee chairs really running the show and the speaker is, is trying to stay on top of the committee chairs or to the committee chairs not really matter. And the speaker is making all these decisions, him or herself. And, you know, with history that has sort of fluctuated in the Senate, I think the Senate has historically been much more defensive, or protective, rather, of the power of the individual senator, right to demand things because of the nature of the institution, requiring unanimous consent to get through so many work items. But, you know, as you see now, with these big omnibus bills that we've seen for the last 10 years, it's sort of like there's, there's a major policy discussion and question over the funding in the bills, you know, did we get more money for for school nutrition? Did we get more money for housing? You know, all those are important things that Democrats want that that, like we have to have to address real problems in our communities. But then you say, oh, along with that appropriations bill, you know, they tacked on a bill to do X a bill to do you know, the Promesa bill to deal with Puerto Rico, an FAA reauthorization bill, all sorts of things that are not appropriations, but that are bills that must be passed. And so you attach them to the appropriations bill, because that has to pass those those sorts of discussions about which bills are getting in there, which bills are riding along with your appropriations bill? That certainly is a question for the leadership for the leader. And in that way, there certainly has been, no more power or greater influence attached to the leadership office. If you if you're a member who said, Oh, yeah, you know, I'm in favor of this appropriations bill. But, boy, I really don't like some of the provisions in the FAA authorization bill that you're attaching to this. Are you going to vote against funding the government, because you don't like a provision in the FAA bill? No, I have a hard time believing that anyone could do that. So it really makes it so important. The judgments that the leader is making about what goes in there. And we should also be very clear that with how things have been working over the past several Congresses, where the Leader also has to have a discussion with the Speaker, before those decisions can be made. So you've got bicameral issues, you've got intra caucus issues, you've got bipartisan issues, and it's it's an incredibly difficult, difficult job to do. Chris Oates What’s the physical feeling of working in those days leading up to it, when, when you are trying to get all this in? Jason Smith It is brutal, it can be it can be brutal, and I will say that the hardest working people and this is not just me kissing up to my the my friends and colleagues who are or were appropriation staffers, but I have never experienced anything like the workload of an appropriation staffer. In those last days, they will work 20 hours a day. They will be at the Capitol until 2am, sitting in a room with their colleagues from the minority or the majority, Republican, Democrat, House, Senate, haggling, trying to find their way out of thorny problems trying to come to numbers that they can agree on. And truly it is it is physical and mental exhaustion. They just because also appropriation staffers have to run through and be prepared for any number of scenarios. If, you know, if leader Schumer and Mitch McConnell decide, oh, yeah, we can agree on spending x as our top line number, this is the number that we're going to spend in total on the bill that has to filter down to all the provisions in the bill so that the math works and adds up. Where are the cuts coming from? Where are the pluses going. And it it truly is a brutal task. I worked on the Russia investigation, Supreme Court nominees and the impeachment for my my boss, and there were days that I would work 18 hours. And I was physically and mentally exhausted, and was absolutely brutal. But at the same time, at least for me, I was in a place doing things that I could never imagine that I would be able to do growing up in Jersey. And I cared about what I was doing, and it mattered. And so the jobs exhaustion or the frustration, the highs and lows. I felt were some sort of like an honor. At the same time, one of the good things is there is an ebb and flow to the work. And the way to maintain yourself as a staffer, probably even as a member is knowing when you have the time to say, Okay, I'm going to take a half day Friday, right. Or I'm going to work from home. Take a long weekend. I'm going to figure out how to pace myself so that the work is still done as effectively. But I'm not literally burned out to the ground. Chris Oates Yeah, yeah. You don't want like, you know, an NFL team to be doing wind sprints every single day. 10 times. You want to you want an offseason. But you're no longer in the Senate. So what does that mean? First of all, what was the decision like to leave a place you clearly loved to work? And what is it like not being there anymore? Is it exciting to do something new? Or do you still miss it? Is it both? Jason Smith Oh, I think I'll always miss it. But so after, you know, I've been in the center for about seven and a half years. After the first impeachment, I was truly at a place of exhaustion. I mean, it was a grueling several months. And I also knew that the Senate didn't have much on its calendar for the rest of the year. There was not a lot the Senate had to do. But, and I still believe this to be true. I felt very clearly that the country was in threat under threat, and that Donald Trump and the racism, misogyny, the bigotry that he represents, poses an existential threat to the to the democracy and I thought, okay, I can sit here and keep doing this. Or I can sign up and try to help make sure he doesn't win. So I said, you know, this is probably a good time to step back. Tell, you know, try to get in touch with the Biden campaign and say, Hey, I'm ready to really help however I can to make sure that we don't lose this thing. I've also done some consulting. The money that is appropriated in these bills in the the large appropriations bills, goes into a million different accounts for different purposes for different programs. And so many of these programs are targeted and written to address real needs out there: poverty, lack of infrastructure, lack of social investment, in some of the most difficult and far flung places to reach in the country, but no one who actually lives there has any idea how to access the money. So you might say, Oh, we've we've set out $100 million for tribal broadband connectivity programs. But if tribes don't know about the money, or how to get the money to their own community to their own land. Well, we have another problem, right? We, we've, we've won the big fight of getting the resource. But we haven't followed through with getting that resource to the ground. And so part of my work has been telling people and telling organizations, setting up systems for realizing all the investments that they might be eligible for, and how to get that out onto the ground. Which has been a lot of fun and very eye opening, but certainly a very different beast than than working up there in the buildings. Chris Oates That’s an amazing, amazing career. I'm jealous, because we went to college together. And I remember I was finishing up my PhD, and I was just here like, oh, Jason works in the Senate now. And then and then you had like seven years, you get to witness all this stuff. It's amazing. But before you go, I got three questions I we ask at the end of every episode. First, what are the what is politics really like? Is it the West Wing, House of Cards, Veep or Parks and Rec? Jason Smith So I confess that I haven't watched a lot of Parks and Rec and my girlfriend has given me a lot of grief for that. I would say usually it's like Veep. Truly some of the behavior by members and staff you're like, this is a TV show. But most importantly for what I imagined the demographic of your audience is, is I want to very clearly state that none of it is like the West Wing. I think you probably watched the West Wing cover to cover two or three times. Right? Me too. I've watched a lot. And it broke a generation of brains. That show made people think bad things about one how one should behave in politics, and to what politics actually looks like. I love a Toby rant. I love a Josh rant. Don't get me wrong. But no, not not at all like reality. Chris Oates Okay, and what was the one of the best or proudest days you had working in politics? Jason Smith I think that so the proudest day of my time in politics was I had spent a couple of months working on this issue that was kind of highly kind of technical. Long story short, it was a housing program, that allowed some flexibility for local housing authorities to use their money in ways to make sure that folks who were in affordable housing programs got the supports that they needed, so that they could get job development, job training, access to child care, all the sorts of wraparound supports that you need to thrive as a family, and it was a program that was under threat. And we were able to save it. And one of our constituents came in, who was the head of a housing authority. And he brought with him a hand painted mug, and hand painted little flower vase, and said, and he had his picture in this note, and it was a picture of a mom and her I think she was six or seven year old daughter painting this mug and this vase, and it said, Thank you for saving this program, because it means that we won't have to leave our home. I really like the community that I live in. And I remember like tearing up and my boss is very touched by this as well. I always think about that day when when there are hard times because it was proof that even the things that you didn't think anybody would ever notice that you worked on. It saved a little girl’s home. What, what is more important than that? What could be more valuable than that? So I always look for those opportunities. Chris Oates It's it's the kind of corny story that would be parodied in a show like Veep. But like it’s parodiable because it does happen. And it is real. Ultimately, I think that's why all of us, I assume everyone listening to this, most of us are interested in politics, because it matters. We can watch soap operas, and have it be much more interesting and better looking people on it. We care about politics and the news, because ultimately it's about governing, and it's about people like that. Final question, What is something you wish you had known that someone had told you when you got started in this Jason Smith That's a really good question. You know, I'm Irish Catholic, right? So I was raised to be a little bit jaded and skeptical. And certainly, I think that outlook served me well, in detecting skullduggery and things like that. But what I would say is, is actually the advice that I give to people who asked me questions about should I go work on the Hill? If you go on work on the Hill, you will be surrounded by extremely hardworking, intelligent people, many of whom are there for the same reason that you are there, which is to help people to solve problems to change lives. And if you are good to them, they will be good to you. And if you show them respect, and you keep your word to them, they will do that for you. And that is how you can achieve things. You know, the stuff that we read about politics is ugly. It's either horse race, or it's just over the top, partisanship and nastiness and whatever. But if you actually want to make a difference, if you want to make change in this country, particularly if you are someone who isn't like me, just a white guy, put yourself out there. Go get into the fight, because it matters. It matters who's in the room doing the fighting, it matters that you are there. And a single voice in any room can absolutely change the outcome of what happens in that room and the laws that flow from it. So like it's a tough business. It can be brutal, it can be thankless and unforgiving. But if you care about people, and you get into it, and you do your best, you will never regret having done it. Chris Oates Well, that is I think an excellent way to end thank you so much for this and good luck getting money to the people who need it. Jason Smith 1:06:53 You know, we try and thank you for the opportunity and thank you everybody for listening. Please keep up the fight faith. Courage. Yeah. Transcribed by https://otter.ai Get full access to Halls of Power at hallsofpower.substack.com/subscribe (https://hallsofpower.substack.com/subscribe?utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=CTA_4)

6. 

   16 Mar 2023

   Better know a neighborhood with Kristen Halbert, former staff at Boston City Councillor Michelle Wu

   What does it mean to represent a community on a day-to-day basis? Do you walk around the streets asking people their opinions? Or spend all your time in the local NextDoor group looking for what’s going on? It can be hard to know how to fully represent an areas while working in elected office, or for an elected official, especially as other time pressures, commitments, and projects require your attention. Kristen Halbert did this work for former Boston City Councillor-at-Large Michelle Wu, being tasked with working on behalf of the neighborhood of Roxbury in her office. In this episode, we discuss how to best do that, from liaising with traditional power structures, talking with constituents at the grocery store, and even checking out subreddits. Get full access to Halls of Power at hallsofpower.substack.com/subscribe (https://hallsofpower.substack.com/subscribe?utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=CTA_4)

7. 

   7 Mar 2023

   Working in a world where your boss' election could cost you your job, with Chris Jones, President of PoliTemps

   🏛 Halls of Power is brought to you by Legislata (https://www.legislata.com), an informational platform for politics. Keep up with bills, share press releases, keep your team aligned, and even get through your inbox quicker. Sign up for free at app.legislata.com (https://app.legislata.com). Jobs in politics are inherently difficult. How to do that when you also might lose your job because of a red/blue wave? And what does it mean to have a career where staff is underpaid or not paid at all and yet there is still an oversupply of talent. Today, we’re speaking with Chris Jones (https://www.linkedin.com/in/rchrisjones/), founder of PoliTemps (https://politemps.com/) and CapitolWorks (https://capitolworks.com/), staffing and recruitment agencies for the political world. He we discuss his own career, as well as what he thinks needs to happen to make this a more representative and sustainable industry that works for the country. You can listen to the episode above and read a lightly edited transcript below. Chris Jones Thank you so much, Chris. My name is Chris Jones. I work in Washington DC and beautiful Dupont Circle, and grew up originally in Texas. Chris Oates And how did you first get involved in the political world? Chris Jones Well, I grew up in a political family. My dad was an elected judge for 30 years. So I grew up literally knocking on doors and putting up yard signs. I love politics. I love the issues. You know, I love the personalities. The people are human, they're flawed. And that always is amazing how that comes into. Sometimes conflict or agreement with these issues of the day, whether it's healthcare, democracy, life, liberty, international affairs, plus, we again, we have these very frail and human people that are involved in it. I did a year or two of college, and then I decided to get out of Austin. Back in the 80s. Austin was not the cool place it is now it was very different. It was like that movie Dazed and Confused. Lot of driving around in Camaros with bad haircuts, and big bell jeans. I joined the Navy for four years, traveled two years in Puerto Rico, two years stationed in Japan on a ship and worked in naval intelligence. Tracked Russians, North Korea, Chinese, and that was exciting. And then I finished that up. And then I got my degree from Texas Tech University. And then after that, I decided to come to Washington do an internship on Capitol Hill. Chris Oates Who was that internship with? Chris Jones That was with Congressman Jack Brooks, he was the chairman of the Judiciary Committee. He was a well known cigar smoking chairman of the full committee. And for me, coming to Washington, even though I was probably the oldest intern at 28, it was like coming to Hollywood. It was like being on the soundstage of Paramount, you know, there's Barney Frank. There's Pat Schroeder. There's Nancy Pelosi, there's Chuck Schumer before they were famous. And, you know, it was just an amazing experience. Chris Oates Interning is something that in the political world, a lot of folks get into it in that way, that you intern for your local state representative or with a nonprofit, I interned for the International Crisis Group, the one summer I spent in Washington, but I think it definitely varies based on on where it is. So when you're for a committee chairman, who's powerful, does that mean that you as an intern, get to see more things than, you know, if you were an intern for the most junior freshman and member of Congress? Chris Jones That's exactly right. I mean, you're on a full committee. So you're not on a subcommittee, you're not working for a member, you're on the committee. And you're exposed to the staff director, the chief counsel, who I've kept in touch with for many, many years, you're also keeping in touch with the members who are on the committee. One thing I do want to say, you know, I was very fortunate to have gotten the opportunity because of a network and connections. But a lot of people, especially people of color, don't have a pathway to those internships, and there's a great organization called Pay Our Interns that has recently come into its own. Many people of color, many people of low income don't have the ways and means to come to Washington, right? I was able to live on rice and beans for a little bit of money. But a lot of people can’t. And you need those internships as a pipeline to politics, and Pay Our Interns and similar organizations have pushed for the payment of White House interns and of Capitol Hill interns. Without that young leadership, you don't get the pipeline of people of a diverse talent group coming into Capitol Hill, coming into the White House, coming into these organizations. So I just wanted to mention that briefly. Chris Oates I think that's a great point. I can definitely say, absolutely anyone listening please pay your interns because they're doing work for you. What we often forget is that when we look at the internships, and that's the way to your career on Capitol Hill, it's not just that not everyone gets those internships, but that some people choose different paths when they're 20. And that should not mean they're locked out of a career in politics thereafter. The same way that you see a lot of lawyers, they think they have to clerk at the Supreme Court or in a circuit court because your career is over at 30 if you don't have that on your on your CV, right? That's it's absolutely crucial for like the well functioning political staff, industry wide staff to have those other paths into the job. Chris Jones Right. And there's a big complaint for a while on Capitol Hill about how come the Chief of Staffs and the legislative directors weren't more diverse, right? So you had a population that was diverse, you had districts that were diverse, but you had people at a senior level, the managerial level that was were not diverse. How do you get them? You have to start at a younger level to be able to bring them in as a talent pipeline, and to give them an opportunity. And I'm quite aware of my fortunate ability to do an internship in Washington. But kind of the next part of that story is when I was interning, I was going through Roll Call magazine, and I saw that somebody named David Bonner from Michigan had been elected Majority Whip. So I saw that David Bonnier was strong on veterans issues, and I was a veteran, I saw that he probably was going to have more staff, and more responsibility. So in my little small political brain, I made a lobbying effort within my inner circle to get a position working for David Bonner. And so I was successful. I went on to work for David for two years, and got to see, again, Gephardt, Foley, just the inner workings of a leadership office, which was fascinating. Chris Oates I mean, how easy is it to do that? So you know, you get, let's say, you get to Washington, and you work for your, your local congressperson, as an intern or whatever? Is it common that, you know, you get there, and then you're in the club, and it's easy to transfer from one member of Congress's office to another, even if it's a different state? You don't know anything about that state? But you might know about an issue that they care about? Chris Jones No, that's a great question. I would say that it's you can you can get in the door, but to get the job, you have to be able to do the work. There's a lot of people that have relationships and contacts and my cousin and my friend and the Congressman's nephew, there's tons of these people that are constantly coming to Washington. But we like to think it's a little bit of a meritocracy, where your hard work and your ability to understand and think fast on your feet will get you further up the food chain. So you can get in the door but actually to stay on Capitol Hill and work, you need to be of a certain certain type of personality, smart, hardworking, and many ways willing to give up a certain part of your personal life. Because your life is around, you know, a Congress that's constantly in doing issues managing crisis, January 6, 9/11, a war, a change of administration, the major election, so you need to be able to come up to a higher level to be able to stay in Capitol Hill. Chris Oates Would you say that this transfer of folks on Capitol Hill from one office to another leads to a kind of more national or partisan outlook on the on behalf of the staff? And I'm actually thinking kind of back to the American Revolution, where Alexander Hamilton and George Washington, they fought in the Continental Army, and they had a more continental national outlook than a lot of the state leaders who became the anti-Federalists. Do you think that that changes the way politics works when you have a group of people who - I don't want to say they're disconnected from their their local roots, by any means - but their professional circles are within a party or within a faction within a party or an ideology or an issue group? And does that changes how they work a little bit? Chris Jones Um, you know, I don't know if that's true, because many people, you know, tend to spin out, they work on Capitol Hill, and then they go to law school, or they decide that Washington is not for them, and they go back to Massachusetts or Texas or Iowa and run for local office, or they decide to go to graduate school or that they decide to go leave and work on a nonprofit or trade association, or a law firm or lobby firm on the outside. So I would say there's enough churning on the Hill and especially as you get to a certain skill level. Capitol Hill notoriously underpays and overworks talent. So you get to a certain level five years into it, and you start talking to your friend, that's a lobbyist who's making $20,000 more, or your friend who moved to Boulder, and he’s mountain biking and skiing, but making $10,000 less, and you're like, What am I doing here? And so you sort of aged out after a certain period and move on to other professions or different stages of your life. I believe Trump has made the town a little bit more partisan. You know, pre Trump, people interacted a little bit more together and talked and interacted. Trump has really demonized the government. You know, the deep state working there against me, Department of Justice, unelected bureaucrats. And I think a lot of people have a hard time with the other party wanting to work in government. So I think there's a certain amount of churn. But I think also the town has become a little bit more partisan after Trump as well. Chris Oates I think there's this sense that Washington is this distant place that people just go to and they don't represent the country, as some people would say it. But what you're saying is, people will go work in Washington and then go somewhere else, or they'll come in and out Capitol Hill. There’s a problem that I want to ask you about. What do you think the effects are about having a Congress where as you say, people age out? It would seem like you would want a Congress where if you want to have a career as a congressional staffer, you can have a very long and illustrious career, being a congressional staffer having institutional knowledge, deep issue knowledge. But it sounds as if there's financial pressures, because you're not paid enough to do that. Chris Jones Yeah, absolutely. And not only is there financial pressures, there's the elections. So every two years, a House member is up for reelection. So you’re typically are associated with your boss. And if your boss loses his seat, you're out of a job, you're not automatically grandfathered into work for the person that is reelected, especially if it's somebody at the other party, and not even if it's somebody of the same party. In Rhode Island, Congressman, Langevin retired and Seth Magaziner took over. So Set Magaziner might bring some of that old staff with him. But chances are, he'll bring his own staff. So the staff is also limited by their boss, if their boss retires, if their boss gets defeated, if their boss is redistricted, and squeezed into another district with another Democrat, then potentially they could lose their job. And so that's a challenge. And for the Senate, it's every six years. So you may work for Senator for six years, or then you may go to his committee. But at the Senate flips, the committees go from majority, which is a larger number of staff to minority, which is a smaller number, and thus you lose your job. Like in the House, the committees went from a majority amount of Democratic staff to a minority amount of staff. And so they had to shed and let go all of the staff members from all of these, every committee is now a Republican-led committee. And so the staff members are knocking on doors, sending out resumes. Hey, Chris, you know, I'm looking for work. Can you help me as well? So there's a certain amount of turnover. You know, the great thing about Washington is everybody, for the most part is from somewhere else. And being from Texas. That's what I enjoyed about it. I met people from Minnesota that loved jogging in the snow when it was 30 degrees. And me growing up in the Gulf Coast, crazy. met people from Massachusetts, my wife is from Long Island. You know, I met people from all over the United States. And everybody comes here. And again, I sound like I'm a Chamber of Commerce greeting for Washington but people come here they really want to make a difference and they really want to do well. They really want to see change in government, they really want to have a higher learning and a higher purpose. And that's also inspirational. And it's not necessarily just the people in politics. It's your next door neighbor that worked for the Department of Commerce for 30 years as a GS, or the woman that worked for the CIA, and you never really knew what she did. Another thing about Washington is, there's a large contingent of veterans. A lot of people think Washington is out of touch place. But what's great is there's people that really are here that have a high dedication and service to the country. Chris Oates Yeah, I think that's something that it definitely frustrates me. When you hear about folks attacking Washington, I can definitely see attacking the way that politics is practiced in some ways. But that's a fair ground. Totally fair. But I think unless you've ever worked there or live, you don’t realize that the amount of earnestness and sincerity is as high as anywhere else in the country. Chris Jones And I will say you have to get out of DC. I was here and then I left and I went back to Texas for a bit in the mid 90s, and worked for governor and Richards. And you have to get out of Washington, you have to go back home. And you have to get back to your roots. Because in Washington, it is kind of an echo chamber, right? Everybody's talking about health care, health care. It's George Santos, George Santos, what's going on with Biden. You do have to go back and listen to people and talk to people and talk about mundane stuff, or unrelated, you're hiking or biking or your health or your meemaw or your abuela, or your grandma or your grandmother, you have to get in touch with your outside of Washington, just to kind of clear the clear the airwaves from your brain to talk about something else. Chris Oates Absolutely. So let's let's pick up with your story again. So you were in DC, you were working in the house, and then you went back to Texas and worked for the governor. What was that like going from Washington and the legislative branch to Texas and the executive branch, Chris Jones Governor Richards was an amazing political figure. And there was the second time she ran for election. She was running against a novice. But this novice happened to have the last name is Bush. And it was a changing of the winds in Texas politically, when it was moving from centrist Democrat to centrist Republican. And it was a tough election. It was the midterms, the Bill Clinton election, so there was a little bit of backlash against him against the gun gun laws that he was passing. And so she was a little bit of a celebrity. And the news was there, the media was there, they were covering her. But unfortunately, the tides of change, she couldn't swim against and she lost that election. But being at a state level, and seeing her up close, just an amazing political leader. She was very much ahead of her time with progressive issues, making sure that women, that LGBT people, and minorities were in government. It wasn't just a slogan of talking about it. She made a point of making sure that government looked like its citizens. But she was an amazing leader, she lost and out of that loss. She went on to do you know, government relations and consulting and lobbying and get up she was certainly happy with the next stage of her life. But I was at a turning point, at a pivot point. I was 31. I had had this amazing experience in the military, got my college degree, worked on Capitol Hill, grew up in politics, but I was again trying to figure out my next step. I had done temporary staffing as a fallback job off and on, it was my equivalent of hosting or waitressing or Uber driving or whatever you want to call it. So I thought, temporary staffing, politics, politics, temporary staffing, and it was like that Reese's Peanut Butter commercial, you know where I put them together and I thought there ought to be a staffing agency that had the model of a staffing agency, but it was like a campaign. Back then we didn't use the word startups, we didn't say, startup or dot com. My vision is really to make it full of energy, enthusiasm to give it the branding of a campaign and the vibe and energy, which is kind of what a startup is, right? A startup runs hard, they deliver a product, and then they fold the tent, and they move on to the next product, you know, V dot two. I came back to Washington a second time and things really kind of started to align for me. People started to help me with a business plan, I found a silent partner. And things started to click, and people got it immediately, a value added smart temp that can help me with research, legislative tracking, press comms admin, Lobby Day, or conference, you don't have to say another word, send me the information. So it's been a solid, ongoing enterprise since 1998. We've placed people for over 1 million hours, for over 3,000 temp to perm and perm placements. And it continues to just go strong. We have another division, which does executive search. And as I've gotten older, you know, my attempts have gotten older, and my clients have gotten older. And the talent that I'm working with has gotten older as well. So I've kind of split off to do kind of retained search, but PoliTemps continues to have great years. We did a really amazing year last year as well. Chris Oates Your website says that it's not just we will place people in campaigns for this party or this division. It is the political ecosystem. And that's something that people don't necessarily understand that politics isn't just the folks that we elect who are in office in terms of what how it runs. It is a whole array of journalists, nonprofits, federal or other governmental agencies, as well as the elected branches. So to what in your mind kind of is the world of politics that you work in? And how do you kind of define it? Chris Jones That's a great question. Think of it as an umbrella. So we don't work with the federal government, we don't work with Department of Agriculture, we don't work with, you know, US Department of Defense. We work with adjacent industries, we rarely work with Capitol Hill, because they have an abundance of cheap, ready talent. And we don't work with campaigns directly. We will work with adjacent industries. So we would work with a public relations agency that has a contract with the Census Department. Or we might work with a political consultant that advises Republican Senators on their fundraising and direct mail strategies, or we would work with, you know, a political media firm that works with members of Congress, nonprofits, public relations, firms, trade associations, lobbying and law firms, as well as corporations. So that's kind of the ecosystem. And they touch politics, public affairs, public relations, in some way. And that's where we kind of provide a value added staffer. Chris Oates And so what would you be your advice be for folks that are interested in politics, but maybe they don't want to work for very little money on Capitol Hill? Or, you know, they we already know how you apply for the federal government elsewhere. But what would be your advice for someone who's looking to get into this world? But again, not in those particular agencies or departments? Chris Jones Yeah, I would say the first thing is start, you know, whether you're in Des Moines or Charlotte or Charleston or Tallahassee or Santa Fe, start to get involved and start to volunteer on your local political campaigns. It could be a city council race, it could be a state representative. It could be a member of Congress. It could be a US senator or governor, but start to talk to people and figure out how you can knock on doors or do phone banking, or understand a little bit about the political system. Those jobs, they need people. They love young people and old people. It's important for people to feel that they're involved in sort of our body politic. When you have this whole recount, and ballot machines, and voter integrity stuff, the thing that came to me was these people questioning have obviously never worked in politics. They've never seen what the registrars and the voting people and the commissioners have to do, how hard it is, how mundane and also how it has integrity. So start to get involved, start to volunteer, and start to sort of make your mark and figure out what you want to do in these capacities. Chris Oates That's really good advice. It's always good for more people to get involved, because we need more people in civic life. But before you go, I've got three questions. First, what is working in politics actually, like West Wing, Veep, or House of Cards? Chris Jones That’s a good question. It's probably closer to that movie with Michael Douglas, the American President. It can be very boring. It can be also very exciting. A lot of people come into it for the wrong reasons, fame or money, as opposed to trying to contribute and trying to learn and help the process as well. But, you know, it's like these television shows, but it's also not like these television shows as well. Chris Oates What was your best day, kind of in the political world? Professionally speaking, I mean. Chris Jones That's hard to say, I mean, I think it's when you get your job, or your first paid position. One thing that is important is helping other people. So when you're climbing up the ladder, you're gonna have some people that don't want to help you, there's an expression, you know, in Washington, if you want a friend, get a dog. So you're gonna have some people that go out of their way to help you. I had a Chief of Staff, he got my resume. And, you know, he looked at my resume and said, you went to Texas Tech, you're in the military, you were the Young Democrats, there must be just one of you out there, it's such a rarity. And he was very kind. I keep in touch with them. He was a chief of staff to Lloyd Benson, Senator from Texas. And then there's some people that almost go out of their way not to help you. And you just have to remember to help other people as you're going up. Because as they say, when you go back down, you're gonna see them going back down, so help people be kind. But my best day was probably when I got a real job in Washington that paid. Chris Oates And finally, what is one thing you wish someone had told you before you started in this entire world, which I guess for you is very young, to, let's say, professionally, speaking after college when you first got started? Chris Jones Expand your contacts, expand your network, make friends, expand your relationships, talk to people try to get to know people that are like you. That's so important. Get full access to Halls of Power at hallsofpower.substack.com/subscribe (https://hallsofpower.substack.com/subscribe?utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=CTA_4)

8. 

   28 Feb 2023

   Being in office when government succeeds with Councillor-at-Large Jake Wilson, Somerville, MA

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Today, we’re talking with Jake Wilson, a Councillor-at-Large for the city of Somerville, MA, who won election in 2021 and was in office in 2022 when the Green Line Expansion was finally completed, bringing rapid transit to the city after decades of delays. It was the rare time when an elected official could celebrate a clear win for the community. We talk about what led him to run, what a municipal campaign is like when you don’t do much until the preliminary election is over, and what it means to go straight from civic festivities to a protest. You can listen to the conversation above, or read a lightly edited transcript below. Chris Oates When we think about working in government, we often think about people in Washington, running from crisis to crisis or managing some disaster. But a lot of governing happens at the local level. And not every moment is a crisis. Today, we're going to be speaking with someone who recently ran for and won office at the city level in Massachusetts, and then was in office when that city experienced a real victory. The city is Somerville, Massachusetts, it's right next to Boston and is where I used to live. And the victory was the extension of the rapid transit system into that city. We're going to talk about what it's like to run a campaign as a local level, trying to balance your day job in the campaign, and then what it's like to be in office when people are actually happy with what the government is doing. Counselor-at-large Jake Wilson of Somerville, Massachusetts. Thanks so much for being here. Jake Wilson 1:22 Thanks, Chris. Yeah, it's great to be here with you. Thanks. Chris Oates 1:25 I looked at your website. And you started off in Iowa, and then moved to Philadelphia, and then to the Boston area, and Somerville, and I'm just wondering, at what point in that journey did you first get involved in politics? Jake Wilson 1:40 I'll tell you, I always have followed politics, I've always wanted to, to, you know, to dip my feet in the water and try it. It took me a little bit longer to take those first steps that I probably had envisioned back as a teenager. But I got here eventually, it really stems from just a general zeal for talking to people and trying to solve problems with you know, in this case, medium and long term solutions. As a city councilor, we rarely can solve something, you know, it's not on us to solve something in the in the moment, we have a city staff for that. But what we can do is try to get creative and innovative on the policy side and look to solve big problems by thinking big and working with our legislative and policy analysts to try to come up with good solutions. Chris Oates 2:40 And I saw on your biography that you were the head of Somerville youth soccer for three years. And I have to imagine like there's no better training ground for elected office in municipal government than dealing with soccer parents. Jake Wilson 2:52 That's really perceptive. Actually, it sometimes shocks people when I tell them what good preparation it was for this. Perceptions can can be very different from reality in terms of what's involved in youth sports administration. Soccer was big. We had, by the time we grew it from about 799 kids to almost 1200 by the last season that I was involved in the planning. That's a decent chunk of the city right there. When you talk about that, it's probably also a decently big part of why I got elected, running at-large, I had citywide name recognition through families. Soccer families tend to be social, have a lot of friends and neighbors who they talk to, and no one thing gets you elected, but I put a big weight on it. Basically I showed I could run a pretty big nonprofit in the area. Chris Oates 3:58 Lots of folks in democracies these days are talking about the lack of civic space. And they often say youth sports is one of those last remaining ones that in every single town in America, there are some youth sport leagues and like that brings people together. Jake Wilson 4:18 Yeah. And I'll tell you, it's tough. In the most densely populated city in New England, it's can be tough finding that recreational space. And that's one of the things that I ran on. It's one of the things I was honestly I got my start in community organizing around athletic fields in school yards and recreational space. I think it's a really important thing for communities for families, for everyone, that we have these these shared spaces, and it's going to be something that I'm going to continue to work on here in office. Chris Oates 4:50 I saw this on your LinkedIn, is this true? You're a minority owner and a second division Danish soccer team. Jake Wilson 4:57 That's true. That's a new thing. My wife and I bought, I will say, a very small percentage of Danish football club that's currently in the third tier over there for the club that has had some success in its history. They have nine Danish titles to their credit in their history. So we're part of a consortium that came in there and then did a takeover in late November. And yeah, we're looking to hopefully restore that club to its rightful place is one of the more prominent clubs in Denmark. Chris Oates 5:30 As someone who's seen nearly everything from Welcome to Wrexham and who would absolutely buy a soccer club. If I had the money. I'm very envious, but that's a whole other podcast. I don't want to get. Jake Wilson 5:40 It's the probably the dumbest and funnest investment that I will ever make. Chris Oates 5:45 I mean, if it gets you some free tickets and a flight to Denmark, I'd say that's worth it. Jake Wilson 5:48 It's getting me to Valencia for warm weather training next month. So that's something Chris Oates 5:54 That is fantastic. So you were running youth soccer, and then you decide to run for office. And I'm just curious, what was the thought process behind, I'm actually running for office. I know a lot of people think about it, we talk about it, maybe I will, maybe I won't. But what was the decision of, I'm going to do it, and I'm going to start working on it now. Jake Wilson 6:12 Yeah, I mean, I'll be honest, I thought about running and talked to the, at the time, the outgoing ward councilor here for ward four, the late Walter Pirro. But we had there were two very, very good candidates already. Already in the race one with citywide name recognition, another one who I thought very highly of, and I just decided it wasn't really the time. I had a young, very young child at the time. And I knew the kind of work involved with with campaigning, and I knew I just, I didn't have that to give at that point. I was working full time and the primary caregiver for for a young child, so it wasn't in the cards, but you know, it's kind of stayed with me. And the current ward councillor for my ward is very good at his job. I had no intention of challenging him. And it was really some some board members on the soccer board who came to me. I know, every every elected official likes to to portray, you know, I was drafted, I was called upon. I kind of actually really was like some folks put it in my ear, who basically said, like, Hey, you seem good at this stuff. Have you ever thought about running for city council? And I said, Yeah, my ward councillor is really good, though. Well, you should run citywide. Like I said earlier, you have name recognition from soccer. And that stuck with me, and I decided to do it. I was a very non traditional candidate, because I've not been involved in local Democratic committee, City Committee politics at all. Despite being a Democratic socialist, myself, I've not really been involved electorally, with Boston DSA. So I didn't really fit into any of these sort of groups. And so in some circles, there was some consternation, like who is this guy? Why is even running. But the people who knew me who'd worked with me, I've been very involved in both education, and youth sports, as we've talked about, and people who who dealt with me in those circles, they thought I had a much better chance of winning than folks who would not know me from those circles. I struggle with perfectionism, and I wanted to have like a really good campaign video. It held up launching the campaign probably by a month or two, beyond where it should have and then it was starting to get to be a crowded field. And finally, I had people screaming at me if you're gonna do it, get in the race. So I pushed out a video that was good enough, announced and then said about the process of trying to figure out the landscape as a newcomer in running for office. And it's, it can be daunting. Let me tell you. Chris Oates 9:02 That campaigning period was a year, two months? I mean, I'm curious how long the election cycle is in Somerville. Jake Wilson 9:10 Well, it's, it's funny, you should ask. It started early in 2021. In March or so, and I think I announced in April, but and then you pulled papers, I want to say it was late May and then you pulling papers means you gotta get the official signature pages from the committee, election Commissioner's Office. Then getting those nomination papers signed. And then you eventually returned them and get certified on the ballot. However, the transition process from Somerville soccer, I shouldn't have been surprised by it, but just given when you bring in someone new, and this was someone you know, who came from a really good background in sports information. Very good and a sharp person, but just the knowledge transfer, bringing in someone who's new to the organization took a lot longer than I had planned on. I was doing candidate forums, I was filling out candidate questionnaires, but I wasn't knocking on doors. And a lot of people who knew me and were rooting for me grew very alarmed that I, you know, they thought I wasn't taking the campaign seriously. In reality, I was doing the planning for the fall season of soccer, which is the big lift. I was not only doing it, but having to explain it to a new executive director. And as anyone knows, who's done that it takes about three times as long to do something and explain it to someone as it would to just do it yourself. So yeah, that that dragged on and through the preliminary and the night of the preliminary election, September 14, it was seven weeks out from the primary, I got lucky in that someone there were going to be nine candidates at large, only eight of us, which is the maximum that you can have without requiring a preliminary election, only eight of us got certified. So we didn't have a preliminary if we'd had a preliminary I might have been out at that stage. Because I had not had the time to go knock doors- Chris Oates 11:31 Just to explain it to people, Somerville doesn't have a primary and then a general it has for at-large candidates a preliminary election. And so eight can make it through the preliminary, which is effectively the primary, to carry on to the general in November. Jake Wilson 11:45 Yeah. We're looking at ranked choice voting here. The system we have is honestly not that bad. It's not quite as good as ranked choice voting. But you know, it's probably the next best thing. Yeah, it's a way of ensuring that there are basically 2x people, two times as many people as there are winners in an election on the final ballot for the for the municipal election. So there's a preliminary election, usually early to mid September, shortly after Labor Day, that narrows it down to that maximum for the final ballot. Chris Oates 12:19 So for your race because there were four at large councilors and eight people certified. There was basically no preliminary, you were on the ballot for November without having to do anything other than collect your signatures. Jake Wilson 12:30 Yes. And that was a very good thing for me, because I mean, I might have made it through I don't know, it would have been cause for concern, let me tell you, because I had really not raised money I you know, I really had not, I've not really fully campaigned. And then it was the night of the preliminary. I remember vividly emailing the some of the soccer board and saying, I cannot help out anymore with anything the season had begun at that point. And I had said, you know, there are seven weeks and my campaign is a disaster right now. And I have to devote myself entirely to fixing this and getting it on track. And then I basically lived campaign mode those final seven weeks. There's a perception out there that I didn't knock doors and that's definitely not true. It's true up until the preliminary election, but I'll tell you, I knocked a lot of doors and those final seven weeks I pretty much I probably averaged four to four and a half hours asleep in those seven weeks. And I lived that campaign. So I put in a lot of work on the campaign it all just was concentrated in this final seven weeks. Chris Oates 13:42 It's fascinating because hopefully one of the things we're doing in this podcast series is showing what it's actually like working in this world and your day job doesn't just go away because you want to run for office. You still have responsibilities from your previous life. Jake Wilson 13:59 Well mine did. When I cut the cord with that I was full time campaigning. I would go to bed with like racing thoughts, you know, one or 2am wake up at 6am Like with a jolt of adrenaline like you know, in panic mode up out of bed down to the home office. At that point I was planning my morning - not to go too into the weeds on this. Chris Oates But let's go let's go into those weeds. Jake Wilson We use Vote Builder. It is the database the Democratic Party in Massachusetts uses. I had to register as a Democrat to get access to it. I've been a proud independent because of annoyances I have with the Democratic Party. And I got really good advice from a current colleague who will remain nameless who told me to get over myself that my my little one-man protest wasn't being noticed by anyone. I should just get over myself and register as a Democrat. It’s really good advice. And I thank that person for it. And it proved, it proved to be excellent advice. And it getting Vote Builder and the minivan app was hugely helpful. So I would basically plan, you know, which doors I was going to knock? And then I would be out there from basically 9am. I'm one of these weird intermittent fasters. So I didn't need to stop for lunch, I could keep going. And I pretty much went from 9am to in many cases, sunset. And yeah, and I would on weekends, too, I would tend to, to knock a ton of doors as well. So I do that. I'd come home, eat some dinner, eight or nine o'clock. Go back down to the office, respond to emails, and that is oftentimes the only time I could respond to emails then. And plot the next day and you know, try to sleep at like one or two and rinse and repeat. Chris Oates 16:03 And then what was election day like? Did you did you find out the results on election day? Jake Wilson 16:08 Yeah, yeah. Election day, it's funny. So knocking all these doors and doing so late in the process gave me a pretty unique perspective. What I joke about is like anecdotal polling to the point, I have witnesses for this, I successfully predicted the order of finish for the eight of us in the in the at-large race, because you can you talk to enough people you can tell. And I was pretty confident about it. So I knew I had a chance to win. I remember running into some folks who, you know, didn't know me didn't think I, you know, didn't think I should be running. I remember saying, you know, I think I have a shot and they looked at me like I had three heads. I knew it was basically down to me and one other candidate for the fourth spot. And I thought that I knew I had a real shot when someone who was part of the Our Revolution, DSA slate, messaged me, and complimented me on the campaign and said, they were hearing a lot of support for me on the doors. And because of how good an organization they have in terms of canvassing, that told me that it was likely showing up in their voter data that I that I had support. I knew I'd done really good mailers. We spent a lot of money on mailers, because I did them late in the process. I did all the copy for them. Someone who does a lot of congressional campaigns did the design. And I know from talking to voters that those mailers, the three of them hit, they were really well designed, really appreciated that work. And I put a lot of effort into the content. And I know those maybe that was second to the youth soccer experience in terms of what got me into office. I know those mailers made a real impact. Chris Oates 18:08 It's just always interesting talking about municipal elections because, you follow congressional national news from the midterms or the presidential and you have constant polling, constant updates. But NBC is not polling Somerville. Jake Wilson 18:23 We have zero polling in Somerville. On election day, I went into it knowing I had a chance thinking I might actually have the inside track on the fourth spot. And I just remember it being a blur. I tried to hit all 21 precincts - some have shared polling stations. I want to say it was like 13 or 14 separate polling stations and I couldn't make it to all of them. There weren't enough hours a day, but I made it to a lot of them. And I just really remember I didn't eat, just sort of going on adrenaline. And I remember the one I ended up at. I was told to go to a big one at the end, like a polling location with multiple precincts. I picked the Somerville Community School for the closing. I waited too long to go inside because it had locked the doors. Because if you're there they can give you a printout of results. And I thought that'd be a good sort of bellwether. But I missed that. So I drove home and I had people some campaign folks and I wanted to get together with them. And we thought we'd be watching returns. But as I'm driving home on that 10 minute drive, I get a call from from my wife, who said, almost everything is in, you're up 500 votes with three precincts left. And I said, What precincts are they? And she, I don't know how she knew which ones maybe she'd looked it up. And I did some quick math. And I was like, I think I'm safe. I think I think I've got this. And by the time I got home, I want to say within five or 10 minutes, those other those straggling precincts had come in. I got a call from then Mayor Curtatone congratulating me. It was surreal, like people hadn't even arrived yet. And I already knew I had won. I will say on a personal note, I have my child, my oldest child was a big supporter of the candidate who finished fifth. And when I did, I saw this coming, I knew it was down to me and this other candidate. When this other candidate lost my child was in tears. And so it was weird. I get emotional talking about it, actually. It was this weird feeling of like euphoria. And then I have a child who's you know, I think that my child would rather that this person beat me honestly. So that was really kind of a gut punch while celebrating this thing, but yeah, and then people showed up on my back deck, and we had a weird, thrown together ragtag election night party. I sent a fairly inebriated resignation email to the soccer board, because I can't I had to. You can't be on a nonprofit board like that and be a city councilor. So resigned at about 2am after a decent amount of bourbon and woke up the next morning. Like, whoa, let's do this. Chris Oates 22:19 That's a great election night story. Okay, so you're you're in office. And let's jump forward to now the Green Line Expansion. This had been for those who don't know, the Green Line Expansion had been proposed decades ago, it had gone through a whole process. It was running way over budget, it was cancelled, it was started again. When I was living in Somerville, the construction was happening. So we knew it was eventually going to be built, or at least, we hoped so. But at what point on City Council, did you have a sense like, oh, it’s happening and it's happening now? It's not going to be delayed for another couple of years. We can start planning for it. Jake Wilson 22:53 Well, I mean, like you say, there have been so many deadlines, so many false dawns, I basically adopted a view of I’ll believe it when I see it. Yeah. I mean, they announced the date in March of the Union Square one. And I think I tweeted this out on social media, like, Alright, I'm seeing it, I believe it. I'm on a Green Line train, it's really happening. And that one was fun. But that's that's one station. And then the attention quickly turned. I mean, what's really going to be transformative for Somerville is having the the E line go right through the spine of the city. When they announced the date, that's probably when it started to get real. It got very real waking up at 4am on December 12, and then heading over to Tufts and riding on that first train. And that's that's when the the ultimate realness set in. Chris Oates 23:59 And was there any kind of celebratory events that the council was involved in? Or were you preparing for something? Was it was it a big party? Or was it just kind of another day in the office but it'll be a pretty good day. Jake Wilson 24:11 It was an inter governmental celebration. Current and previous mayor's were there at 430 at Tufts. I don't know if I can remember any other colleagues got up for it? Maybe 600 people there. We rode it all the way to JP because it's the first train so you can either get off and wait outside for the train to come back or you just stay in the warmth of the train. It was a pretty cool day so I just wrote it to JP and we came back and in true MBTA fashion, the train became disabled at Park Street station. And yeah, then we then we got off at Ball Square and that's where they the city had organized a morning rush hour celebration. Yeah, that was great. Lots of joy, brass bands, so many faces I know. Just general euphoria. I also took part in a protest immediately after that, for the Community Action Agency of Somerville protesting against the lack of protections that have been put in place around housing affordability and the displacement crisis that we have. It's been a real public policy failure in our state and in our region here, that we've experienced all the downsides gentrification-wise, that the Green Line is brought in without any of those, those protections put in place. And it's created a very perverse situation where the very people who this was brought here for - transit equity for the working class folks who need this - a lot of them are gone, because they have gotten pushed out of the city. So you know, it can be a sober, sobering, you know, upsetting moment, and it can be a moment of joy at the same time, like, both things can be true. And I'm fine, I can embrace that. That paradox. I'm okay with that. I'm okay with nuance. And that sums it up right there for me. Chris Oates 26:04 It's interesting, because you're on the one hand, you are an elected official of Somerville celebrating a governmental accomplishment. On the other hand, you are someone who has a series of issues and policies that you want to advance. And you don't want to miss an opportunity to do that. Jake Wilson 26:20 Yeah. And to your point at the very start of this. It can be it can be a tough business, sometimes it can be frustrating, you can it can leave you feeling powerless. And that's why it's really important to seize those victories, even small victories. In this case, a giant victory, a transformative victory. We have to celebrate those. It lets you refill your emotional tank, it gives you the fuel to fight on and reminds you that wins are possible. Like we can have good outcomes if we fight. And the you know, the GLX is is a testament to that, right? This was decades, we're not exaggerating, decades of advocacy. One of the first things I did in Somerville when I moved here in 2005 was attend a rally at the old high school auditorium. I had my green glow necklace on. And people literally yelled at state officials about them dragging their feet about this. So yeah, that's a good, good illustrative point of the power of organizing and the need for persistence. Chris Oates 27:31 As someone who's worked on winning campaigns and losing campaigns, you always need to appreciate what it feels like to win because it doesn't always happen. Okay, so that was really, really interesting. But I want to before you go have a few questions. What is politics actually like the West Wing, Veep, or House of Cards? Jake Wilson 27:50 What is it most like? Probably most like Veep. I mean, I know about the other shows, I'm familiar with them. It's just weird. Like, there's no job description, really. No one tells you how to do this stuff. We have a councillor’s college where it's sort of like a crash course and how the different departments work. But like, you sort of just have to kind of feel your way through it. Chris Oates 28:14 And what was in the political sense, what's been your best day in politics? Jake Wilson 28:19 Oh, that's a great question. My best day in politics, probably just from a relief point of view, the day we passed the budget for FY 23. As a new councillor, you have to learn about municipal finance and then I was a member of the finance committee. So you're the ones actually carrying out this whole thing. I was the Finance Chair. So I was having to plan these meetings and run them. And it was a really steep learning curve. My wife was away for work at a conference one week when we had four meetings that went from 6pm until midnight during June. So I remember feeling pretty euphoric when budget season officially ended with us officially approving the FY 23 budget. I won't take credit for it. It was innovations that were done with with staff, with the budget director in particular. But we we did set a modern record, going as far back as I could find it for the fewest minutes spent in committee meetings. Sorry, that's kind of an anticlimactic answer to your to your question. Chris Oates 29:48 No, if that was your best day, then that was your best day. I mean, this is what life in politics is like. It's sitting in budget meetings. Jake Wilson 29:55 Actually. You know what? I've got one for you. My kids go to the Healey School just down the road. Prior to getting involved in city council, my first real involvement with city government was leading a parent coalition at the school who pushed successful in the end but after a lot of effort to get the city to, to renovate it to build a new and actual school yard, their soccer field, younger kids equipment, older kids equipment. If there's a if there's a better school yard, anywhere in the area, I'd love to see it, I'd put this up against anything, they spent $6.4 million on it. And it happened for an area, I might get emotional talking about this again, I actually teared up at the speaking at the ribbon cutting ceremony on November 30. Because my kids go to the school. I coached these kids. It's an area not used to good things happening to it. And this, I know how much it means to the neighborhood, to the kids at that school, the message it sends to them that they really do matter when they get something nice like this. And I got really emotional talking about it, I had to actually cut my remarks short, or I was going to be full on crying at the lectern, they're on camera. But you get an emotional talking about it. But yeah, that that has to be the for me the best moment. Get full access to Halls of Power at hallsofpower.substack.com/subscribe (https://hallsofpower.substack.com/subscribe?utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=CTA_4)

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