Leading Awake is where top executives, founders, and senior leaders drop the mask and get real about the human side of leading at the highest level. The high-pressure, high-stakes moments where leadership actually counts. The decisions, conversations, and responses that can't be taken back. Each episode brings three of them into the kind of unscripted, honest conversation that doesn't usually happen in public.
Leading Awake
Claim This Podcastby with mentalist Gilan Gork
6 episodes
Updated Daily
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Podcast Overview
Leading Awake is where top executives, founders, and senior leaders drop the mask and get real about the human side of leading at the highest level. The high-pressure, high-stakes moments where leadership actually counts. The decisions, conversations, and responses that can't be taken back. Each episode brings three of them into the kind of unscripted, honest conversation that doesn't usually happen in public.
Language
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Publishing Since
4/2/2026
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Recent Episodes
July 14, 2026
How 3 Senior Leaders Keep Trust While Making Unpopular Calls | S01E05
<p>Three senior executives get honest about what it costs to do the right thing when jobs, trust, and results are all on the line. The CEO of Sappi Southern Africa, the Chief Brand Activation Officer at Smollan, and the Group CFO of iOCO drop the mask on the decisions that tested their integrity, and what staying true actually cost them.</p><p><br>It's easy to talk about values when things are calm. The real test comes when the right decision affects people's jobs, when the board wants answers now, and when every piece of advice says do something. This is the conversation that doesn't usually happen in public. Three leaders running forestry, global retail activation, and a JSE-listed technology turnaround get into selling a loss-making sawmill for the sake of its people, the tough calls behind a first profit in four years, and why trust is built months before you ever make the hard decision.</p><p><br>Guests:</p><p><br>Graeme Wild is the CEO of Sappi Southern Africa, one of the country's largest forestry and paper companies. He stepped into the role after three consecutive record years, with the pressure to put his stamp on it starting immediately.</p><p><br>Mike Smollan is the Chief Brand Activation Officer at Smollan, a global brand agency employing tens of thousands of people. He's helped grow a multi-generational family business into a global retail powerhouse while protecting the people-centred culture at its heart.</p><p><br>Ashona Kooblall is the Group CFO of iOCO, formerly the EOH Group. She stepped in with revenue in the JSE's top quartile and profitability at the bottom, made the tough calls in her first three months, and delivered the company's first solid profit in four years.</p><p><br>They explain:</p><p><br>◼ Why choosing between right and right is the hardest call a leader makes<br>◼ The five words that decided the sale of a sawmill in rural South Africa<br>◼ What it took to deliver iOCO's first solid profit in four years (and why it was never about proving herself)<br>◼ How taking everything personally becomes a strength, once you separate the emotion from the reaction<br>◼ Why the golden period for new leaders might be a myth, and what to do instead</p><p><br>Timestamps:</p><p><br></p><ul><li>(00:00) - Episode trailer </li> <li>(01:02) - Welcome to Leading Awake </li> <li>(02:25) - Meet the leaders: Sappi, Smollan, and iOCO </li> <li>(04:10) - The PEAK Practice Programme </li> <li>(05:16) - The myth that the CEO always knows </li> <li>(07:08) - When the illusion of brilliant leaders shatters </li> <li>(10:34) - Honesty when the share price is under pressure </li> <li>(12:59) - Integrity is institutional courage </li> <li>(15:07) - Trust is harder to earn and keep than you think </li> <li>(16:36) - Choosing between right and right </li> <li>(19:19) - Selling the sawmill: it's about people's jobs </li> <li>(21:33) - Hope is not a strategy </li> <li>(23:17) - Masks down: the fear before the big calls </li> <li>(25:04) - The iOCO turnaround: first profit in four years </li> <li>(27:56) - The golden period: act fast or hold back? </li> <li>(32:08) - Leading a family business like a listed corporate </li> <li>(33:46) - Just wait, just listen and learn </li> <li>(35:27) - The PEAK Practice Programme (mid-episode) </li> <li>(37:17) - I will be as honest as I can be with you </li> <li>(38:50) - I will debate anything with you, until the decision's made </li> <li>(42:56) - The overnight rule: unless the roof is falling, it can wait </li> <li>(44:08) - I take everything personally (and why it helps) </li> <li>(47:41) - Advice to a young leader: the social media test </li> <li>(49:16) - The one habit that most improved their leadership </li> <li>(52:58) - What it costs to stay true: closing reflections</li> </ul><br>Watch this episode on YouTube: https://youtu.be/AnF1YzPWKIE<p>About Leading Awake:</p><p>Leading Awake is a podcast for senior leaders who want to see clearly under pressure, connect more deeply, and respond more wisely in the high-stakes moments that count. Each episode is an honest, unscripted conversation with senior leaders who are willing to drop the mask and talk about what it actually takes to lead at the highest levels.</p><p><br>Host Gilan Gork started as a professional mentalist working with the human mind on stages across more than 40 countries, including Fortune 500 companies, governments, and NATO. That work pulled him deeper into the inner game of leadership, and into the body of work that became PeakAwake.</p><p><br>More at <a href="https://peakawake.com">https://peakawake.com<br></a><br></p><p>The 14-Day PEAK Practice Programme:</p><p><br>Everything in this episode points to the same thing: when the pressure is on, your perception narrows, exactly when you need it to be widest. The PEAK Practice Programme is a 14-day guided audio practice built to train the inner capacity to see clearly and respond wisely in real conditions. 10 to 15 minutes a day. Leaders who've completed it call it one of the most practically useful things they've done for their leadership.</p><p><br>Start here: <a href="https://peakawake.com">https://peakawake.com<br></a><br></p><p>If this conversation lands with you:</p><p><br>Follow Leading Awake on your podcast app so you don't miss the next conversation. And if you have a moment, please leave a rating or a review. It sounds like a small thing, but it's the most useful way to help platforms recommend the show to other senior leaders who'd benefit from these conversations.</p><p><br>If you know a leader who'd recognise themselves in this episode (the one facing a right-versus-right call, or feeling the pressure to prove themselves in a new role) share it with them. That's how community builds.</p>
June 22, 2026
3 Senior Leaders Admit It: Sometimes You Just Don't Know | S01E04
<p>Three senior leaders get honest about what happens when the pressure is real, the answers aren't there, and everyone in the room is looking to you anyway. The MD behind Starbucks South Africa, the CIO of Tiger Brands, and the head of HR at Pernod Ricard Africa share what deciding without certainty has actually looked like, and what it took to step into it.</p><p>The question most senior leaders carry privately and rarely say out loud: what do I do when I'm supposed to know and I don't? This episode is built around exactly that. Leah McCrae asked a boardroom of executives "is it okay if I don't know?" and it turned out to be one of the most trust-building moments of her career. Eugene van der Merwe had no management manual for leading through a pandemic where colleagues ended up in ICU on ventilators. Devandre Lawrence went for counselling to understand the childhood trauma underneath the persona he had built, and found it was the thing that made him the leader he is today. The conversation that doesn't usually happen at this level.</p><p><br><strong>Guests:</strong></p><p>Leah McCrae is the Managing Director of Rand Capital Coffee and the force behind Starbucks South Africa. She built the brand through bankruptcy, COVID, load shedding, and supply chain chaos, and became a leader who describes herself as intentionally vulnerable, and means it.</p><p>Eugene van der Merwe is the Chief Information Officer at Tiger Brands. At the time of recording, he was approaching the end of more than a decade as CIO of AVI Limited, where he led an essential services company through a pandemic and a major cyber event, both times with people's lives and livelihoods genuinely in the balance.</p><p><br>Devandre Lawrence is Head of HR at Pernod Ricard Africa. He came into a 24/7 FMCG environment as a gay man from a disadvantaged community, built a persona to survive it, and found his way through in a process that made him one of the most human voices in this conversation.</p><p><strong>They explain:</strong></p><p><br>◼ Why "is it okay if I don't know?" was the most trust-building thing Leah ever said in a boardroom<br>◼ What leading through a pandemic actually looks like when the decisions your team executes carry a real risk of death<br>◼ How childhood trauma shapes the leader you become, and why counselling isn't a detour from the work, it is the work<br>◼ The difference between transparency and honesty in a crisis, and why not everyone on your team can hold all of the information<br>◼ Why psychological safety looks different for each person on your team, and why getting that right opens the real conversation</p><p><strong>Timestamps: </strong></p><p></p><ul><li>(00:00) - Episode trailer </li> <li>(01:12) - Welcome to Leading Awake </li> <li>(02:50) - The PEAK Practice Programme (intro) </li> <li>(03:30) - The belief shift: leadership doesn't have one look or sound </li> <li>(05:26) - Why humility is the thing nobody put in the leadership manual </li> <li>(07:02) - "Is it okay if I don't know?" (Leah's boardroom moment) </li> <li>(09:39) - Bringing a company out of bankruptcy through COVID </li> <li>(12:00) - The ivory tower that doesn't exist </li> <li>(12:23) - When the decisions could cost someone their life (Eugene, COVID) </li> <li>(14:46) - What it takes to decompress when colleagues don't make it </li> <li>(17:11) - Leadership holds no title, it holds identity </li> <li>(19:34) - Coming into an industry that expected a different leader </li> <li>(22:00) - Why Devandre went for counselling (and what it changed) </li> <li>(25:11) - Leah on depression, loneliness, and the mask every leader wears </li> <li>(27:38) - "We're all just winging it" (and why that's actually okay) </li> <li>(29:15) - The PEAK Practice Programme (mid-episode) </li> <li>(31:39) - Pre-decision values: the answer before the crisis hits </li> <li>(32:19) - The cyber event and the humans behind the 36-hour shift </li> <li>(35:05) - The only way out of a wrong decision is honesty </li> <li>(40:36) - Psychological safety: the environment that opens the conversation </li> <li>(43:00) - Rapid fire: what's most improved your leadership effectiveness </li> <li>(45:44) - Closing thoughts + PEAK Practice</li> </ul><p><br>Follow our guests:</p><p><br>◼ <a href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/leah-mccrae-93192aa3/">Leah McCrae</a><br>◼ <a href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/eugenevdmerwe/">Eugene van der Merwe</a><br>◼ <a href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/devandr%C3%A9-lawrence-%F0%9F%8F%B3%E2%80%8D%F0%9F%8C%88-%F0%9F%87%BF%F0%9F%87%A6-64728249/">Devandre Lawrence</a></p><p><strong>About Leading Awake:</strong></p><p>Leading Awake is a podcast for senior leaders who want to see clearly under pressure, connect more deeply, and respond more wisely in the high-stakes moments that count. Each episode is an honest, unscripted conversation with senior leaders who are willing to drop the mask and talk about what it actually takes to lead at the highest levels.</p><p><br>Host Gilan Gork started as a professional mentalist working with the human mind on stages across more than 40 countries, including Fortune 500 companies, governments, and NATO. That work pulled him deeper into the inner game of leadership, and into the body of work that became PeakAwake.</p><p><br>More at https://peakawake.com</p><p><br><strong>The 14-Day PEAK Practice Programme:</strong></p><p>Everything in this episode points to the same thing: when the pressure is on, your perception narrows, exactly when you need it to be widest. The PEAK Practice Programme is a 14-day guided audio practice built to train the inner capacity to see clearly and respond wisely in real conditions. 10 to 15 minutes a day. Leaders who've completed it call it one of the most practically useful things they've done for their leadership.</p><p>Start here: https://peakawake.com</p><p><br><strong>If this conversation lands with you:</strong></p><p>Follow Leading Awake on your podcast app so you don't miss the next conversation. And if you have a moment, please leave a rating or a review. It sounds like a small thing, but it's the most useful way to help platforms recommend the show to other senior leaders who'd benefit from these conversations.</p><p>If you know a leader who'd recognise themselves in this episode (the one who's been carrying it alone, showing up certain for everyone else while privately not knowing the answer) share it with them. That's how community builds.</p>
June 2, 2026
C-Suite Confessions: How High Performers Lead Without Breaking | S01E03
<p>Three senior leaders get honest about what it costs to keep leading when you're stretched thin. The CEO of Lew Geffen Sotheby's International Realty, the Chief of Payments and Partnerships at JUMO, and the former CMO who led Kulula, British Airways, and Hollard share the moments work was quietly costing them everything else, and how they got themselves back.</p><p>The numbers don't stop. The deadlines don't stop. And somewhere in the middle of it all, the people who matter most start getting scraps. This is a conversation that doesn't usually happen in public. Three senior leaders open up about navigating mental health at the top, running toward every crisis until something breaks, and the moment a child said "mommy, we need you back".</p><p><strong>Guests:</strong></p><p>Yael Geffen is the CEO of Lew Geffen Sotheby's International Realty, one of South Africa's most recognised property brands. She has spoken openly about navigating bipolar disorder while leading at the highest level, and what that openness gave her back.</p><p>Brad Roper is the Chief of Payments and Partnerships at JUMO, leading live partnerships across the African continent. He defines his job by running toward whatever is on fire, until the moment his family told him he had stopped being playable.</p><p>Heidi Brauer is the former Chief Marketing Officer at Hollard, after leading brands like Kulula and British Airways at the top of South African corporate marketing for over a decade. Today she runs her own consultancy and brings a lens on leadership from outside the corporate machine.</p><p><strong>They explain:</strong></p><p>◼ Why Brad realised he was giving the people he loves the scraps (and what changed when his mom told him "you're not playable")<br>◼ What Yael learned by disclosing her bipolar disorder at the top of one of South Africa's biggest property brands<br>◼ The moment Heidi's son said "mommy, we need you back", and what she did with eight weeks notice and nowhere to go<br>◼ How Yael reframes her mental health as a "brilliant burden", and what that does for how she leads<br>◼ Why Heidi's "agenda-less meetings" surface more useful insight than the meetings with agendas</p><p><strong>Timestamps:</strong></p><p></p><ul><li>(00:00) - Episode trailer </li> <li>(01:03) - Welcome to Leading Awake </li> <li>(03:28) - The belief shift: what these leaders changed their mind about </li> <li>(07:34) - The mental health conversation: Yael's relapse, firing, and the culture she vowed to build </li> <li>(11:22) - Brad on the turnstile, imposter syndrome, and head/heart/health </li> <li>(14:08) - Yael on imposter syndrome and a "crisis of confidence" </li> <li>(15:17) - Heidi and Pierre: "promise me you'll never change" </li> <li>(19:00) - "Mommy, we need you back": Heidi's bathroom mirror moment </li> <li>(20:48) - The PEAK Practice Programme (mid-episode) </li> <li>(22:52) - "Red is good" and the family reckoning: Brad on running toward crisis </li> <li>(24:41) - Heidi: keeping the main thing the main thing </li> <li>(26:11) - Brad's rituals for staying present </li> <li>(27:41) - "The person getting scraps was me": Yael on self-discipline </li> <li>(30:46) - Heidi on the restructure she didn't survive </li> <li>(31:30) - Agenda-less meetings: the gem in the last 10 minutes </li> <li>(33:16) - Three closing reflections from the table </li> <li>(34:52) - Closing thoughts + PEAK Practice</li> </ul><br><p><strong>About Leading Awake:</strong></p><p>Leading Awake is a podcast for senior leaders who want to see clearly under pressure, connect more deeply, and respond more wisely in the high-stakes moments that count. Each episode is an honest, unscripted conversation with senior leaders who are willing to drop the mask and talk about what it actually takes to lead at the highest levels.</p><p>Host Gilan Gork started as a professional mentalist working with the human mind on stages across more than 40 countries, including Fortune 500 companies, governments, and NATO. That work pulled him deeper into the inner game of leadership, and into the body of work that became PeakAwake.</p><p>More at <a href="https://peakawake.com">https://peakawake.com<br></a><br></p><p><strong>The 14-Day PEAK Practice Programme:</strong></p><p>Everything in this episode points to the same thing: when the pressure is on, your perception narrows, exactly when you need it to be widest. The PEAK Practice Programme is a 14-day guided audio practice built to train the inner capacity to see clearly and respond wisely in real conditions. 10 to 15 minutes a day. Leaders who've completed it call it one of the most practically useful things they've done for their leadership.</p><p>Start here: <a href="https://peakawake.com">https://peakawake.com<br></a><br></p><p><strong>If this conversation lands with you:</strong></p><p>Follow Leading Awake on your podcast app so you don't miss the next conversation. And if you have a moment, please leave a rating or a review. It sounds like a small thing, but it's the most useful way to help platforms recommend the show to other senior leaders who'd benefit from these conversations.</p><p>If you know a leader who'd recognise themselves in this episode (the one running toward every crisis, the one whose family is quietly waiting for them to come back) share it with them. That's how community builds.</p>
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