3 Jul 2025
More Than Words with Guest Mike Sauter
In this week’s podcast, Fr John sits down with Mike, a longtime campus minister, parish leader, and now diocesan director of the Diocese of Rochester NY, whose story winds through backroads and retreat houses, late-night factory shifts and unexpected holy moments. Together, John and Mike explore what it means to live the Gospel not just as a message, but as a way of being. It’s a conversation about presence, permission, and the quiet courage to follow the Spirit (sometimes a little off-script!)
Recorded the day after Pentecost, the episode explores the call to live authentically in a world that is increasingly mediated by institutions, systems, and narratives that often obscure our deepest spiritual needs.
🔊 Quote Highlights
“The more you can learn to speak from your heart, the more universal it becomes.” — Mike
“We are most ourselves when we are most with others.” — Mike
“Jesus didn’t say ‘learn this content.’ He said, ‘follow me.’” — Mike
"The medium is the message in the form of Jesus Christ"
🌟 Topics Covered
Mass Media as Formation: The influence of Marshall McLuhan (“the medium is the message”) and how mass media shapes not just what we learn, but how we live.
Ivan Illich's critique of institutional religion: education, healthcare, and even the Church as systems that can alienate rather than liberate.
Faith as Personal and Incarnational: Preaching and proclaiming the Gospel by telling our real stories—speaking from our own wounds and callings.
Youth and Authenticity: What today’s high school and college students teach us about resisting systems that don’t serve the soul.
The Divine Feminine and the Holy Spirit: Drawing from Pentecost and the Feast of Mary, Mother of the Church, the episode explores how nurturing others and being nurtured ourselves is central to Christian life.
Preaching from Personal Experience: Referencing the CALLED initiative and Sunday to Sunday’s mission, Mike affirms the power of ordinary people sharing their extraordinary moments of grace.
The Power of Community and Cohorts: Reflections on being part of the first CALLED cohort, and how lay people can become evangelists through community, vulnerability, and formation.
📚 Deeper Dive Resources & References
Ivan Illich
Deschooling Society
Rivers North of the Future (interviewed by David Cayley)
David Cayley's work on Illich (https://www.davidcayley.com)
Marshall McLuhan: “The medium is the message” and “The medium is the massage”
Wendell Berry: Used in Mike’s campus ministry writing courses
William Blake: Referenced for his visionary theology and poetic influence
Daniel Andreev: Russian mystic and author of The Rose of the World
Rudolf Steiner & Owen Barfield: Philosophers/theologians discussed in relation to imagination and mystery
Simone Weil, John Milbank, William Cavanaugh: Referenced for further theological engagement
Jordan Peterson: Noted for contemporary cultural critique and appeal to youth searching for answers and faith, de facto apologist
First Things: (https://firstthings.com/) Mike’s article on the Immaculate Conception featured there.
Dioceses of Rochester, NY (https://www.dor.org/)
🔗 Links
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