That's Just Criminal
Annabel Cresswell and Sumudu Thode
4.5from 11 ratings
- 14
- Episodes
- 11
- Ratings
- Monthly
- Cadence
- 2024
- First episode
- 548
- YouTube views
About That's Just Criminal
Powered by LexisNexis & The Criminal Bar Association NZ Inc. Barristers Annabel Cresswell and Sumudu Thode will bring you insight from some of the most highly regarded criminal minds across both New Zealand and the globe - as they discuss the criminal law issues of the day, and the clients and cases they defend. Criminal law is interesting, diverse, and challenging. The role of criminal lawyers is to uphold our justice system by ensuring that every defendant is delivered the right to legal representation and a fair trial. In addition to providing insight for the public, the podcast aims to create a community for those working in criminal law - one that recognises just how isolating it is to be the person standing up in court alone.
- Publisher
- Annabel Cresswell and Sumudu Thode
- Category
- business · society & culture · true crime
- Language
- en
- Explicit
- Yes
- First episode
- 25 Jul 2024
- Latest episode
- 23 Aug 2026
Latest episodes
14 episodes in the feed.
23 Aug 2026
Keep Going with Kirsten Gray
This episode is brought to you by LexisNexis (https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/lexisnexisnz) and the Criminal Bar Association NZ (https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/criminalbarassociationnz) Annabel Cresswell and Sumudu Thode sit down with Christchurch Barrister, Kirsten Gray. It’s a conversation about grit, perspective, vulnerability and the people and moments that help us get through the tough times. Because sometimes there isn’t a magic answer. Sometimes, you just have to… keep going. About Kirsten: Kirsten specialises in all aspects of criminal law but has a particular expertise in unravelling criminal charges and trial work. She has undertaken over one hundred jury trials. Kirsten has practised criminal law for over twenty years. She regularly undertakes trials in the District and High Court and appears on appeals in the High Court and Court of Appeal. She frequently represents clients on bail, discharge without conviction and name suppression applications and on parole hearings. Links: Kirsten Gray: https://www.kirstengray.co.nz/ Disclaimer: The opinions expressed in this podcast are our own views and views of our guests. Nothing in this podcast is to be taken as legal advice. LexisNexis: https://www.lexisnexis.com/en-nz Website: https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/ Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/thats-just-criminal/id1760434280 Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/64vXKFxggrKAKB2j6Zld67 YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@ThatsJustCriminal
3 Jun 2026
Steve Braunias: The Polkinghorne Trial and Are Defence Lawyers Rock Stars?
This episode is brought to you by LexisNexis (https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/lexisnexisnz) and the Criminal Bar Association NZ (https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/criminalbarassociationnz) Annabel Cresswell and Sumudu Thode speak with award winning writer and journalist, Steve Braunias About Steve: Steve Braunias is a multiple award-winning author, columnist, journalist and editor. He writes for the New Zealand Listener, serves as the literary editor of Newsroom, and is the author of 14 books. Steve was part of The New Zealand Herald reporting team who won Best Coverage of a Major News Event at the 2025 Voyager Media Awards for their coverage of the Polkinghorne trial. Links: Polkinghorne: Inside the Trial of the Century https://www.allenandunwin.co.nz/browse/book/Steve-Braunias-Polkinghorne-9781991142405 The Valley by Asher Emmanuel: https://www.bwb.co.nz/books/the-valley Disclaimer: The opinions expressed in this podcast are our own views and views of our guests. Nothing in this podcast is to be taken as legal advice. Website: https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/ Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/thats-just-criminal/id1760434280 Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/64vXKFxggrKAKB2j6Zld67 YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@ThatsJustCriminal
19 Apr 2026
Making Sentencing Sexy with Robin McCoubrey
This podcast is brought to you by LexisNexis (https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/lexisnexisnz) and the Criminal Bar Association NZ (https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/criminalbarassociationnz) Annabel Cresswell and Sumudu Thode discuss the sentencing process in Aotearoa New Zealand with Robin McCoubrey. Some topics covered in this episode include: Misconceptions about sentencing Parity & tariff cases explained Sentencing from a prosecutor's perspective Sentencing from a defence perspective How defence lawyers prepare for sentencing Changes to the Sentencing Act Rehabilitation over punishment & the limits of deterrence Advising clients after sentencing & appeals About Robin: Robin is one of Aotearoa New Zealand’s most experienced and respected trial lawyers, enjoying the trust and confidence of the senior judiciary and his colleagues in the profession. He was a Partner at Meredith Connell (MC) for nine years. In the past few years, he has prosecuted some of the most high-profile, evidentially complex and emotionally charged cases to come before the courts. He is known as a technically excellent lawyer and advocate, but also someone who is approachable, collaborative and easy to work with. Robin accepts instructions in many areas of litigation including regulatory and civil matters, inquests and inquiries, proceeds of crime proceedings and criminal investigations and prosecutions. Links: Robin McCoubrey: https://richmondchambers.co.nz/ (https://richmondchambers.co.nz/) Disclaimer: The opinions expressed in this podcast are our own views and views of our guests. Nothing in this podcast is to be taken as legal advice. Website: https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/ Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/thats-just-criminal/id1760434280 Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/64vXKFxggrKAKB2j6Zld67 YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@ThatsJustCriminal
10 Dec 2025
Legal Insights: Nick Chisnall KC on the appeal process
This podcast is brought to you by LexisNexis (https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/lexisnexisnz) and the Criminal Bar Association NZ (https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/criminalbarassociationnz) Annabel Cresswell and Sumudu Thode discuss the appeal process in Aotearoa New Zealand with Nick Chisnall KC. Nick specialises in criminal appellate litigation. He has appeared on many of New Zealand’s leading and reported cases in the Supreme Court and Court of Appeal. He joined the independent bar in 2017. Before that, he was the Public Defence Service’s General Counsel and oversaw its appellate practice. Prior to joining the PDS, Nick was Crown Counsel at the Crown Law Office. Nick took silk in 2022. Links: nickchisnall.co.nz (http://www.nickchisnall.co.nz/) augustachambers.co.nz (http://augustachambers.co.nz/) Disclaimer: The opinions expressed in this podcast are our own views and views of our guests. Nothing in this podcast is to be taken as legal advice. Website: https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/ (https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/) Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/thats-just-criminal/id1760434280 (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/thats-just-criminal/id1760434280) Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/64vXKFxggrKAKB2j6Zld67 (https://open.spotify.com/show/64vXKFxggrKAKB2j6Zld67) YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@ThatsJustCriminal (https://www.youtube.com/@ThatsJustCriminal)
23 Oct 2025
Name Suppression in Aotearoa: fairness or favouritism
This podcast is brought to you by LexisNexis (https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/lexisnexisnz) and the Criminal Bar Association NZ (https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/criminalbarassociationnz) Annabel and Sumudu sit down with journalist Edward Gay to talk about name suppression. Eddie has spent 20 years covering high-profile cases from the Kahui twins to Philip Polkinghorne. They discuss the criteria for name suppression and balancing that with open reporting About Eddie: Edward Gay has worked as a journalist for the past 20 years, at the New Zealand Herald, Radio New Zealand and Stuff. He is currently a member of Stuff's In-depth national team. Eddie has covered many of the high-profile trials in the past 20 years including the Kahui case, David Bain's retrial, Jesse Kempson -- Grace Millane's killer -- and the trial of Philip Polkinghorne. He regularly opposes applications for name suppression. You can read his stories on Stuff.co.nz (http://stuff.co.nz/) Disclaimer: The opinions expressed in this podcast are our own views and views of our guests. Nothing in this podcast is to be taken as legal advice. Website: https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/ (https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/) Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/thats-just-criminal/id1760434280 (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/thats-just-criminal/id1760434280) Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/64vXKFxggrKAKB2j6Zld67 (https://open.spotify.com/show/64vXKFxggrKAKB2j6Zld67) YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@ThatsJustCriminal (https://www.youtube.com/@ThatsJustCriminal)
11 Sept 2025
Do we have serial killers in Aotearoa New Zealand? Featuring Detective Inspector Scott Beard
That's Just Criminal is sponsored by LexisNexis (https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/lexisnexisnz) and the Criminal Bar Association NZ (https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/criminalbarassociationnz) Detective Inspector Scott Beard is one of the most experienced and recognised police officers in Aotearoa New Zealand and has been involved in a number of high profile investigations. Annabel and Sumudu spoke to Scott about if there have been serial killers in Aotearoa New Zealand and about people disappearing from Piha. About Scott: Scott Beard joined NZ Police in 1980. He qualified as a Detective in 1988 and has been a Detective Inspector since 2008. He has worked on and lead countless homicide and other major investigations. His most notable cases include the Operation Stockholm investigation involving missing Swedish tourists Heidi Paakkonen and Urban Hoglin. In 2018 he ran the investigation into the missing English girl Grace Millane, who was ultimately found murdered and was the face of Police in the media for this case. Disclaimer: The opinions expressed in this podcast are our own views and views of our guests. Nothing in this podcast is to be taken as legal advice. Website: https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/ (https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/) Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/thats-just-criminal/id1760434280 (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/thats-just-criminal/id1760434280) Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/64vXKFxggrKAKB2j6Zld67 (https://open.spotify.com/show/64vXKFxggrKAKB2j6Zld67) YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@ThatsJustCriminal (https://www.youtube.com/@ThatsJustCriminal)
27 Jul 2025
The Secret Barrister: A Candid Conversation on a Broken System
That's Just Criminal is sponsored by LexisNexis (https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/lexisnexisnz) and the Criminal Bar Association NZ (https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/criminalbarassociationnz) In this podcast episode of 'That's Just Criminal,' hosts Annabel Cresswell and Sumudu Thode welcome the acclaimed yet anonymous 'Secret Barrister' as their special guest*. Known for highlighting the intricate issues within the UK criminal justice system through blogs, books, and articles in renowned newspapers, the Secret Barrister shares their views and experiences. *These are real answers from the Secret Barrister, to maintain anonymity this episode features an AI voice Links: The Secret Barrister: https://thesecretbarrister.com/ (https://thesecretbarrister.com/) Disclaimer: The opinions expressed in this podcast are our own views and views of our guests. Nothing in this podcast is to be taken as legal advice. LexisNexis: https://www.lexisnexis.com/en-nz (https://www.lexisnexis.com/en-nz) Website: https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/ (https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/) Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/thats-just-criminal/id1760434280 (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/thats-just-criminal/id1760434280) Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/64vXKFxggrKAKB2j6Zld67 (https://open.spotify.com/show/64vXKFxggrKAKB2j6Zld67) YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@ThatsJustCriminal (https://www.youtube.com/@ThatsJustCriminal)
28 Apr 2025
6: Under Surveillance with Private Investigator Tim McKinnel
That's Just Criminal is sponsored by LexisNexis (https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/lexisnexisnz) and the Criminal Bar Association NZ (https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/criminalbarassociationnz) . In this episode of 'That's Just Criminal,' hosts Sumudu Thode and Annabel Cresswell are joined by New Zealand's renowned private investigator, Tim McKinnel. The discussion sheds light on the often misunderstood role of a private investigator in the criminal justice system. Tim shares his journey from a police officer to a private investigator, his involvement in high-profile miscarriage of justice cases, and the complex nature of his work which is far from the glamorized TV portrayal. The conversation touches on the ethics of surveillance, the impact of technology, and the emotional toll of pursuing justice. Tim also delves into international investigative work, including a fascinating stint with Greenpeace, and emphasises the importance of addressing systemic issues like poverty to combat crime effectively. About Tim: Tim is a leading New Zealand investigator specialising in complex and sensitive investigations. He has worked for Zavést since 2008. A former New Zealand police detective, Tim has a particular interest in criminal, human rights and environmental investigations. He has led a number of successful and high-profile investigations into wrongful convictions, including those of Teina Pora, wrongfully convicted of rape and murder and released in 2015, and Alan Hall, wrongfully convicted of murder and released in 2022. Tim also led the investigation into the wrongful convictions of Gail Maney, Stephen Stone, Mark Henriksen and Colin Maney, the Larnoch Road four, who had their convictions relating to two murders quashed in 2024. His wrongful conviction work has seen his clients compensated more than $8.5 million, and counting. Tim also led several human rights and environmental investigations in South East Asia, West Africa and the Pacific, as well as New Zealand, in recent years. Links: Elon’s Spies podcast: https://www.tortoisemedia.com/listen/elons-spies (https://www.tortoisemedia.com/listen/elons-spies) Crime: Need vs Greed: https://www.tvnz.co.nz/shows/crime-need-vs-greed (https://www.tvnz.co.nz/shows/crime-need-vs-greed) Disclaimer: The opinions expressed in this podcast are our own views and views of our guests. Nothing in this podcast is to be taken as legal advice. Website: https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/ (https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/) Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/thats-just-criminal/id1760434280 (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/thats-just-criminal/id1760434280) Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/64vXKFxggrKAKB2j6Zld67 (https://open.spotify.com/show/64vXKFxggrKAKB2j6Zld67) YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@ThatsJustCriminal (https://www.youtube.com/@ThatsJustCriminal)
17 Mar 2025
5: So You Want to be a Barrister? Careers in Criminal Law in New Zealand
That's Just Criminal is sponsored by LexisNexis (https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/lexisnexisnz) and the Criminal Bar Association NZ (https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/criminalbarassociationnz). In this episode of "That's Just Criminal," hosts Sumudu Thode and Annabel Cresswell welcome Jacob Barry, a Crown Prosecutor and Partner at Meredith Connell, to discuss their different starts in criminal law. About Jacob: Jacob is a Partner at Meredith Connell, specialising in prosecuting serious criminal and commercial regulatory cases. Jacob graduated from the University of Canterbury in 2012 with degrees in Law and Commerce. He started his legal career as a Judges’ Clerk at the Auckland High Court, before joining Meredith Connell to work as a Crown Prosecutor. In 2016, he moved overseas to study for a Masters degree at Harvard Law School, later returning to Meredith Connell. He regularly appears in the District and High Courts, prosecuting matters ranging from cartel conduct to homicide and sexual violence. Links: https://www.mc.co.nz/people/jacob-barry (https://www.mc.co.nz/people/jacob-barry) Disclaimer: The opinions expressed in this podcast are our own views and views of our guests. Nothing in this podcast is to be taken as legal advice. Website: https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/ (https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/) Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/thats-just-criminal/id1760434280 (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/thats-just-criminal/id1760434280) Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/64vXKFxggrKAKB2j6Zld67 (https://open.spotify.com/show/64vXKFxggrKAKB2j6Zld67) YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@ThatsJustCriminal (https://www.youtube.com/@ThatsJustCriminal)
15 Dec 2024
4: Courtroom Confessions: Listener questions answered
Defence barristers Annabel Cresswell and Sumudu Thode share candid insights into handling challenging cases and navigating courtroom dynamics, shedding light on the everyday realities of their profession.
20 Oct 2024
3: Judge vs Jury: A decision on the decision maker
This podcast is powered by LexisNexis (https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/lexisnexisnz) and Criminal Bar Association NZ (https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/criminalbarassociationnz) In this episode of 'That's Just Criminal,' hosts Annabel Cresswell and Sumudu Thode welcome Andrew Hill, a seasoned lawyer and a member of the Criminal Bar Association New Zealand. The discussion centers on the critical decision of electing a trial by a judge or jury for cases with potential sentences exceeding two years. The conversation covers factors influencing this decision, such as the nature of charges, client biases, and the potential influence of media and societal movements. About Andrew Hill: Andrew is an experienced courtroom advocate who specialises in all forms of criminal and regulatory law. Andrew graduated with degrees in Law and Science from the University of Otago in 2004. After working as a crown prosecutor in Gisborne he worked in London for the Bar Council of England and Wales. This work primarily involved prosecuting barristers for professional misconduct. He has also worked as a crown prosecutor for the Rotorua Crown. During this time he personally prosecuted over 90 criminal trials in the District and High Courts. Andrew also regularly appeared on prosecutions brought by the Civil Aviation Authority. Andrew has a specialist expertise in aviation related prosecutions and has appeared for the CAA on numerous matters up and down the country. After taking a career break in 2019 to travel with his family Andrew now offers criminal defence and regulatory services based in Rotorua. Link: https://www.hilllaw.co.nz/ (https://www.hilllaw.co.nz/) Disclaimer: The opinions expressed in this podcast are our own views and views of our guests. Nothing in this podcast is to be taken as legal advice. Website: https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/ (https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/) Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/thats-just-criminal/id1760434280 (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/thats-just-criminal/id1760434280) Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/64vXKFxggrKAKB2j6Zld67 (https://open.spotify.com/show/64vXKFxggrKAKB2j6Zld67) YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@ThatsJustCriminal (https://www.youtube.com/@ThatsJustCriminal)
1 Sept 2024
2: Behind the bar: How Lawyer X shook the justice system
This rare interview with Rishi Nathwani SC delves into the case of Lawyers X / Nicola Gobbo, the Victorian Barrister turned police informant and the fallout of her actions, the actions of the Police, and the resulting Royal Commission of Enquiry. This podcast is proudly sponsored by LexisNexis (https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/lexisnexisnz) and the Criminal Bar Association NZ (https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/criminalbarassociationnz) About Rishi Nathwani Rishi was appointed silk in 2023, after 5 years at the Victorian Bar. He was called to the Bar of England and Wales in 2006 and has been in practice ever since. Since 2011, Rishi has been recognised in the criminal directories in either the Australia and/or the UK as leading counsel. In 2023, he was recognised as Preeminent Junior Counsel for Victoria and Leading Junior Counsel for Australia in Doyles Guides of 2023. Although only in silk since October 2023, he is currently recognised as a leading silk for Victoria in the current 2024 Doyles Guide for Victoria. Rishi is an experienced barrister from London who practised at the Bar of England & Wales for over 11 years (2006 – 2017) prior to arriving in Victoria. Rishi’s busy practice has involved serious criminal offending, regulatory offences & proceeds of crime/confiscation. Rishi’s regular diet of work relates to the most serious and high profile matters. These include allegations of murder, terrorism, organised crime offences, significant drug importations, historic child sexual abuse of children. Furthermore, Rishi is routinely instructed in white collar crime matters and associated regulatory matters. He is instructed to advise NHW individuals prior to potential charges and if charged, instructed to represent them. Rishi regularly advises and appears in the appellate jurisdiction. Rishi also appears in Coronial Inquests and Public Inquiries. These including acting for Lawyer X (Nicola Gobbo) at the Royal Commission and the Aunty Donna Nelson at the Inquest into the death of her daughter, Veronica Nelson. He has also assisted the Department of Justice in introducing and training intermediaries to the Criminal Justice System. https://www.vicbar.com.au/profile/9110 Disclaimer: The opinions expressed in this podcast are our own views and views of our guests. Nothing in this podcast is to be taken as legal advice.
1 Sept 2024
1: Is silence golden? The dilemma of giving evidence
In this episode of 'That's Just Criminal,' hosts Annabel Cresswell and Sumudu Thode, along with guest Wayne McKean discuss how they navigate the decision-making process of clients’ giving evidence at Trial. This episode offers a behind-the-scenes look at the strategies, risks, and real-world experiences that shape a defence lawyer's approach in the courtroom. This podcast is powered byLexisNexis (https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/lexisnexisnz)and the Criminal Bar Association NZ (https://thats-just-criminal.captivate.fm/criminalbarassociationnz) About Wayne McKean: Wayne is a highly accomplished client advocate, with almost 30 years of experience in the criminal law. He has worked for the Crown in Auckland, England and Wales and has been at the defence Bar for over 20 years. He leads a law firm in Whangarei as one of its Managing Directors and heads the firm's criminal litigation team. Wayne has a well-deserved reputation as an excellent criminal lawyer, advocating for both private crime and legal aid clients, leading cases in the District Court, High Court and Court of Appeal. Website: https://wrmk.co.nz/ (https://wrmk.co.nz/) Disclaimer: The opinions expressed in this podcast are our own views and views of our guests. Nothing in this podcast is to be taken as legal advice.
25 Jul 2024
Trailer
The podcast by criminal lawyers on justice, crime – and the legal line Esteemed criminal lawyers Annabel Cresswell and Sumudu Thode present “That’s Just Criminal” which delves into the fascinating world of criminal law. Proudly powered by the Criminal Bar Association and LexisNexis.
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- YouTube views
- 548
- Score snapshot 15 Sept 2025
- Spotify
- 4.5 / 5
- 11 ratings
Podcast Authority Score: 21 / 100
A composite of feed quality, social presence, YouTube performance and engagement. Read the methodology.
- Quality
- 4
- Social presence
- 0
- YouTube
- 66
- Engagement
- 31
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