The Backstage Pastors Podcast
Phil Taylor and Tyler Drewitz
5.0from 4 ratings
- 19
- Episodes
- 4
- Ratings
- Bi-weekly
- Cadence
- 2025
- First episode
About The Backstage Pastors Podcast
The Backstage Pastors Podcast is dedicated to the unique challenges and opportunities facing executive pastors and second-chair leaders in churches and nonprofits. Hosts Phil Taylor and Tyler Drewitz share hard-earned insights and introduce listeners to diverse leaders doing meaningful work behind the scenes. Together, they offer practical, actionable conversations designed to strengthen the ministries and people they quietly support.
- Publisher
- Phil Taylor and Tyler Drewitz
- Category
- religion & spirituality
- Language
- en
- Explicit
- No
- First episode
- 10 Dec 2025
- Latest episode
- 7 Oct 2026
Latest episodes
19 episodes in the feed.
7 Oct 2026
Outsourcing your Key Hires with Matt Steen from Chemistry Staffing
In this episode of the Backstage Pastors podcast, Phil Taylor sits down with Matt Steen, co-founder of Chemistry Staffing, to talk about church staffing, pastoral succession, and the evolving role of the executive pastor. Matt shares his unconventional journey into ministry and explains why Chemistry Staffing was created to help churches find healthier, longer-lasting ministry fits. They also discuss the shrinking pipeline of ministry leaders, why some churches may not actually need an executive pastor, and what aspiring XPs should consider when looking for the right role. Matt highlights concerning trends in staff retention and encourages church leaders to have intentional conversations about their team members’ health, calling, and future. They close with practical ways churches can develop and send leaders while creating healthier teams and more sustainable ministry. Mentioned Resources 🗣️Connect with Matt Steen (https://www.linkedin.com/in/matthewsteen) 💻 Chemistry Staffing (https://www.chemistrystaffing.com/) 📩 Contact Matt Steen (mailto:matt.steen@chemistrystaffing.com) 📕Turn the Ship Around! (https://a.co/d/0gdpiiuJ) by L. David Marquet Upcoming Events Harbor Network Conference (https://www.harbornetwork.com/events-feed/leaders-summit-2026)— Fort Myers, Florida The Church Hub Executive Pastor Cohort (https://thechurchhub.org/support-your-team/executive-pastor-cohort) From Our Partners 💻 The Church Hub: The Church Hub serves pastors, ministry leaders, and their spouses through equipping and training resources. Learn more at https://thechurchhub.org (https://thechurchhub.org) Connect with Phil Taylor ✉️ Get Phil's Newsletter (https://backstagepastors.us13.list-manage.com/subscribe?u=d2e6c50a43a3219c368d5fe4e&id=e617b3a474) ✉️ phil@backstagepastors.org 🗣️ @philtaylorxp (https://www.instagram.com/philtaylorxp/) 📚 Books by Phil (https://www.amazon.com/stores/Phil-Taylor/author/B06VWSCCV6?ref=ap_rdr&shoppingPortalEnabled=true&ccs_id=8e6e4bb1-3a62-4ec3-a6eb-2d8c6bd776cc) 💻 backstagepastors.org (http://backstagepastors.org) 💻plainjoestudios.com (http://plainjoestudios.com) Connect with Tyler Drewitz ✉️ tyler@myxp.church 🗣️ @tylerdrewitz (https://www.instagram.com/tylerdrewitz/) 💻 myxp.church (https://www.myxp.church/) 💻ridgelineprinting.com (http://ridgelineprinting.com) The best way to support this podcast is to like, subscribe and share it with a friend. LIKE & SUBSCRIBE 📹 Youtube (https://www.youtube.com/@backstagepastors7152) 🍏 Apple (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-backstage-pastors/id1860421534) 🎤 Spotify (https://open.spotify.com/show/4UjAzVaOsE0P2yCeukZODb?si=95933665830d4bea) CHAPTERS 03:59 — Matt Steen’s Unconventional Journey into Ministry 07:29 — Why Chemistry Staffing Was Started 10:13 — Succession and the Shrinking Ministry Pipeline 14:09 — Does Your Church Really Need an Executive Pastor? 16:48 — Advice for Aspiring Executive Pastors 22:15 — Surviving Your First Year as an XP 26:24 — What the Church Staff Health Assessment Is Revealing 30:04 — The Three-to-Five-Year Wall and Developing Staff 38:43 — How Chemistry Staffing Approaches Church Hiring – – Editing and Support by The Good Podcast Co. Backstage Pastors™️ is a Registered Trademark
16 Sept 2026
Holly Tate on the "Yes Test" with Your Senior Leader
Executive pastors and second-chair leaders are often responsible for turning a senior leader’s vision into action—but what happens when there are more ideas than the organization can realistically execute? Holly Tate of The Ready Network joins Phil and Tyler to discuss sustainable growth, second-chair leadership, and becoming “yes-obsessed.” Holly introduces the Yes Test, a five-question framework that helps church leaders evaluate new opportunities, protect organizational focus, and determine what deserves a yes—and what needs a no. Mentioned Resources 🗣️Follow Holly Tate (https://www.instagram.com/hollyhalltate) 💻 More From Holly (https://www.hollytate.com) 💻The Ready Network (https://www.thereadynetwork.com) 📩 Contact Holly - holly@thereadynetwork.com (mailto:holly@thereadynetwork.com) Upcoming Events Harbor Network Conference (https://www.harbornetwork.com/events-feed/leaders-summit-2026) — Fort Myers, Florida - From Our Partners 💻 The Church Hub: The Church Hub serves pastors, ministry leaders, and their spouses through equipping and training resources. Learn more at https://thechurchhub.org (https://thechurchhub.org) Connect with Phil Taylor ✉️ Get Phil's Newsletter (https://backstagepastors.us13.list-manage.com/subscribe?u=d2e6c50a43a3219c368d5fe4e&id=e617b3a474) ✉️ phil@backstagepastors.org 🗣️ @philtaylorxp (https://www.instagram.com/philtaylorxp/) 📚 Books by Phil (https://www.amazon.com/stores/Phil-Taylor/author/B06VWSCCV6?ref=ap_rdr&shoppingPortalEnabled=true&ccs_id=8e6e4bb1-3a62-4ec3-a6eb-2d8c6bd776cc) 💻 backstagepastors.org (http://backstagepastors.org) 💻plainjoestudios.com (http://plainjoestudios.com) Connect with Tyler Drewitz ✉️ tyler@myxp.church 🗣️ @tylerdrewitz (https://www.instagram.com/tylerdrewitz/) 💻 myxp.church (https://www.myxp.church/) 💻ridgelineprinting.com (http://ridgelineprinting.com) The best way to support this podcast is to like, subscribe and share it with a friend. LIKE & SUBSCRIBE 📹 Youtube (https://www.youtube.com/@backstagepastors7152) 🍏 Apple (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-backstage-pastors/id1860421534) 🎤 Spotify (https://open.spotify.com/show/4UjAzVaOsE0P2yCeukZODb?si=95933665830d4bea) CHAPTERS 03:01 — Holly Tate’s Leadership Journey 09:18 — Helping Leaders and Teams Prepare for Growth 12:59 — What It Means to Be Yes-Obsessed 16:21 — The Yes Test for Second-Chair Leaders 20:24 — Five Questions for Evaluating New Opportunities 28:01 — Leading Up and Earning a Seat at the Table 34:00 — Building Healthier Church Boards 36:23 — Using AI to Help Executives Stay Focused – – Editing and Support by The Good Podcast Co. Backstage Pastors™️ is a Registered Trademark
2 Sept 2026
From Executive Pastor to The Gospel Coalition with Zach Cochran
Zach Cochran, Vice President of Operations at The Gospel Coalition, joins Phil and Tyler to discuss his transition from executive pastor to nonprofit second-chair leadership, the importance of operational leaders in the church, and TGC’s work helping Christians navigate artificial intelligence. He also shares practical wisdom for XPs considering a ministry transition and explains why healthy church leadership often requires patience with the slow, relational nature of ministry. Mentioned Resources 🗣️Follow The Gospel Coalition (https://www.instagram.com/thegospelcoalition/) 💻 The Gospel Coalition Articles (https://www.thegospelcoalition.org/articles/) 💻 TGC AI Policy (https://www.thegospelcoalition.org/article/ai-tgc-missional-opportunity/) 🎙️Silicon Spiritualities (https://www.thegospelcoalition.org/podcasts/silicon-spiritualities/) — TGC podcast exploring AI, its formative effects, and questions about wise Christian engagement with artificial intelligence. From Our Partners 💻 The Church Hub: The Church Hub serves pastors, ministry leaders, and their spouses through equipping and training resources. Learn more at https://thechurchhub.org (https://thechurchhub.org) Connect with Phil Taylor ✉️ Get Phil's Newsletter (https://backstagepastors.us13.list-manage.com/subscribe?u=d2e6c50a43a3219c368d5fe4e&id=e617b3a474) ✉️ phil@backstagepastors.org 🗣️ @philtaylorxp (https://www.instagram.com/philtaylorxp/) 📚 Books by Phil (https://www.amazon.com/stores/Phil-Taylor/author/B06VWSCCV6?ref=ap_rdr&shoppingPortalEnabled=true&ccs_id=8e6e4bb1-3a62-4ec3-a6eb-2d8c6bd776cc) 💻 backstagepastors.org (http://backstagepastors.org) 💻plainjoestudios.com (http://plainjoestudios.com) Connect with Tyler Drewitz ✉️ tyler@myxp.church 🗣️ @tylerdrewitz (https://www.instagram.com/tylerdrewitz/) 💻 myxp.church (https://www.myxp.church/) 💻ridgelineprinting.com (http://ridgelineprinting.com) The best way to support this podcast is to like, subscribe and share it with a friend. LIKE & SUBSCRIBE 📹 Youtube (https://www.youtube.com/@backstagepastors7152) 🍏 Apple (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-backstage-pastors/id1860421534) 🎤 Spotify (https://open.spotify.com/show/4UjAzVaOsE0P2yCeukZODb?si=95933665830d4bea) CHAPTERS 02:00 Zach’s Journey from College Athletics to Ministry Operations 05:12 Sojourn, Multi-site Ministry, and the Executive Pastor Role 06:52 Moving from Executive Pastor to TGC 12:15 Inside The Gospel Coalition’s Ministry and Resources 15:00 AI, Theology, and the Church 21:28 What XPs Should Know Before Changing Roles 27:00 Unifying the Church and Equipping Pastors 30:12 Resources for Executive Pastors and Second-Chair Leaders 32:24 AI, “Slop Scanning,” and Closing Thoughts – – Editing and Support by The Good Podcast Co. Backstage Pastors™️ is a Registered Trademark
19 Aug 2026
What Warren Bird’s Latest Research Reveals About Large & Multi-Site Churches
Dr. Warren Bird joins Phil Taylor and Tyler Drebits to discuss decades of research into the trends shaping churches in America. Warren shares his journey from pastor and church planter to researcher and author, including the unexpected opportunities that led to a writing career spanning 35 books. The conversation focuses on Warren’s latest research into multisite churches and large churches. He shares findings about the continued growth of multisite, the increasing importance of small groups, post-pandemic attendance and spiritual vitality, and the challenges churches face around campus leadership, video teaching, succession, and organizational structure. Warren also takes listeners behind the scenes of large-scale church research, explaining how his team identifies churches, builds reliable databases, gathers responses, and works to communicate findings responsibly. Finally, Warren discusses his newest book, Becoming a Future-Ready Church, and the need for churches to prepare for future generations by adapting their methods without changing the gospel. He also shares areas he hopes to research next, including multisite leadership, family succession, and ministry residencies. Mentioned Resources 🗣️Follow Dr. Bird (https://www.linkedin.com/in/wbird) 💻 Dr. Warren Bird’s Website (https://warrenbird.com) 💻 Latest Research on Multi-Site Churches (https://www.research.net/r/WBShareSurvey) 💻 ECFA.org (http://ecfa.org) 📕Dr. Bird’s Latest Book - Becoming a Future-Ready Church (https://a.co/d/05wp7ei1) From Our Partners 💻 The Church Hub: The Church Hub serves pastors, ministry leaders, and their spouses through equipping and training resources. Learn more at https://thechurchhub.org (https://thechurchhub.org) Connect with Phil Taylor ✉️ Get Phil's Newsletter (https://backstagepastors.us13.list-manage.com/subscribe?u=d2e6c50a43a3219c368d5fe4e&id=e617b3a474) ✉️ phil@backstagepastors.org 🗣️ @philtaylorxp (https://www.instagram.com/philtaylorxp/) 📚 Books by Phil (https://www.amazon.com/stores/Phil-Taylor/author/B06VWSCCV6?ref=ap_rdr&shoppingPortalEnabled=true&ccs_id=8e6e4bb1-3a62-4ec3-a6eb-2d8c6bd776cc) 💻 backstagepastors.org (http://backstagepastors.org) 💻plainjoestudios.com (http://plainjoestudios.com) Connect with Tyler Drewitz ✉️ tyler@myxp.church 🗣️ @tylerdrewitz (https://www.instagram.com/tylerdrewitz/) 💻 myxp.church (https://www.myxp.church/) 💻ridgelineprinting.com (http://ridgelineprinting.com) The best way to support this podcast is to like, subscribe and share it with a friend. LIKE & SUBSCRIBE 📹 Youtube (https://www.youtube.com/@backstagepastors7152) 🍏 Apple (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-backstage-pastors/id1860421534) 🎤 Spotify (https://open.spotify.com/show/4UjAzVaOsE0P2yCeukZODb?si=95933665830d4bea) CHAPTERS 02:59 Warren’s Journey from Pastor to Researcher 05:42 The Latest Multisite Church Research 08:20 The Resurgence of Large Churches 12:49 Churches Get Bigger by Getting Smaller 17:00 Are Churches Moving Away from Multisite? 20:15 Live Teaching, Video Teaching, and Campus Leadership 26:15 Succession and the Future of Multisite Churches 32:43 Behind the Scenes of Church Research 41:04 Becoming a Future-Ready Church and What Warren Is Studying Next – – Editing and Support by The Good Podcast Co. Backstage Pastors™️ is a Registered Trademark
5 Aug 2026
Micro-church movements with Lucas Pulley
Most executive pastors spend their careers helping churches grow by building systems, hiring staff, and delegating responsibilities. But what happens when the goal isn't building a larger Sunday gathering at all? In this episode, Phil sits down with Lucas Pulley of the Underground Network to explore one of America's largest microchurch movements. Lucas shares his own ministry journey—from campus ministry in Illinois to leading decentralized networks of mission-focused microchurches—and explains how the Underground has developed systems that support hundreds of autonomous missionary leaders while preserving contextual freedom. The conversation explores what defines a church, why mission is essential alongside worship and community, how decentralized networks stay healthy without becoming overly institutionalized, and what executive pastors in traditional church settings can learn from movement thinking. Whether your church is 100 people or 10,000, this conversation offers valuable insights into leadership, delegation, coaching, governance, and creating structures that empower people for mission rather than simply managing programs. Mentioned Resources 🗣️Follow Drew (https://www.instagram.com/lucas_pulley) 🗣️Follow the Underground Network (https://www.instagram.com/undergroundnetwork) 💻Tampa Underground (https://tampaunderground.com) 💻 Underground Network (https://undergroundnetwork.org) 📕On the Verge (https://a.co/d/00BK4VqV) By Alan Hirsch & Dave Ferguson From Our Partners 💻 The Church Hub: The Church Hub serves pastors, ministry leaders, and their spouses through equipping and training resources. Learn more at https://thechurchhub.org (https://thechurchhub.org) Connect with Phil Taylor ✉️ Get Phil's Newsletter (https://backstagepastors.us13.list-manage.com/subscribe?u=d2e6c50a43a3219c368d5fe4e&id=e617b3a474) ✉️ phil@backstagepastors.org 🗣️ @philtaylorxp (https://www.instagram.com/philtaylorxp/) 📚 Books by Phil (https://www.amazon.com/stores/Phil-Taylor/author/B06VWSCCV6?ref=ap_rdr&shoppingPortalEnabled=true&ccs_id=8e6e4bb1-3a62-4ec3-a6eb-2d8c6bd776cc) 💻 backstagepastors.org (http://backstagepastors.org) 💻plainjoestudios.com (http://plainjoestudios.com) Connect with Tyler Drewitz ✉️ tyler@myxp.church 🗣️ @tylerdrewitz (https://www.instagram.com/tylerdrewitz/) 💻 myxp.church (https://www.myxp.church/) 💻ridgelineprinting.com (http://ridgelineprinting.com) The best way to support this podcast is to like, subscribe and share it with a friend. LIKE & SUBSCRIBE 📹 Youtube (https://www.youtube.com/@backstagepastors7152) 🍏 Apple (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-backstage-pastors/id1860421534) 🎤 Spotify (https://open.spotify.com/show/4UjAzVaOsE0P2yCeukZODb?si=95933665830d4bea) CHAPTERS 02:34 Lucas Pulley's ministry journey 10:48 What is the Underground Network? 16:16 Defining the microchurch model 20:20 Mission-specific vs. distributive microchurches 29:03 Building systems for decentralized leadership 37:32 Supporting networks across the country 41:35 Challenges of leading a decentralized movement 48:07 The place of microchurches within the broader Church 50:55 Final reflections and ministry resources – – Editing and Support by The Good Podcast Co. Backstage Pastors™️ is a Registered Trademark
15 Jul 2026
Drew Hyun on Emotional Health for Executive Pastors
Phil and Tyler sit down with Drew Hyun, Lead Pastor of Hope Church NYC and Executive Director of Emotionally Healthy Discipleship (EHD), to explore why emotional health is foundational for effective ministry leadership. Drew shares his ministry journey—from serving under Pete Scazzero at New Life Fellowship to planting Hope Church NYC and eventually stepping into leadership of Emotionally Healthy Discipleship. He reflects on how becoming a lead pastor revealed the importance of emotional health in ways he had never fully understood before. The conversation explores why executive pastors and highly driven leaders often struggle with emotional awareness, the relationship between emotional maturity and ministry effectiveness, and practical ways leaders can begin pursuing greater self-awareness. Drew also offers an inside look at the future of Emotionally Healthy Discipleship, including the School of Emotionally Healthy Leadership, a new Order of Emotionally Healthy Leaders, and Pete Scazzero's upcoming book on redefining success in ministry. This episode is a thoughtful invitation for church leaders to pursue both the Great Commandment and the Great Commission, recognizing that healthy ministry begins with healthy leaders. Mentioned Resources 🗣️Follow Drew (https://www.instagram.com/drewhyun) 🗣️Follow Emotionally Healthy Discipleship (https://www.instagram.com/ehdiscipleship) 💻Drew’s Website (https://www.drewhyun.com) 💻 Emotionally Healthy Discipleship Website (https://www.emotionallyhealthy.org) 📕Emotionally Healthy Discipleship Resources (https://www.emotionallyhealthy.org/shop/#other-products) ⛪️ Hope Church NYC (https://www.hopechurchnyc.org) From Our Partners 💻 The Church Hub: The Church Hub serves pastors, ministry leaders, and their spouses through equipping and training resources. Learn more at https://thechurchhub.org (https://thechurchhub.org) Connect with Phil Taylor ✉️ Get Phil's Newsletter (https://backstagepastors.us13.list-manage.com/subscribe?u=d2e6c50a43a3219c368d5fe4e&id=e617b3a474) ✉️ phil@backstagepastors.org 🗣️ @philtaylorxp (https://www.instagram.com/philtaylorxp/) 📚 Books by Phil (https://www.amazon.com/stores/Phil-Taylor/author/B06VWSCCV6?ref=ap_rdr&shoppingPortalEnabled=true&ccs_id=8e6e4bb1-3a62-4ec3-a6eb-2d8c6bd776cc) 💻 backstagepastors.org (http://backstagepastors.org) 💻plainjoestudios.com (http://plainjoestudios.com) Connect with Tyler Drewitz ✉️ tyler@myxp.church 🗣️ @tylerdrewitz (https://www.instagram.com/tylerdrewitz/) 💻 myxp.church (https://www.myxp.church/) 💻ridgelineprinting.com (http://ridgelineprinting.com) The best way to support this podcast is to like, subscribe and share it with a friend. LIKE & SUBSCRIBE 📹 Youtube (https://www.youtube.com/@backstagepastors7152) 🍏 Apple (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-backstage-pastors/id1860421534) 🎤 Spotify (https://open.spotify.com/show/4UjAzVaOsE0P2yCeukZODb?si=95933665830d4bea) CHAPTERS 02:54 Drew Hyun's ministry journey 09:12 Why emotionally healthy leadership matters 14:08 Growing in self-awareness as a leader 19:00 Practical first steps toward emotional health 23:50 Leading two organizations without burning out 35:09 The future of Emotionally Healthy Discipleship 42:00 Resources and next steps for church leaders 42:53 Wrap up – – Editing and Support by The Good Podcast Co. Backstage Pastors™️ is a Registered Trademark
1 Jul 2026
Rich Birch on Building Churches that Keep Growing
Rich Birch joins Phil and Tyler for a wide-ranging conversation about church growth, executive leadership, and helping churches remove barriers that prevent people from encountering Jesus. Drawing from decades of executive pastor experience and hundreds of conversations through the UnSeminary Podcast, Rich shares the mission behind his work and the insights he's gathered from one of the largest ongoing executive pastor surveys. The conversation explores what today's executive pastors are experiencing, including an encouraging sense of optimism alongside widespread staff exhaustion. Rich discusses why people—not finances or facilities—remain the greatest concern for executive pastors and offers practical ideas for improving staff health and leadership development. Rich also challenges a common assumption about church growth by arguing that many churches don't actually have a "back door" problem—they have a "front door" problem. He explains why churches should become obsessed with the guest experience, simplify every step of the first-time visitor journey, and intentionally build systems that help newcomers connect. Rich explains why personal invitations continue to be the single greatest driver of church growth and offers practical ways churches can equip and encourage their people to invite others consistently. Mentioned Resources 🗣️Follow Rich (https://www.instagram.com/richbirch) 🗣️Follow UnSeminenary (https://www.instagram.com/unseminary) 💻UnSeminenary Website (https://unseminary.com) 💻 Executive Pastor Direct Survey (http://xpsurvey.com/backstage) 📕Unlocking Your Church's Invite Culture (https://a.co/d/05UcZeYv) by Rich Birch 📕Church Growth Flywheel (https://a.co/d/09xlhF8Q) by Rich Birch ⛪️ Connexus Church (https://connexuschurch.com/) From Our Partners 💻 The Church Hub: The Church Hub serves pastors, ministry leaders, and their spouses through equipping and training resources. Learn more at https://thechurchhub.org (https://thechurchhub.org) Connect with Phil Taylor ✉️ Get Phil's Newsletter (https://backstagepastors.us13.list-manage.com/subscribe?u=d2e6c50a43a3219c368d5fe4e&id=e617b3a474) ✉️ phil@backstagepastors.org 🗣️ @philtaylorxp (https://www.instagram.com/philtaylorxp/) 📚 Books by Phil (https://www.amazon.com/stores/Phil-Taylor/author/B06VWSCCV6?ref=ap_rdr&shoppingPortalEnabled=true&ccs_id=8e6e4bb1-3a62-4ec3-a6eb-2d8c6bd776cc) 💻 backstagepastors.org (http://backstagepastors.org) 💻plainjoestudios.com (http://plainjoestudios.com) Connect with Tyler Drewitz ✉️ tyler@myxp.church 🗣️ @tylerdrewitz (https://www.instagram.com/tylerdrewitz/) 💻 myxp.church (https://www.myxp.church/) 💻ridgelineprinting.com (http://ridgelineprinting.com) The best way to support this podcast is to like, subscribe and share it with a friend. LIKE & SUBSCRIBE 📹 Youtube (https://www.youtube.com/@backstagepastors7152) 🍏 Apple (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-backstage-pastors/id1860421534) 🎤 Spotify (https://open.spotify.com/show/4UjAzVaOsE0P2yCeukZODb?si=95933665830d4bea) CHAPTERS 07:55 – Rich's Mission and the Story Behind UnSeminary 11:20 – Executive Pastor Survey: Hopeful but Tired 20:40 – Why People Are Every Executive Pastor's Biggest Challenge 27:20 – The Front Door Problem: Helping First-Time Guests Connect 39:30 – Seeing Church Through the Eyes of a First-Time Visitor 42:00 – Building an Invite Culture That Fuels Growth 50:25 – Encouragement for Executive Pastors – – Editing and Support by The Good Podcast Co. Backstage Pastors™️ is a Registered Trademark
17 Jun 2026
Dan Reiland on Four Decades of XP Ministry
Phil and Tyler sit down with longtime executive pastor, author, coach, and leadership mentor Dan Reiland. Dan reflects on his ministry journey, beginning as John Maxwell’s second intern and eventually becoming one of the pioneering executive pastors in the modern church movement. He shares stories from his years at Skyline Church, the Enjoy ministry, and his 25-year tenure at 12Stone Church. The conversation explores how the executive pastor role has evolved over the decades, the challenges and opportunities of church growth, and the importance of balancing organizational leadership with spiritual leadership. Dan offers a behind-the-scenes look at 12Stone’s decision to launch five campuses in a single Sunday, including lessons learned from rapid growth and the importance of strong systems. Dan also discusses the calling and partnership between senior pastors and executive pastors, recounting the remarkable story of how God led him and Kevin Myers into ministry together. The conversation turns to leadership development, mentoring, generational learning, and the growing challenge of helping leaders interpret culture in a rapidly changing world. Dan’s strongest leadership conviction after four decades in ministry is:prayer is not preparation for the work—it is the work. Mentioned Resources 🗣️Follow Dan (https://www.instagram.com/timastevens) 💻Dan’s Website (https://danreiland.com/) 📕Shoulder to Shoulder: Strengthening the Church by Supporting Your Pastor (https://a.co/d/0hRoOL76) by Dan Reiland 📕Amplified Leadership: Five Practices to Establish Influence, Build People, and Impact Others (https://a.co/d/04w4OwTo) by Dan Reiland ⛪️12Stone Church (https://12stone.com/) ⛪️ Skyline Church (https://www.skylinechurch.org/) From Our Partners 💻 The Church Hub: The Church Hub serves pastors, ministry leaders, and their spouses through equipping and training resources. Learn more at https://thechurchhub.org (https://thechurchhub.org) Connect with Phil Taylor ✉️ Get Phil's Newsletter (https://backstagepastors.us13.list-manage.com/subscribe?u=d2e6c50a43a3219c368d5fe4e&id=e617b3a474) ✉️ phil@backstagepastors.org 🗣️ @philtaylorxp (https://www.instagram.com/philtaylorxp/) 📚 Books by Phil (https://www.amazon.com/stores/Phil-Taylor/author/B06VWSCCV6?ref=ap_rdr&shoppingPortalEnabled=true&ccs_id=8e6e4bb1-3a62-4ec3-a6eb-2d8c6bd776cc) 💻 backstagepastors.org (http://backstagepastors.org) 💻plainjoestudios.com (http://plainjoestudios.com) Connect with Tyler Drewitz ✉️ tyler@myxp.church 🗣️ @tylerdrewitz (https://www.instagram.com/tylerdrewitz/) 💻 myxp.church (https://www.myxp.church/) 💻ridgelineprinting.com (http://ridgelineprinting.com) The best way to support this podcast is to like, subscribe and share it with a friend. LIKE & SUBSCRIBE 📹 Youtube (https://www.youtube.com/@backstagepastors7152) 🍏 Apple (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-backstage-pastors/id1860421534) 🎤 Spotify (https://open.spotify.com/show/4UjAzVaOsE0P2yCeukZODb?si=95933665830d4bea) CHAPTERS 03:50 – From John Maxwell’s Intern to Executive Pastor 08:26 – How the Executive Pastor Role Has Evolved 12:02 – Launching Five Campuses in One Sunday 19:00 – Supporting and Strengthening Senior Pastors 21:00 – God’s Calling to Partner with Kevin Myers 27:16 – Mentoring Leaders and Interpreting Culture 31:00 – Addressing Anxiety in Today’s Generation 32:05 – Prayer as the Foundation of Church Growth 35:03 – Developing One More Leader – – Editing and Support by The Good Podcast Co. Backstage Pastors™️ is a Registered Trademark
3 Jun 2026
The Accidental Executive Pastor with Becca Knudsen
In Episode 10 of Backstage Pastors™️, Phil and Tyler sit down with Becca Knudsen, Executive Pastor at Arvada Vineyard Church, to discuss her unique ministry journey, leading alongside a nationally influential lead pastor, and navigating major organizational transitions. Becca shares how an unexpected path—from Young Life leader to opera student to church administrator—ultimately led her into executive pastoral leadership. The conversation explores the realities of serving at a church whose lead pastor, Jay Pathak, also serves as the national director of Vineyard USA. Becca reflects on the spiritual, organizational, and personal challenges that accompanied that transition, including increased responsibility, leadership development, and organizational growing pains. She also provides an inside look at Arvada Vineyard’s decision to move away from a multi-site model and transition campuses into independent churches. Becca explains the discernment process, lessons learned, and why the church would still choose to plant churches in the future—while intentionally building toward eventual independence. Mentioned Resources ⛪️ Arvada Vineyard Church (https://arvadavineyard.org/) 💻 Learn more about the Vineyard movement (https://vineyardusa.org/) 📅 Check out the Vineyard Gatherings (https://vineyardusa.org/events/) 📅The Church Hub Cohorts (https://www.thechurchhub.org/) From Our Partners 💻 The Church Hub: The Church Hub serves pastors, ministry leaders, and their spouses through equipping and training resources. Learn more at https://thechurchhub.org (https://thechurchhub.org) Connect with Phil Taylor ✉️ Get Phil's Newsletter (https://backstagepastors.us13.list-manage.com/subscribe?u=d2e6c50a43a3219c368d5fe4e&id=e617b3a474) ✉️ phil@backstagepastors.org 🗣️ @philtaylorxp (https://www.instagram.com/philtaylorxp/) 📚 Books by Phil (https://www.amazon.com/stores/Phil-Taylor/author/B06VWSCCV6?ref=ap_rdr&shoppingPortalEnabled=true&ccs_id=8e6e4bb1-3a62-4ec3-a6eb-2d8c6bd776cc) 💻 backstagepastors.org (http://backstagepastors.org) 💻plainjoestudios.com (http://plainjoestudios.com) Connect with Tyler Drewitz ✉️ tyler@myxp.church 🗣️ @tylerdrewitz (https://www.instagram.com/tylerdrewitz/) 💻 myxp.church (https://www.myxp.church/) 💻ridgelineprinting.com (http://ridgelineprinting.com) The best way to support this podcast is to like, subscribe and share it with a friend. LIKE & SUBSCRIBE 📹 Youtube (https://www.youtube.com/@backstagepastors7152) 🍏 Apple (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-backstage-pastors/id1860421534) 🎤 Spotify (https://open.spotify.com/show/4UjAzVaOsE0P2yCeukZODb?si=95933665830d4bea) CHAPTERS 03:47 – Becca’s Unconventional Journey into Ministry Leadership 13:18 – Leading Alongside the National Director of Vineyard USA 20:16 – The Challenges of Organizational Change and Staff Transitions 22:45 – Why Arvada Vineyard Reconsidered the Multi-Site Model 27:00 – Discernment, Independence, and Church Planting Strategy 35:00 – How the Congregation Experienced the Transition 37:32 – Building a Staff Rule of Life 42:00 – Sabbath, Solitude, Friendship, and Sustainable Ministry 46:00 – Final Leadership Reflections and Closing Thoughts – – Editing and Support by The Good Podcast Co. Backstage Pastors™️ is a Registered Trademark
20 May 2026
Why Healthy Churches Need Better Systems with Tim Stevens
In this episode of Backstage Pastors™️ Podcast, Phil and Tyler welcome veteran executive pastor and leadership consultant Tim Stevens for an in-depth conversation on ministry leadership, organizational health, and sustainable service in the second chair. Tim reflects on nearly 40 years of ministry experience spanning nonprofit leadership, Granger Community Church, Vanderbloemen, Willow Creek, and now Leading Smart. The conversation explores the evolving role of the executive pastor, including the tension between being highly executive-minded versus deeply pastoral. Tim shares insights from his e-book 40 Lessons in 40 Years: Wisdom for the Long Haul, unpacking lessons about visionary leaders and integrators, why systems are actually pastoral tools, healthy governance, leadership burnout, and managing energy for long-term ministry health. Tim also gives listeners an inside look at stepping into Willow Creek during one of the church’s most difficult seasons and explains how focusing on “the next right thing” helped guide the rebuilding process. Guest Resources 🗣️Follow Tim (https://www.instagram.com/timastevens) 📕40 Lessons in 40 Years: Wisdom for the Long Haul (https://www.leadingsmart.com/lessons) 💻 Right Roles Assessment (https://www.leadingsmart.com/right-roles-assessment) 💻LeadingSmart.com (http://leadingsmart.com) 🎙️Tim’s Podcast (https://www.leadingsmart.com/podcast) 📅Leading Smart 2026 Gathering (https://www.leadingsmart.com/chicago26) From Our Partners 💻 The Church Hub: The Church Hub serves pastors, ministry leaders, and their spouses through equipping and training resources. Learn more at https://thechurchhub.org (https://thechurchhub.org) Connect with Phil Taylor ✉️ Get Phil's Newsletter (https://backstagepastors.us13.list-manage.com/subscribe?u=d2e6c50a43a3219c368d5fe4e&id=e617b3a474) ✉️ phil@backstagepastors.org 🗣️ @philtaylorxp (https://www.instagram.com/philtaylorxp/) 📚 Books by Phil (https://www.amazon.com/stores/Phil-Taylor/author/B06VWSCCV6?ref=ap_rdr&shoppingPortalEnabled=true&ccs_id=8e6e4bb1-3a62-4ec3-a6eb-2d8c6bd776cc) 💻 backstagepastors.org (http://backstagepastors.org) 💻plainjoestudios.com (http://plainjoestudios.com) Connect with Tyler Drewitz ✉️ tyler@myxp.church 🗣️ @tylerdrewitz (https://www.instagram.com/tylerdrewitz/) 💻 myxp.church (https://www.myxp.church/) 💻ridgelineprinting.com (http://ridgelineprinting.com) The best way to support this podcast is to like, subscribe and share it with a friend. LIKE & SUBSCRIBE 📹 Youtube (https://www.youtube.com/@backstagepastors7152) 🍏 Apple (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-backstage-pastors/id1860421534) 🎤 Spotify (https://open.spotify.com/show/4UjAzVaOsE0P2yCeukZODb?si=95933665830d4bea) CHAPTERS 04:05 Introducing Tim Stevens 07:18 Tim’s Ministry Journey and Leadership Background 10:18 Executive Pastor Wiring and Leadership Styles 13:42 40 Lessons in 40 Years 15:26 Why Visionary Leaders Need Integrators 18:01 Why Systems Are Pastoral 22:00 Sustainable Leadership and Managing Energy 26:06 Board Alignment and Healthy Governance 30:30 Leaving Church Ministry for Vanderbloemen and Leadership Consulting 34:10 Rebuilding Willow Creek Through Crisis 39:58 How Leading Smart Helps Churches Thrive – – Editing and Support by The Good Podcast Co. Backstage Pastors™️ is a Registered Trademark
6 May 2026
How To Be Second with Nathan Young and Dave Hartman
In this episode of the Backstage Pastors™️ Podcast, Phil Taylor and Tyler Drewitz welcome Nathan Young and Dave Hartman, co-authors of How to Be Second to discuss the identity, strengths, and challenges of second-chair leadership. The conversation explores why some leaders are uniquely wired for supporting roles, how executive pastors and operational leaders thrive, and why being second is not a stepping stone but a meaningful destination. Guest Resources 🗣️Follow David (https://www.linkedin.com/in/david-hartman-ph-d) 🗣️Follow Nathan (https://www.linkedin.com/in/nathan-s-young) 📕How to Be Second by Nathan Young and Dave Hartman (https://www.amazon.com/How-Second-Being-Destination-Stepping/dp/B0C9W2BZQL) 💻How to Be Second website: howtobesecond.com (http://howtobesecond.com) From Our Partners 💻 The Church Hub: The Church Hub serves pastors, ministry leaders, and their spouses through equipping and training resources. Learn more at https://thechurchhub.org (https://thechurchhub.org) Connect with Phil Taylor ✉️ Get Phil's Newsletter (https://backstagepastors.us13.list-manage.com/subscribe?u=d2e6c50a43a3219c368d5fe4e&id=e617b3a474) ✉️ phil@backstagepastors.org 🗣️ @philtaylorxp (https://www.instagram.com/philtaylorxp/) 📚 Books by Phil (https://www.amazon.com/stores/Phil-Taylor/author/B06VWSCCV6?ref=ap_rdr&shoppingPortalEnabled=true&ccs_id=8e6e4bb1-3a62-4ec3-a6eb-2d8c6bd776cc) 💻 backstagepastors.org (http://backstagepastors.org) 💻plainjoestudios.com (http://plainjoestudios.com) Connect with Tyler Drewitz ✉️ tyler@myxp.church 🗣️ @tylerdrewitz (https://www.instagram.com/tylerdrewitz/) 💻 myxp.church (https://www.myxp.church/) 💻ridgelineprinting.com (http://ridgelineprinting.com) The best way to support this podcast is to like, subscribe and share it with a friend. LIKE & SUBSCRIBE 📹 Youtube (https://www.youtube.com/@backstagepastors7152) 🍏 Apple (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-backstage-pastors/id1860421534) 🎤 Spotify (https://open.spotify.com/show/4UjAzVaOsE0P2yCeukZODb?si=95933665830d4bea) CHAPTERS 01:31 Phil’s Upcoming Church Projects and Travel 03:31 Introducing How to Be Second 06:00 Why Nathan and Dave Wrote the Book 10:00 Discovering the Identity of Second-Chair Leaders 17:17 The Difference Between “2s” and “2ICs” 24:23 Who the Book Is Really For 29:48 Imposter Syndrome and “Knowing What 10 Is” 33:07 What They Would Add to the Book Today 39:39 Final Encouragement and Resources – – Editing and Support by The Good Podcast Co. Backstage Pastors™️ is a Registered Trademark
15 Apr 2026
Clay Scroggins on How to Lead When You're Not in Charge
Phil Taylor interviews Clay Scroggins, former leader at North Point Community Church and author of How to Lead When You're Not in Charge. Clay shares his journey from engineering student to pastor, his experience serving in multi-site church leadership, and his transition into speaking and consulting. The conversation centers on leadership without authority—particularly relevant for executive pastors and second-chair leaders. Clay unpacks the myth that leadership requires a title and emphasizes influence as the true currency of leadership. He shares practical examples from both church and corporate environments, highlighting the importance of relational influence, emotional intelligence, and patience. They also discuss navigating organizational limitations, creating “pockets of greatness,” and leading oneself when broader change isn’t possible. Clay addresses the tension of ambition in ministry, distinguishing between selfish ambition and healthy, God-honoring drive. The episode also explores challenges like leading change in resistant environments, working under well-known leaders like Andy Stanley, and discerning when it’s time to stay or leave a role. The conversation is both practical and deeply reflective, offering encouragement and wisdom for leaders serving behind the scenes. Mentioned Event The XP Summit. Phil Taylor will be presenting at this year’s XP Summit. You can get your tickets at: xpsummit.org (http://xpsummit.org) Guest Resources 🗣️Follow Clay (https://www.instagram.com/clayscroggins) 📕How to Lead When You're Not in Charge (https://a.co/d/0fr4Cb2f) by Clay Scroggins 💻clayscroggins.com (http://clayscroggins.com) 💻“Should I Stay or Should I Go?” (https://clayscroggins.gumroad.com/l/stayorgo)(audio resource by Clay Scroggins) From Our Partners 💻 The Church Hub: The Church Hub serves pastors, ministry leaders, and their spouses through equipping and training resources. Learn more at https://thechurchhub.org (https://thechurchhub.org) Connect with Phil Taylor ✉️ Get Phil's Newsletter (https://backstagepastors.us13.list-manage.com/subscribe?u=d2e6c50a43a3219c368d5fe4e&id=e617b3a474) ✉️ phil@backstagepastors.org 🗣️ @philtaylorxp (https://www.instagram.com/philtaylorxp/) 📚 Books by Phil (https://www.amazon.com/stores/Phil-Taylor/author/B06VWSCCV6?ref=ap_rdr&shoppingPortalEnabled=true&ccs_id=8e6e4bb1-3a62-4ec3-a6eb-2d8c6bd776cc) 💻 backstagepastors.org (http://backstagepastors.org) 💻plainjoestudios.com (http://plainjoestudios.com) Connect with Tyler Drewitz ✉️ tyler@myxp.church 🗣️ @tylerdrewitz (https://www.instagram.com/tylerdrewitz/) 💻 myxp.church (https://www.myxp.church/) 💻ridgelineprinting.com (http://ridgelineprinting.com) The best way to support this podcast is to like, subscribe and share it with a friend. LIKE & SUBSCRIBE 📹 Youtube (https://www.youtube.com/@backstagepastors7152) 🍏 Apple (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-backstage-pastors/id1860421534) 🎤 Spotify (https://open.spotify.com/show/4UjAzVaOsE0P2yCeukZODb?si=95933665830d4bea) CHAPTERS [04:00] – Clay’s Ministry Journey [11:00] – The Myth of Leadership Titles [17:20] – Authority vs. Influence [25:18] – Creating a Pocket of Greatness [29:00] – When to Stay or Leave a Role [33:00] – Healthy vs. Unhealthy Ambition [39:00] – Leading Change Without Authority [43:00] – Working Under a High-Profile Leader [47:00] – Final Encouragement & Resources – – Editing and Support by The Good Podcast Co. Backstage Pastors™️ is a Registered Trademark
2 Apr 2026
Kadi Cole on the Women’s XP Group and Developing Female Leaders
In this episode, Kadi Cole joins the Backstage Pastors™️ to discuss her unexpected journey into ministry and her passion for developing female leaders in the church. She shares how her experience as often the only woman in leadership led to the creation of the Women Executive Pastor (WXP) Network, now supporting hundreds of women in executive roles. Kadi explains the importance of mentorship, coaching, and especially sponsorship—highlighting how women are often overlooked in leadership development due to systemic habits rather than theology. She challenges male leaders to rethink how they view and support female leaders, emphasizing equal access to development resources and opportunities. The conversation also explores the unique challenges women face in leadership, including isolation, lack of role models, and navigating expectations. Kadi encourages churches to intentionally create pathways for women to grow and remain in ministry long-term. Resources Mentioned 🗣️Follow Kadi (https://www.instagram.com/kadicole) 📕Developing Female Leaders (https://a.co/d/04rZ0KZa) by Kadi Cole 💻wxpastors.com (http://wxpastors.com) (Women Executive Pastor Network) 💻https://kadicole.com (https://kadicole.com) 💻https://femalechurchleaders.com (https://femalechurchleaders.com) 🎙️Female Church Leaders Podcast (https://thefemalechurchleaderspodcast.buzzsprout.com) From Our Partners 💻 The Church Hub: The Church Hub serves pastors, ministry leaders, and their spouses through equipping and training resources. Learn more at https://thechurchhub.org (https://thechurchhub.org) Connect with Phil Taylor ✉️ Get Phil's Newsletter (https://backstagepastors.us13.list-manage.com/subscribe?u=d2e6c50a43a3219c368d5fe4e&id=e617b3a474) ✉️ phil@backstagepastors.org 🗣️ @philtaylorxp (https://www.instagram.com/philtaylorxp/) 📚 Books by Phil (https://www.amazon.com/stores/Phil-Taylor/author/B06VWSCCV6?ref=ap_rdr&shoppingPortalEnabled=true&ccs_id=8e6e4bb1-3a62-4ec3-a6eb-2d8c6bd776cc) 💻 backstagepastors.org (http://backstagepastors.org) 💻plainjoestudios.com (http://plainjoestudios.com) Connect with Tyler Drewitz ✉️ tyler@myxp.church 🗣️ @tylerdrewitz (https://www.instagram.com/tylerdrewitz/) 💻 myxp.church (https://www.myxp.church/) 💻ridgelineprinting.com (http://ridgelineprinting.com) The best way to support this podcast is to like, subscribe and share it with a friend. LIKE & SUBSCRIBE 📹 Youtube (https://www.youtube.com/@backstagepastors7152) 🍏 Apple (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-backstage-pastors/id1860421534) 🎤 Spotify (https://open.spotify.com/show/4UjAzVaOsE0P2yCeukZODb?si=95933665830d4bea) CHAPTERS [00:45] Introducing Kadi Cole[02:00] An Unlikely Ministry Journey[04:00] Birth of Women Executive Pastors Network[06:00] The Power of Female Community[09:20] Why Women Need Dedicated Spaces[12:40] Supporting Women in Leadership Growth[17:00] Mentorship, Coaching & Sponsorship[24:00] What Male Leaders Often Miss[31:20] Encouragement to Stay in the Calling – – Editing and Support by The Good Podcast Co. (thegoodpodcast.co)
18 Mar 2026
David Fletcher on Pastoral Compensation
In this episode of Backstage Pastors™️ Phil and Tyler sit down with David Fletcher, founder of XPastor.org, one of the most comprehensive resource hubs for executive pastors. David shares the origin story of his work, which began out of a lack of available research and has grown into a platform with thousands of resources and hundreds of thousands of annual users. The conversation explores practical tools available to executive pastors, including free courses, weekly webinars, and a robust salary database built from billions of dollars of church compensation data. David explains how churches can leverage this data for better, more objective compensation decisions and discusses the value of independent compensation studies. David is a wealth of knowledge gleaned from years of serving executive pastors — and from being one. Resources Mentioned 💻 XPastor.org (XPastor.org) (https://theunstuckgroup.com/landing-page/church-building-projects-masterclass/)💲Salary Forecaster (https://www.xpastor.org/courses/church-compensation/) From Our Partners 💻 The Church Hub: The Church Hub serves pastors, ministry leaders, and their spouses through equipping and training resources. Learn more at https://thechurchhub.org (https://thechurchhub.org) Connect with Phil Taylor ✉️ Get Phil's Newsletter (https://backstagepastors.us13.list-manage.com/subscribe?u=d2e6c50a43a3219c368d5fe4e&id=e617b3a474) ✉️ phil@backstagepastors.org 🗣️ @philtaylorxp (https://www.instagram.com/philtaylorxp/) 📚 Books by Phil (https://www.amazon.com/stores/Phil-Taylor/author/B06VWSCCV6?ref=ap_rdr&shoppingPortalEnabled=true&ccs_id=8e6e4bb1-3a62-4ec3-a6eb-2d8c6bd776cc) 💻 backstagepastors.org™️ (http://backstagepastors.org) 💻plainjoestudios.com (http://plainjoestudios.com) Connect with Tyler Drewitz ✉️ tyler@myxp.church 🗣️ @tylerdrewitz (https://www.instagram.com/tylerdrewitz/) 💻 myxp.church (https://www.myxp.church/) 💻ridgelineprinting.com (http://ridgelineprinting.com) The best way to support this podcast is to like, subscribe and share it with a friend. LIKE & SUBSCRIBE 📹 Youtube (https://www.youtube.com/@backstagepastors7152) 🍏 Apple (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-backstage-pastors/id1860421534) 🎤 Spotify (https://open.spotify.com/show/4UjAzVaOsE0P2yCeukZODb?si=95933665830d4bea) CHAPTERS 01:34 Introducing David Fletcher & XPastor.org 07:29 The Origin Story of XPastor 10:00 Free Resources for Executive Pastors 12:00 Courses, Webinars & Getting Started 14:11 Compensation Data & Salary Forecaster17:00 Why Churches Need Compensation Studies 23:41 Benefits, Trends & Staffing Insights 27:39 The Retirement Crisis for Pastors 29:13 Innovation, AI & Leadership Mindset – – Editing and Support by The Good Podcast Co. (thegoodpodcast.co)
4 Mar 2026
XP Leadership in Unchurched Regions w/ Jeremy Peterson
In this episode of the Backstage Pastors Podcast™️ Phil and Tyler interview Jeremy Peterson, Executive Pastor at One Church in New Hampshire and a leader involved with the XP Summit. Jeremy shares his ministry journey from student ministry in Texas to leadership roles in multi-site churches and eventually serving in New England—one of the most unchurched regions in the United States. He explains the unique leadership and staffing challenges of ministry in that environment and how his church has responded by developing local leaders. Jeremy discusses the creation of a residency program at One Church to raise up leaders internally, emphasizing hands-on ministry training and leadership development. He also explains the purpose and structure of the XP Summit, a gathering designed specifically for executive pastors to connect, learn, and support each other in ministry leadership. Resources Mentioned 🗣️ XP Summit (https://xpsummit.org/) ⛪️ One Church (church.one) Unstuck Event: Church Building Masterclass (https://theunstuckgroup.com/landing-page/church-building-projects-masterclass/) with Phil Taylor From Our Partners 💻 The Church Hub: The Church Hub serves pastors, ministry leaders, and their spouses through equipping and training resources. Learn more at https://thechurchhub.org (https://thechurchhub.org) Connect with Phil Taylor ✉️ Get Phil's Newsletter (https://backstagepastors.us13.list-manage.com/subscribe?u=d2e6c50a43a3219c368d5fe4e&id=e617b3a474) ✉️ phil@backstagepastors.org 🗣️ @philtaylorxp (https://www.instagram.com/philtaylorxp/) 📚 Books by Phil (https://www.amazon.com/stores/Phil-Taylor/author/B06VWSCCV6?ref=ap_rdr&shoppingPortalEnabled=true&ccs_id=8e6e4bb1-3a62-4ec3-a6eb-2d8c6bd776cc) 💻 backstagepastors.org™️ (http://backstagepastors.org) 💻plainjoestudios.com (http://plainjoestudios.com) Connect with Tyler Drewitz ✉️ tyler@myxp.church 🗣️ @tylerdrewitz (https://www.instagram.com/tylerdrewitz/) 💻 myxp.church (https://www.myxp.church/) 💻ridgelineprinting.com (http://ridgelineprinting.com) The best way to support this podcast is to like, subscribe and share it with a friend. LIKE & SUBSCRIBE 📹 Youtube (https://www.youtube.com/@backstagepastors7152) 🍏 Apple (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-backstage-pastors/id1860421534) 🎤 Spotify (https://open.spotify.com/show/4UjAzVaOsE0P2yCeukZODb?si=95933665830d4bea) CHAPTERS 03:00 Why the podcast originally paused five years ago 07:00 Podcast swag and upcoming conferences 09:30 Introducing guest Jeremy Peterson10:00 Jeremy’s ministry journey from Texas to New England 13:00 Ministry challenges in unchurched regions 19:00 Building a residency program for leadership development 25:00 The story and purpose of the XP Summit 34:00 Final reflections and upcoming guests – – Editing and Support by The Good Podcast Co. (thegoodpodcast.co)
18 Feb 2026
Kyle Nabors on Cultivating a Well-Watered Garden vs. Well-Oiled Machine
In this episode, Phil and Tyler sit down with Kyle Nabors, a seasoned executive leader who has served in both large churches and global nonprofits. Kyle shares insights from decades of experience, including time at Kensington Church (a 10,000+ attendee church) and Mercy Ships, and reflects on leadership, culture, trust, and the nuanced role of the executive pastor. One of the central themes is Kyle’s well-known metaphor: the church as a well-watered garden versus a well-oiled machine. While certain systems require precision and predictability (finances, child safety, compliance), much of ministry leadership requires organic flexibility, attentiveness, and faith. Structure must serve mission—not the other way around. Throughout the conversation, you’ll be reminded that effective executive leadership isn’t about control—it’s about calibration. It’s about knowing the “blood type” of the organization, understanding the personality of the lead pastor, and helping clarify direction while cultivating culture. Resources Mentioned 🗣️ Follow Kyle (https://www.linkedin.com/in/kyle-nabors-signature/) ⛪️ Ward Church (https://ward.church/team/) Unstuck Event: Church Building Masterclass (https://theunstuckgroup.com/landing-page/church-building-projects-masterclass/) with Phil Taylor From Our Partners 💻 The Church Hub: The Church Hub serves pastors, ministry leaders, and their spouses through equipping and training resources. Learn more at https://thechurchhub.org (https://thechurchhub.org) Connect with Phil Taylor ✉️ Get Phil's Newsletter (https://backstagepastors.us13.list-manage.com/subscribe?u=d2e6c50a43a3219c368d5fe4e&id=e617b3a474) ✉️ phil@backstagepastors.org 🗣️ @philtaylorxp (https://www.instagram.com/philtaylorxp/) 📚 Books by Phil (https://www.amazon.com/stores/Phil-Taylor/author/B06VWSCCV6?ref=ap_rdr&shoppingPortalEnabled=true&ccs_id=8e6e4bb1-3a62-4ec3-a6eb-2d8c6bd776cc) 💻 backstagepastors.org™️ (http://backstagepastors.org) 💻plainjoestudios.com (http://plainjoestudios.com) Connect with Tyler Drewitz ✉️ tyler@myxp.church 🗣️ @tylerdrewitz (https://www.instagram.com/tylerdrewitz/) 💻 myxp.church (https://www.myxp.church/) 💻ridgelineprinting.com (http://ridgelineprinting.com) The best way to support this podcast is to like, subscribe and share it with a friend. LIKE & SUBSCRIBE 📹 Youtube (https://www.youtube.com/@backstagepastors7152) 🍏 Apple (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-backstage-pastors/id1860421534) 🎤 Spotify (https://open.spotify.com/show/4UjAzVaOsE0P2yCeukZODb?si=95933665830d4bea) CHAPTERS 00:00 – Introduction to Kyle Nabors 04:00 – Kyle’s Leadership Journey: Military, Business, Nonprofit & Church 09:00 – The Lunch That Sparked a Book 11:53 – Structure Must Serve the Mission 15:00 – Trust: The Currency of the Executive Pastor 21:19 – Backstage Leadership at Kensington Church 25:00 – Diagnosing Before Prescribing 31:54 – Thriving, Authenticity & Spiritual Health 36:00 – Navigating Church vs. Nonprofit Culture 43:48 – Return on Investment, Direction & Stewardship – – Editing and Support by The Good Podcast Co. (thegoodpodcast.co)
4 Feb 2026
Why Lead Pastors and Executive Pastors Need Each Other w/ Ed Marcelle
In this episode of The Backstage Pastors Podcast™️, Phil and Tyler sit down with longtime friend and ministry partner Ed Marcelle to explore the dynamics of the Lead Pastor (LP) and Executive Pastor (XP) relationship. Drawing from their shared history planting Terra Nova Church in upstate New York, the conversation traces Ed’s journey from solo church planter to national church planting leader. Along the way, they unpack lessons on burnout, vision, organizational leadership, team-based ministry, and the importance of mutual submission between LPs and XPs. The episode also highlights Ed’s transition into his current role serving church planters across the country and reflects on what it means to steward God’s investment in leaders for long-term, generational impact. Note: This interview was recorded a few years ago, but we decided we liked it so much, we just had to keep it. Resources Mentioned 🗣️Follow Ed (https://www.instagram.com/emarcelle) 💻Harbor Church Planting Network (https://www.harbornetwork.com) Unstuck Event: Church Building Masterclass (https://theunstuckgroup.com/landing-page/church-building-projects-masterclass/) with Phil Taylor From Our Partners 💻 The Church Hub: The Church Hub serves pastors, ministry leaders, and their spouses through equipping and training resources. Learn more at https://thechurchhub.org (https://thechurchhub.org) Connect with Phil Taylor ✉️ Get Phil's Newsletter (https://backstagepastors.us13.list-manage.com/subscribe?u=d2e6c50a43a3219c368d5fe4e&id=e617b3a474) ✉️ phil@backstagepastors.org 🗣️ @philtaylorxp (https://www.instagram.com/philtaylorxp/) 📚 Books by Phil (https://www.amazon.com/stores/Phil-Taylor/author/B06VWSCCV6?ref=ap_rdr&shoppingPortalEnabled=true&ccs_id=8e6e4bb1-3a62-4ec3-a6eb-2d8c6bd776cc) 💻 backstagepastors.org (http://backstagepastors.org) 💻plainjoestudios.com (http://plainjoestudios.com) Connect with Tyler Drewitz ✉️ tyler@myxp.church 🗣️ @tylerdrewitz (https://www.instagram.com/tylerdrewitz/) 💻 myxp.church (https://www.myxp.church/) 💻ridgelineprinting.com (http://ridgelineprinting.com) The best way to support this podcast is to like, subscribe and share it with a friend. LIKE & SUBSCRIBE 📹 Youtube (https://www.youtube.com/@backstagepastors7152) 🍏 Apple (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-backstage-pastors/id1860421534) 🎤 Spotify (https://open.spotify.com/show/4UjAzVaOsE0P2yCeukZODb?si=95933665830d4bea) CHAPTERS 02:00 – Ed’s first church plant and lessons from solo pastoring 07:00 – Discovering the power of LP and XP partnership 12:00 – Vision, risk, and planting Terra Nova Church 22:40 – Impact on church planting in the Northeast 26:00 – Steps 1, 2, and 100: visionaries and implementers 29:33 – Behind the scenes of a healthy LP/XP relationship 34:22 – Ed’s transition to Harbor Network 40:14 – Influencing leaders and long-term ministry impact 43:01 – Advice for Lead Pastors and Executive Pastors – – Editing and Support by The Good Podcast Co.
21 Jan 2026
Leading from the Second Chair: A Conversation with Mike Bonem
In this episode of the Backstage Pastors Podcast™️, hosts Phil and Tyler kick off the series by welcoming longtime executive pastor, author, and consultant Mike Bonem. The conversation centers on the origins and evolution of the executive pastor (XP) and second-chair leader role, drawing heavily from Mike’s seminal book Leading from the Second Chair and his more recent work Thriving in the Second Chair. Mike shares the story behind writing one of the first books focused on second-chair leadership, reflects on how the XP role has changed over the past two decades, and offers practical wisdom for sustaining long-term effectiveness in backstage ministry. The discussion also explores challenges around change management in churches, delegation, metrics, and how second-chair leaders can find encouragement and visible impact even when their work often happens behind the scenes. Resources Mentioned Unstuck Event: Church Building Masterclass (https://theunstuckgroup.com/landing-page/church-building-projects-masterclass/) with Phil Taylor Leading from the Second Chair (https://a.co/d/1RIt5ey) by Mike Bonem Thriving in the Second Chair (https://a.co/d/4iePgVd) by Mike Bonem Leading Congregational Change (https://a.co/d/7Dmza03) by Mike Bonem In Pursuit of Great and Godly Leadership (https://a.co/d/8x6onLy) by Mike Bonem From Our Partners 💻 The Church Hub serves pastors, ministry leaders, and their spouses through equipping and training resources. Learn more at Thechurchhub.org (https://www.thechurchhub.org/) Connect with Phil Taylor ✉️ Get Phil's Newsletter (https://backstagepastors.us13.list-manage.com/subscribe?u=d2e6c50a43a3219c368d5fe4e&id=e617b3a474) ✉️ phil@backstagepastors.org 🗣️ @philtaylorxp (https://www.instagram.com/philtaylorxp/) 📚 Books by Phil (https://www.amazon.com/stores/Phil-Taylor/author/B06VWSCCV6?ref=ap_rdr&shoppingPortalEnabled=true&ccs_id=8e6e4bb1-3a62-4ec3-a6eb-2d8c6bd776cc) 💻 backstagepastors.org (http://backstagepastors.org) 💻plainjoestudios.com (http://plainjoestudios.com) Connect with Tyler Drewitz ✉️ tyler@myxp.church 🗣️ @tylerdrewitz (https://www.instagram.com/tylerdrewitz/) 💻 myxp.church (https://www.myxp.church/) 💻ridgelineprinting.com (http://ridgelineprinting.com) LIKE & SUBSCRIBE 📹 Youtube (https://www.youtube.com/@backstagepastors7152) 🍏 Apple (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-backstage-pastors/id1860421534) 🎤 Spotify (https://open.spotify.com/show/4UjAzVaOsE0P2yCeukZODb?si=95933665830d4bea) CHAPTERS 01:40 – Series Overview and Defining the Executive Pastor Role 03:17 – Announcement: Church Building Projects Masterclass 06:24 – Introducing Mike Bonem 08:38 – The Story Behind Leading from the Second Chair 12:38 – Why Thriving in the Second Chair Was Written 14:04 – Extending Your Shelf Life in Ministry 17:00 – Finding Encouragement in Backstage Ministry 24:50 – Why Change Is So Hard in Churches 33:09 – Preparing for the Executive Pastor Role – – Editing and Support by The Good Podcast Co. (thegoodpodcast.co)
10 Dec 2025
Why Backstage Pastors?
In this preview episode, hosts Phil Taylor and Tyler Drewitz introduce the Backstage Pastors™️ Podcast, a show created specifically for executive pastors and second-chair leaders in churches and nonprofits. They unpack why a niche podcast like this is needed, explain the “backstage pastors” concept, share their ministry journeys, and outline what listeners can expect when the show officially launches on January 21, 2026. Phil and Tyler talk about their heart for under-the-radar leaders who bring vision into reality, their desire to platform both well-known and lesser-known practitioners, and their hope that the podcast will be a high-ROI investment for the Kingdom by resourcing those who rarely get the spotlight but carry enormous responsibility. From Our Partners 💻 The Church Hub (thechurchhub.org ) Connect with Phil Taylor ✉️ Get Phil's Newsletter (https://backstagepastors.us13.list-manage.com/subscribe?u=d2e6c50a43a3219c368d5fe4e&id=e617b3a474) ✉️ phil@backstagepastors.org (mailto:phil@backstagepastors.org) 🗣️ @philtaylorxp (https://www.instagram.com/philtaylorxp/) 📚 Books by Phil (https://www.amazon.com/stores/Phil-Taylor/author/B06VWSCCV6?ref=ap_rdr&shoppingPortalEnabled=true&ccs_id=8e6e4bb1-3a62-4ec3-a6eb-2d8c6bd776cc) 💻 backstagepastors.org (http://backstagepastors.org) 💻plainjoestudios.com (http://plainjoestudios.com) Connect with Tyler Drewitz ✉️ tyler@myxp.church (mailto: tyler@myxp.church) 🗣️ @tylerdrewitz (https://www.instagram.com/tylerdrewitz/) 💻 myxp.church (https://www.myxp.church/) 💻ridgelineprinting.com (ridgelineprinting.com) LIKE & SUBSCRIBE 📹 Youtube (https://www.youtube.com/@backstagepastors7152) 🍏 Apple (https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-backstage-pastors/id1860421534) 🎤 Spotify (https://open.spotify.com/show/4UjAzVaOsE0P2yCeukZODb?si=95933665830d4bea) Chapters 00:00:00 – Welcome to the Backstage Pastors Podcast 00:00:45 – Why Another Leadership Podcast? 00:02:28 – The Executive Pastor Niche and Phil’s Book Journey 00:04:29 – Meet Co-Host Tyler: Roles, Churches, and Businesses 00:05:59 – Meet Host Phil Taylor: Coaching, Cohorts, and Plain Joe Studios 00:09:39 – The “Backstage Pastors” Idea and Story Behind the Name 00:12:44 – Why This Podcast Matters for Second-Chair Leaders 00:19:04 – Launch Date, Release Schedule, and First Guest Preview – – Editing and Support by The Good Podcast Co. (thegoodpodcast.co)
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