In GTM Engineer School Pod, Jared and Matteo interview seasoned GTM Engineering operators to identify first principles, best practices, tooling, and challenges of building AI-driven workflows. <br/><br/><a href="https://gtmengineerschool.substack.com?utm_medium=podcast">gtmengineerschool.substack.com</a>
GTM Engineer School Podcast
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17 episodes
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Podcast Overview
In GTM Engineer School Pod, Jared and Matteo interview seasoned GTM Engineering operators to identify first principles, best practices, tooling, and challenges of building AI-driven workflows. <br/><br/><a href="https://gtmengineerschool.substack.com?utm_medium=podcast">gtmengineerschool.substack.com</a>
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6/9/2025
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Recent Episodes
June 3, 2026
S2E7: "Be the Olympist of Your Field" | Guillaume Cabane
<p>Listen now | The founder of HyperGrowth Partners unpacks why hybrid GTM teams beat full automation, why true AI adoption stays under 1%, and why the next decade belongs to the Olympist of every field.</p><p></p><p><strong>About our guest — Guillaume Cabane</strong></p><p>Guillaume “G” Cabane is the founder and general partner of HyperGrowth Partners, where he and his team work hands-on with companies like Ramp, Neon, Zapier, AirOps, n8n, and Attention. He’s the recognized godfather of GTM engineering — pioneering the Clearbit reveal loop, personalized outbound, and the experimentation-as-system playbook before any of it was standard practice. Before HyperGrowth, G was VP Growth at Drift, Segment, and Gorgias, helping each one scale through multiple step-changes in revenue, and most recently served as interim CMO at Ramp through their run from $10M to over $1B in ARR.</p><p></p><p><strong>Core Takeaways</strong></p><p>* <strong>Hybrid GTM Beats Full Automation</strong>: G has yet to see a single scale-up successfully operate without a GTM team. He tested full automation against a hybrid setup (humans + AI) at Ramp himself, and failed to beat the hybrid baseline. Other people brought him their prompts and also failed. The AI-replaces-your-SDR-team posts are hype; SDR and BDR teams are still in active hiring across his entire portfolio.</p><p>* <strong>True AI Adoption Stays Under 1%</strong>: Most marketing teams have not done any meaningful AI work beyond a GPT prompt or two. When G builds something for them and shows the output, they’re happy with the output but don’t want to learn how to build it themselves. The technologists who actually compound value with AI are a tiny fraction — G estimates less than 1% of the population — and the gap between them and everyone else is going to widen every quarter.</p><p>* <strong>SaaS-for-SaaS Is the Risky Bet — Tech-for-Non-Tech Stays Safe</strong>: Build versus buy is shifting back to build. Niche subscriptions are getting harder to justify when you can vibe-code the same thing in an hour. SaaS sold to other software companies is the riskiest position — either LLMs start buying for them or enterprises start building in-house. Selling technology to non-tech companies (Ramp is the canonical example) stays safe; those buyers won’t suddenly start coding.</p><p>* <strong>Be the Olympist of Your Field</strong>: There won’t be hundreds of millions of Python developers in the future. There will be a few thousand master-level specialists who can beat the best LLM in their narrow domain. The path for younger talent is to pick a niche, dedicate ten years from age 15 to 25, and become the world-class expert. Most Olympians are out of college by 25. Why would tech be different.</p><p></p><p><strong>Top Quotes</strong></p><p>“I tried beating that hybrid setup with a full auto and I failed. And other people have come to me and gee, there must be a way to, we can improve the prompts. And they have failed.”</p><p>“True AI adoption, in the sense that you guys in this audience thinks about it, is going to be limited to a very small percentage of the population. I wouldn’t be surprised if it’s less than 1%.”</p><p>“I think SaaS for SaaS is extremely risky because either like LLMs are going to buy from that land or because large enterprise and mid markets are going to stop buying and like just start building.”</p><p>“You’ve got to be the Olympist of your field. That is how you survive. That is how you win.”</p><p>Referenced Tools and Resources</p><p>* <strong>AI & Building</strong>: Claude Code (referenced throughout as “Open Claude” and “Cloud Code”), GPT</p><p>* <strong>Workflow Automation</strong>: Zapier, n8n</p><p>* <strong>Content Production</strong>: AirOps</p><p>* <strong>Data Infrastructure</strong>: Salesforce (via MCP), vector databases</p><p>* <strong>Case Studies</strong>: Ramp (tech-for-non-tech archetype), Manifest (legal AI), Netic (applied AI in real-world spaces)</p><p></p><p><strong>Timestamps</strong></p><p>* <strong>(00:00)</strong> Cold open and intros</p><p>* <strong>(04:05)</strong> What G’s three-and-a-half years at Ramp changed about GTM engineering</p><p>* <strong>(06:45)</strong> What has and hasn’t changed about the growth team in 2026</p><p>* <strong>(08:30)</strong> The AI-replaced-our-GTM-team posts are hype</p><p>* <strong>(10:30)</strong> Hybrid wins, full automation loses — and G tested it himself</p><p>* <strong>(11:35)</strong> Is the GTM Engineer role being diluted, or is it the same person with a new title</p><p>* <strong>(14:30)</strong> Why true AI adoption stays under 1% of the population</p><p>* <strong>(17:45)</strong> The two societies splitting around AI and how fast the gap is widening</p><p>* <strong>(20:40)</strong> When everyone’s bot acts in their name, response rates collapse across every channel</p><p>* <strong>(24:30)</strong> The effective craziness framework — tech love plus rigor plus creativity plus psychology</p><p>* <strong>(28:10)</strong> What happens when LLMs start buying from LLMs</p><p>* <strong>(31:50)</strong> Have you given Claude Code your credit card yet</p><p>* <strong>(35:30)</strong> Are skills the new IP — and where defensibility goes</p><p>* <strong>(40:00)</strong> Build versus buy is shifting back to build</p><p>* <strong>(43:35)</strong> Why specialist agents still need specialists</p><p>* <strong>(46:30)</strong> 2026 is the year you either build or step off the progress train</p><p>* <strong>(50:30)</strong> SaaS for SaaS is the risky bet; tech for non-tech stays safe</p><p>* <strong>(52:55)</strong> Trust the model output instead of needing to know everything</p><p>* <strong>(54:30)</strong> Be the Olympist of your field</p><p>* <strong>(56:50)</strong> What G would tell college graduates today</p><p></p><p><strong>Where to Find Guillaume</strong></p><p>* <a target="_blank" href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/cabane/">LinkedIn</a></p><p>* <a target="_blank" href="https://www.hypergrowthpartners.com/">HyperGrowth Partners</a></p><p></p><p><strong>Where to Connect with Jared & Matteo</strong></p><p>* <strong>Jared Waxman</strong>, GTM Engineer School Co-founder: <a target="_blank" href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/jwaxman/">LinkedIn</a></p><p>* <strong>Matteo Tittarelli</strong>, GTM Engineer School Co-founder: <a target="_blank" href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/matteo-titta/">LinkedIn</a>, <a target="_blank" href="https://x.com/matteo_titta">X</a>, <a target="_blank" href="https://genesysgrowth.com/">Website</a>, <a target="_blank" href="https://newsletter.genesysgrowth.com/">Newsletter</a></p> <br/><br/>This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit <a href="https://gtmengineerschool.substack.com?utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=CTA_1">gtmengineerschool.substack.com</a>
May 19, 2026
S2E6: "Your List Is the Strategy" | Benjamin Douablin
<p>Listen now | The CEO of FullEnrich unpacks why one data vendor is never enough, how cold calling still wins when the list is right, and why audience-first beats GTM-engineering-first.</p><p>Brought to you by</p><p><strong>This could be your logo</strong>!</p><p>Reach out to <a target="_blank" href="https://cal.com/jaredwax">Jared</a> to sponsor the next episode of this podcast and reach 5000+ modern GTM operator and founders.</p><p>About our guest — Benjamin Douablin</p><p>Benjamin Douablin is the CEO and co-founder of FullEnrich, the waterfall enrichment platform serving 3,000+ customers across the US, Europe, APAC, MENA and Latam. FullEnrich aggregates 20+ data vendors and queries them sequentially until you get the email or mobile number you actually need — then plugs into the CRM, data warehouse, automation tool, or MCP server you already run. Ben came up through pure sales tech with stints at Sales Ramp and Jellyfish before building an internal data-aggregation tool that became FullEnrich two and a half years ago.</p><p>Core Takeaways</p><p>* <strong>One Data Provider Is Never Enough</strong>: A generalist returns roughly a 30% enrichment rate against most addressable markets. Coverage breaks down by region, by vertical, and by segment. The winning shape is a managed orchestration layer that picks the right provider per query in real time, not a stack of disconnected vendors that operators have to manually benchmark.</p><p>* <strong>Your List Is The Strategy</strong>: FullEnrich’s first 40 customers came through cold calls Ben placed himself. The unlock wasn’t the script. It was the prep — convincing yourself the call is a blessing for the prospect before you dial. If there’s no real issue to solve, don’t book the meeting. Open with a “because” that names a problem peers in their industry face, never their own performance, and let them choose the one that resonates.</p><p>* <strong>Audience-First Beats GTM-Engineering-First</strong>: The discipline is a means; the audience is the end. FullEnrich serves three distinct audiences (GTM teams, lead-gen and talent agencies, product builders embedding the API). Each one has different acquisition motion, product needs, contract structure. Build squads around the audience, not the tooling — and let GTM-engineering capacity serve the squads where it actually moves the metric.</p><p>* <strong>Stop Building 25-Slide Decks</strong>: The bar to execute has dropped; the bar to convince has stayed high. That asymmetry is the lever. If you’re a VP with an idea, hire someone to ship the zero-to-one in days, demo the result, then politick. Pitching internally before you’ve proven anything is the slow path that closes your learning window.</p><p></p><p><p>Enjoying this episode so far? Subscribe for free to new posts.</p></p><p></p><p>Top Quotes</p><p>“I don’t know anyone that is really happy with their data providers, even if they multiply them.”</p><p>“If you don’t know who you want to talk to, just don’t even think about it, don’t start, because you will get rejected, it will be hard.”</p><p>“I never start with the tools or with the skills. I always start from my audience or end users.”</p><p>“Having people that know how great look like is very important because the danger of AI is just very well articulated MBA type of intern that know how to write down very articulated way. But when you go into details, you need to be picky.”</p><p>Referenced Tools and Resources</p><p>* <strong>Data and enrichment</strong>: <a target="_blank" href="https://fullenrich.com/">FullEnrich</a> (aggregating 20+ vendors)</p><p>* <strong>CRM and data infrastructure</strong>: Salesforce, Snowflake</p><p>* <strong>Workflow automation</strong>: <a target="_blank" href="https://www.clay.com/">Clay</a>, n8n, Zapier</p><p>* <strong>AI and agents</strong>: Claude Code, MCP server (FullEnrich), HubSpot MCP</p><p>* <strong>Movement origins</strong>: “Forward-deployed engineer” (Palantir), GTM engineer (Clay)</p><p>Timestamps</p><p>* <strong>(02:37)</strong> Welcome to S2E6 — the data infrastructure layer of GTM engineering, Ben’s bio (Sales Ramp, Jellyfish, FullEnrich)</p><p>* <strong>(04:13)</strong> Ben’s intro — FullEnrich origin, 20+ data vendors, usage-based model, integrations everywhere</p><p>* <strong>(07:13)</strong> What’s changed in GTM engineering — the Palantir comparison, why Clay launched the movement</p><p>* <strong>(09:12)</strong> Beyond GTM — recruiter and talent acquisition use cases, Snowflake as system of record</p><p>* <strong>(12:07)</strong> Where the movement is being oversold — ex-spray-and-prey agencies rebranding as engineers</p><p>* <strong>(14:50)</strong> Does GTM engineering 10x the rest of the sales org? The hire profile question</p><p>* <strong>(16:22)</strong> Claude Code hype — siloed adoption, FullEnrich’s MCP server, the chat-as-blank-page problem</p><p>* <strong>(20:36)</strong> Why one data provider isn’t enough — coverage gaps, the benchmarking pain</p><p>* <strong>(23:08)</strong> The orchestration layer — managed waterfall by industry, region, segment</p><p>* <strong>(26:02)</strong> Cold calling as a growth lever — your list is the strategy</p><p>* <strong>(28:36)</strong> Tone of voice on the call — don’t push, don’t sound salesy, ask permission</p><p>* <strong>(29:51)</strong> Have a reason to call — the “because” frame that earns attention</p><p>* <strong>(30:37)</strong> Don’t touch the prospect’s ego — name the problems peers face, let them pick</p><p>* <strong>(31:50)</strong> What’s next for the enrichment industry — global coverage, verification, decision layer</p><p>* <strong>(34:28)</strong> Hiring for GTM in the AI era — what separates good from great</p><p>* <strong>(42:47)</strong> AI as the well-articulated MBA intern — polish hides shallow work</p><p>* <strong>(44:20)</strong> How FullEnrich structures its GTM org — three audiences, three squads</p><p>* <strong>(50:00)</strong> Agencies vs in-house — main motion in-house, $20–50K budget for new motions</p><p>* <strong>(53:41)</strong> Stop-doing for VPs — demo the zero-to-one before building the deck</p><p>* <strong>(55:56)</strong> Closing — audience first, list is strategy, AI with growth mindset</p><p>Where to Find Benjamin</p><p>* <a target="_blank" href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/benjamin-douablin/">LinkedIn</a></p><p>* <a target="_blank" href="https://fullenrich.com/">FullEnrich</a></p><p>Where to Connect with Jared & Matteo</p><p>* <strong>Matteo Tittarelli</strong>, GTM Engineer School Co-founder: <a target="_blank" href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/matteo-titta/">LinkedIn</a>, <a target="_blank" href="https://x.com/matteo_titta">X</a>, <a target="_blank" href="https://genesysgrowth.com/">Website</a>, <a target="_blank" href="https://newsletter.genesysgrowth.com/">Newsletter</a></p><p>* <strong>Jared Waxman</strong>, GTM Engineer School Co-founder: <a target="_blank" href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/jwaxman/">LinkedIn</a></p><p></p><p><p>Thanks for reading GTM Engineer School! Subscribe for free to receive new posts and support my work.</p></p><p></p> <br/><br/>This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit <a href="https://gtmengineerschool.substack.com?utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=CTA_1">gtmengineerschool.substack.com</a>
May 14, 2026
S2E5: "Foundations Before Automation" | Mario Moscatiello
<p>Listen now | The VP of Marketing at Airbyte unpacks why every company is now a go-to-market company, the warm outbound playbook that doubled pipeline, and what separates the operators worth hiring in 2026.</p><p>Brought to you by</p><p><strong>This could be your logo</strong>!</p><p>Reach out to <a target="_blank" href="https://cal.com/jaredwax">Jared</a> to sponsor the next episode of this podcast and reach 5000+ modern GTM operator and founders.</p><p>About our guest — Mario Moscatiello</p><p>Mario Moscatiello is the VP of Marketing at Airbyte, the open source data integration platform with 500+ connectors that moves data between sources and warehouses, CRMs, or activation tools. If you are syncing product signals, stitching together enrichment sources, or moving data between systems at scale, Airbyte is probably already somewhere in your stack. Mario came up the developer-tools path: growth at Pusher in London, then GitBook, then a stint as Principal at Flex Capital and board observer at Strapi, then Head of Growth at FluteStack. He had been advising Airbyte since 2020, four years before joining full-time, so when he stepped into the VP role he already knew the product, the community, and the motion cold. Since joining, Mario has built what he calls a warm-outbound motion that triangulates GitHub signals, product usage, and pricing-page intent through Common Room, Octave, and Clay. That approach doubled Airbyte’s pipeline growth rate.</p><p>Core Takeaways</p><p>* <strong>Foundations Before Automation Is The Real Step Change</strong>: GTM engineering is a step change only when product market fit is in place and revops data is clean. AI is a multiplier of whatever foundation exists. Bad data equals bad signal equals bad results, and AI in the mix is a multiplier effect. Pre-PMF teams hacking GTM with AI just create more damage faster. The two foundations are the PMM hat (personas, competitor, market, what works) and the revops hat (clean fields, clean enrichments, clean attribution). Without those two, more activity equals more noise.</p><p>* <strong>Owning Workflows End-To-End Is The Leverage Unlock</strong>: Every team member can now own a workflow from idea to live. Paid SEO goes from idea to keyword research to blog post with assets and published in an hour. The SDR manager goes from prospect list to email copy to launched campaign in the same hour. AI compresses the wait between specialists. The right framing is force multiplier per role, not headcount replacement. Anthropic and OpenAI are hiring engineers AND account executives at the same time they ship tools that supposedly replace both. Five strong people doing the work of fifteen, not one star doing the work of ten — because that one star carries unrepeatable key-man risk.</p><p>* <strong>Warm Outbound Is Signal Triangulation, Not Message Volume</strong>: The doubling of Airbyte’s pipeline growth rate did not come from blasting cold sequences. Two specific plays. First, events: dump the post-event lead list into Common Room, rank by who has signed up for the product or used the open source repo, and let SDRs only call the warm subset. Second, PLG signups: when an engineer signs up, outreach to them, AND prospect for decision-makers in the same org, AND warm those decision-makers with ads BEFORE the SDR call. The Twilio “Ask Your Developer” campaign at scale. Even when a motion has to be cold, the question is how to warm it up. ABM at Series B is now defensible if you know your audience.</p><p>* <strong>Hire Barrels, Not Ammunition. Then Outsource The Deep Expertise</strong>: Mario hires generalists who can take a project end-to-end without a playbook over narrow specialists. The best SDR he ever hired was selling pest control door to door. Four traits to look for. Agency: just do the thing, do not tell me you will plan to do the thing. Curiosity: the playbooks that worked five years ago do not work now. Taste: AI brings the cost of writing copy and code to zero, and taste is what differentiates. Chip on the shoulder: something to prove. Then complement the in-house team with agencies for deliverability, paid media, and scaled outbound, so the team focuses on managing agents and workflows rather than becoming a CPM expert.</p><p></p><p><p>Enjoying this episode so far? Subscribe for free to new posts.</p></p><p></p><p>Top Quotes</p><p>“Bad data equals bad signal equals bad results... When AI is in the mix, that’s a multiplier effect.”</p><p>“For me, it’s really about drive over experience, agency over experience. I don’t care if you’ve never done this job. The best SDRs I hired was a person that was selling pest control products like door to door.”</p><p>“AI brings the cost of writing copy, writing code, and everything to zero. What is going to differentiate is your taste and deep understanding of who you’re selling to.”</p><p>“The biggest thing you should stop doing is just doom scrolling social media and sending your team everything that other people are doing... Just start listening to what your customers are saying.”</p><p>Referenced Tools and Resources</p><p>* <strong>Data infrastructure</strong>: <a target="_blank" href="https://airbyte.com/">Airbyte</a>, Salesforce, Supabase</p><p>* <strong>Signal hub</strong>: <a target="_blank" href="https://www.commonroom.io/">Common Room</a></p><p>* <strong>Outbound orchestration and messaging</strong>: <a target="_blank" href="https://www.octavehq.com/">Octave</a>, <a target="_blank" href="https://www.clay.com/">Clay</a>, <a target="_blank" href="https://instantly.ai/">Instantly</a>, <a target="_blank" href="https://www.outreach.io/">Outreach</a></p><p>* <strong>Audience sync and ads</strong>: Vector</p><p>* <strong>Sales intelligence</strong>: Gong</p><p>* <strong>AI assistants and dev</strong>: <a target="_blank" href="https://www.anthropic.com/">Claude Code</a>, Claude, Cursor, ChatGPT, Lovable</p><p>* <strong>Documentation and written culture</strong>: GitBook, GitHub</p><p>* <strong>Frameworks and references</strong>: Barrels vs Ammunition (Keith Rabois, Founders Fund and Vinod Khosla), Twilio “Ask Your Developer” campaign</p><p>Timestamps</p><p>* <strong>(05:11)</strong> Welcome to S2E5 — Matteo’s intro on data infrastructure, Mario’s bio, the warm-outbound motion that doubled pipeline at Airbyte</p><p>* <strong>(08:18)</strong> Investor to operator return — every company is a go-to-market company when software costs go to zero</p><p>* <strong>(09:55)</strong> Workflow ownership end-to-end — paid SEO, SDR manager going idea to live in an hour, technology no longer the blocker</p><p>* <strong>(11:28)</strong> Dev tools historical context — Auth0, Pusher, segment plus APIs, GTM engineering not new for dev tools</p><p>* <strong>(13:33)</strong> Step change vs oversold — PMM and revops as the two foundations, AI as multiplier of garbage too</p><p>* <strong>(16:50)</strong> The brand and product marketing comeback in the AI slop era</p><p>* <strong>(17:48)</strong> Force multiplier vs headcount replacement — Anthropic and OpenAI hiring engineers AND AEs, key-man risk</p><p>* <strong>(19:30)</strong> Markdown files in a GitHub repo vs notebooks on laptops — knowledge that survives the people</p><p>* <strong>(23:14)</strong> Build vs buy and stitching — Vercel and Ramp can build, most teams should stitch via MCP</p><p>* <strong>(25:00)</strong> MCP server unlock — making any tool talk to any tool, free from vendor integration roadmaps</p><p>* <strong>(28:02)</strong> Mario’s overnight cron job that cleans his daily notes plus a CLAUDE.md file knowing his priorities</p><p>* <strong>(28:43)</strong> Stack walkthrough — Common Room, Octave, Clay, Instantly, Vector, Gong, Outreach</p><p>* <strong>(32:32)</strong> Warm outbound play one — events leads ranked through Common Room before any SDR call</p><p>* <strong>(33:30)</strong> Warm outbound play two — PLG signups plus decision-maker prospecting plus warming via ads (Twilio at scale)</p><p>* <strong>(35:33)</strong> ABM at Series B is now defensible if you know your audience</p><p>* <strong>(36:41)</strong> Barrels vs ammunition (Keith Rabois) — drive over experience, the door-to-door pest-control SDR</p><p>* <strong>(41:57)</strong> Outsourcing the deep expertise — deliverability agency, paid media agency, the team focuses on agents and workflows</p><p>* <strong>(47:18)</strong> Four traits for great GTM engineers — agency, curiosity, taste, chip on the shoulder</p><p>* <strong>(49:33)</strong> Stop doom scrolling, start listening — the Gong digest workflow as the one habit to start</p><p>Where to Find Mario</p><p>* <a target="_blank" href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/mmoscatiello">LinkedIn</a></p><p>* <a target="_blank" href="https://airbyte.com/">Airbyte</a></p><p>Where to Connect with Jared & Matteo</p><p>* <strong>Matteo Tittarelli</strong>, GTM Engineer School Co-founder: <a target="_blank" href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/matteo-titta/">LinkedIn</a>, <a target="_blank" href="https://x.com/matteo_titta">X</a>, <a target="_blank" href="https://genesysgrowth.com/">Website</a>, <a target="_blank" href="https://newsletter.genesysgrowth.com/">Newsletter</a></p><p>* <strong>Jared Waxman</strong>, GTM Engineer School Co-founder: <a target="_blank" href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/jwaxman/">LinkedIn</a></p><p></p><p><p>Thanks for reading GTM Engineer School! Subscribe for free to receive new posts and support my work.</p></p><p></p> <br/><br/>This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit <a href="https://gtmengineerschool.substack.com?utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=CTA_1">gtmengineerschool.substack.com</a>
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