14 Oct 2026
The Currency Of Trust A Conversation With Al Gardner
In this episode of Murphy's Law, host Murphy Robinson sits down with Al Gardner, Executive Director of the Denver Department of Public Safety, former Denver Deputy Mayor, and a longtime technology executive who once chaired the city's Citizen Oversight Board. Murphy calls him a friend, a confidant, and a brother, and the two former deputy mayors go deep on leadership, trust, government efficiency, and the role of technology in keeping a growing city safe.
Gardner traces his path from Houston's Third Ward, where he attended Jack Yates High School, to Wiley University in Marshall, Texas, the school made famous by "The Great Debaters." He started in IT at the very bottom, as a cable puller, and worked his way up over decades, eventually helping take a company through its IPO after moving to Denver. From there he moved into civic life through city boards and commissions, ran for mayor in 2023, led Denver's Department of General Services, served as Deputy Mayor, and now oversees Denver Police, Fire, the Sheriff Department, and 9-1-1.
Some of the most candid moments come from Gardner's school years. His family moved constantly; he attended six elementary schools and four high schools, stood in free-cheese lines, and finished near the bottom of his class without walking the stage, earning his diploma through summer school. For years he hid that story. Now he tells it on purpose, for kids who don't see a way forward. Murphy shares his own history as a C-minus student who only found his stride in college.
The heart of the episode is what Gardner calls "the currency of trust." He and Murphy revisit the George Floyd era, when Gardner sat on the oversight board and Murphy ran public safety, and how they disagreed hard behind the scenes while keeping a respectful public relationship. They dig into measuring what matters ("if it doesn't count, it doesn't exist"), cutting redundant "belt and suspenders" bureaucracy while keeping the checks that matter, and using technology like drones as first responders and digital incident tracking as a force multiplier, since U.S. departments can't hire at the pace of population growth.
The conversation turns serious when Gardner names who pays for broken trust: people who will never be in the rooms where decisions are made. He closes on what he wants to leave behind, including for his own son, who serves in public safety: first responders who know their government sees them, hears them, and cares about them.
KEY THEMES & TAKEAWAYS
The Currency of Trust — Trust is built both ways, over time, by saying the same thing in every room. When leaders stop trusting and talking to each other, the dysfunction lands on neighborhoods that never see those meetings.
If It Doesn't Count, It Doesn't Exist — Gardner brings a private-sector discipline to government: build systems one at a time, measure them, and publish the results. Murphy pushes leaders to name their KPIs and know when to cut a program.
Custodians of the Seat — Every public role has a shelf life. Both men describe the job as leaving the seat better than they found it, developing their replacements, and valuing followership as much as leadership.
Technology as a Force Multiplier — Criminals race to the bottom; public safety has to race to the top. Gardner relies on a technology roadmap shaped by police, fire, and sheriff leaders to prepare for what's coming instead of fearing it.
The Bootstraps Story, Told Out Loud — From near the bottom of his class to running a major city's public safety system, Gardner leans into his story so young people know there's always a way forward.
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