What is Women Who Earn Podcast?

Interviews with prominent women in the finance industry. womenwhoearn.substack.com

How often does this podcast release new episodes?

This podcast is currently inactive and not releasing new episodes.

Where can I listen to this podcast?

This podcast is available on 7 platforms including Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and more. You can also use the RSS feed directly.

Does this podcast accept guests?

Yes, this podcast regularly features guests.

Women Who Earn Podcast

Claim This Podcast

by Kiran Bishop

8 episodes

Updated Inactive

Accepts GuestsHas SponsorsLocation 🇺🇸

Podcast Overview

Interviews with prominent women in the finance industry. <a href="https://womenwhoearn.substack.com?utm_medium=podcast">womenwhoearn.substack.com</a>

Language

🇺🇲

Publishing Since

8/16/2022

View on Apple Podcasts RSS Feed

1 verified contact email on file for Women Who Earn Podcast

Pitch yourself as a guest, propose sponsorships, or reach out directly to the host.

See contact details

Recent Episodes

March 30, 2024

Interview with Irene Hong, Founding Partner of CEC Capital Group

Transcript:Kiran: Welcome to Woman Who Earn, a podcast dedicated to empowering young girls to thrive in the world of finance. I'm Kiran Bishop, and my interest in finance ignited during my freshman year of high school. However, as I joined financial clubs, I couldn't shake the realization that I was one of the only girls in the room.Kiran: This effect extends beyond myself, as according to Girls Who Invest, only 1 percent of U. S. financial assets are managed by women. Join me as we dive into conversations with industry professionals tackling topics from breaking into finance to navigating the unique challenges posed by women in the industry.Kiran: Through Women Who Earn, my goal is to equip young girls like myself with the knowledge and wisdom they need to succeed. I believe it's crucial that no one feels alienated by circumstances beyond their control, and I hope this podcast serves as a beacon of inspiration for all who tune in. So let's shatter stereotypes, defy expectations, and earn our rightful place in the financial world.Kiran: Welcome to Woman Who Earn.Kiran: On today's episode, we will be joined by Miss Irene Hong, who is a founding partner for CEC Capital Group and leads the Healthcare Industry Group. Under her guidance, CEC Capital has emerged as a leader in the healthcare banking sector, with the largest specialized team covering pharma slash biotech, MedTech services in digital health care.Kiran: CEC Capital also has a strong cross border practice having worked in the past with several multinational companies including Zimmer, Charles River, and Teba. With an increasing interest in China outbound investment, CEC Capital has opened an office in the U. S. and Ms. Hong will be leading this cross border effort.Kiran: Prior to joining CEC Capital, Ms. Hong was a manager for Accenture in San Francisco. Before receiving her MBA, Ms. Hong worked as an engineer for Merck and worked on several plant startups, including a technology transfer project in China for recombatant hepatitis B vaccines and for Merck's launch of Crixivan, a protease inhibitor for HIV.Kiran: Ms. Hong has both her MBA and BS in mechanical engineering from UC Berkeley.Kiran: Thank you so much for joining me today. We can start with my first question, which is how did you get to where you are today? And what moment are you most proud of in your journey? Irene: Right. So I think maybe it's good to go through my background so that you can understand how I got to where I am today.Irene: So I actually didn't study finance. I studied engineering and I studied mechanical engineering. The interesting thing is I look back at when I was in high school, I actually chose mechanical engineering because at that time, I went to UC Berkeley for engineering and it was 5 percent women in mechanical engineering, and that was one of the lowest. I think it was electrical was fairly low, but mechanical was the lowest. And that was the reason I chose the major, which looking back was a ludicrous reason for choosing a major, but that was what was in my head at the time. And I was very good at math and the sciences, and so I thought, okay, I'll just tackle this because there are not enough women in it, which was very intentional at that time. Although I would have to say that as I've gone through my career, I realized how ridiculous that reasoning was. So I studied mechanical engineering. I ended up working as an engineer, The first job I got was with Merck, the pharmaceutical company, and they gave me the opportunity to go to China. At the time I was working on a humanitarian project to donate the hepatitis B vaccine to China. So I jumped on that opportunity, not really understanding what that was going to mean in my life.Irene: So at 20 years old, I graduated and I moved to China to build this plant as a young engineer. I spent a couple of years in China and then after that, they moved me back to the U S where I worked on an AIDS drug. So that was a launch of one of the drugs that was in the cocktails at that time in the mid nineties.Irene: So I spent another two years of my life working on that. So pretty much four years of my life was pretty wiped out by my job because those jobs are 24 hours a day when we were trying to build the plants. And then, after that, I spent a year flying around. My next job after the AIDS drug launched was to go and rationalize the plans overseas, meaning I was the engineer that was flying into the different international locations to see what would be required to technically upgrade them. And then I would send all the numbers and all the figures and all the requirements to headquarter, and that's what I made the big switch from engineering to to finance.Irene: At that time, I had done that for a year, which was working with corporate to give them the numbers. And then they would make decisions about whether to shut the plant down or to keep it open. As an engineer at that point, I felt that I wasn't the one that was making these decisions.Irene: And so I figured in my mind, if I went and got an MBA and tried to understand the business side of things, it wouldn't hurt me in my engineering. So I figured it wasn't something that was going to hurt me at all, I could only gain from that. So that's when I made the switch to study business.Irene: So I did. I also went back to Berkeley to get my business degree. And then after that, I went into management consulting for a couple of years because I knew I was going to come back to China. I had met my ex husband in China, so I knew I was coming back. So I did management consulting. And then when I came back to China, my partner and I, he had started the firm, he was a Goldman banker.Irene: It was an opportunity about 23 years ago. He was starting an investment bank that was working on raising capital, and doing M & A, sort of like a merchant bank. so I joined him. At that time it was ridiculous, in my mind bankers and consultants are sort of sister industries, but aside from the fact their service industries might attract similar people, it was very different work. But in my mind, I thought that it was something that was challenging and so I wanted to work with him. He was very transactional and I was very strategic, so it ended up working out quite well because I was the one that was doing the business plans, looking for targets, helping companies understand how to enter.Irene: So I eventually, I became a banker just through experience over 20 something years. I wasn't trained in a bulge bracket bank. I just was hustling deals and understood the industry as it was growing in China. Some of your questions are around the path to where I am, whether it was intentional, my path into finance. And I think a lot of people that I work with, especially the women that I work with in banking, venture capital, private equity. Many of them, very few of them actually say, I am going to be an investor, I'm going to be a banker. I think many of them meander their way into it with other skillsets often.Irene: I some do start off being auditors or being in some sort of financial role, but many come from industry and different places, which is the case for me. Kiran: Thank you. That was a very comprehensive overview. And so I understand that now you are working with CEC Capital Group.Kiran: So as a founding partner of this, what aspects of your role do you find most rewarding and challenging? Irene: I wear a double hat, which is I started a business. I think that the most rewarding part about my job is that I can't cure cancer, but I can help fund the companies that cure cancer.Irene: Right. So I think what keeps me going and what motivates me in my job. I think the first thing is really, I work with a lot of clients and their success in order to grow operationally is based on my success, right? So if they need capital, I'm the one that helps them find capital.Irene: If they need an exit or need to be acquired or need strategic resources, I'm the one that helps them find that. So, it's very much like, we're still a service firm and many of our clients rely on us in order to maintain their growth or to have some objective that they need to meet.Irene: So I think the most rewarding part is when you succeed to help them. The downside is it's very, banking and especially in M&A banking, you fail as much as you succeed often. So it's also very difficult and very challenging in that way. And of course, growing a business in China and watching China's growth over the last two decades has been immensely rewarding albeit challenging as well. Kiran: Thank you. And what led you to a career in healthcare banking? Irene: Fact, so when we started the firm in 2000, 23 years ago, there was no healthcare. So we were really working on a lot of internet at that time. So we were working with the CNS and the net eases of the China world when the internet was just taking off. We were also doing a lot of consumer and a lot of media. So I wasn't healthcare banking, I was just general banking, tech and consumer, but in 0 7, 0 8, when we started to see money coming in, because of my health care background, I was the partner that made sense to focus on health care.Irene: So my firm does not only work in health care, we also work in tech and consumer, but my other partners are covering those fields. And I've been covering health care for the last 15 years. Yeah. Partially just because my background in pharma made sense that I covered that. And as an engineer, oftentimes a lot of the things that we're dealing with are, if it's not pharma, it's medical device.Irene: So the way that I started off in Merck and pharma though is pretty random. So, when you ask about intentionality, I was working for Procter and Gamble as an intern making diapers in Modesto. And then Merck was like, at that time, it was Forbes number one company to work for.Irene: So I thought, okay, I'll drop a resume in. Life sometimes isn't always that intentional, and I think, it's like you open a door, and then you go down a door, and then you have other doors to choose from. And so I think life is just not always that planned.Irene: So that's how I ended up in pharma was Merck was recruiting and it was like the best company. So I thought I'd take a shot, which defined my entire career.Kiran: So focusing more so on your identity as being a woman in this male dominated space, has there any, has there ever been a time where you were one of, if not the only woman in the room and how did you feel and deal with that situation, and in general, how do you work to navigate that situation? Irene: This is kind of a complicated question for me, to be honest, because I have a girlfriend who does a lot of woman empowerment, and she criticizes me a little bit because I'm not that, I'm not that active in terms of on her speaker list, and I don't participate that much.Irene: And I was thinking about this. I mean, clearly I'm woman, clearly I am very supportive of women. But I think the thing is, I've always been one of the few women at the table. even in my engineering degree, when I was working as an engineer in the facility on the manufacturing floor, I'm still the only woman.Irene: And so I always felt like I had to prove myself. I think women in general always feel like they need to prove themselves. That's a hallmark of women. I've had a lot of experience with working with both my, in terms of employees, my male bankers and my female bankers, very different.Irene: But the thing is, I don't like to focus on the fact that I'm a woman and I don't like to, because I think that my success is something where it's despite being a woman. And so I think that the more that somebody focuses on the fact that, because I never consider myself less than equal, and I don't feel like I've ever been treated less than equal, to be honest.Irene: And if I was treated, if anybody treated me less than equal, then I just wouldn't be at that table. So I just wouldn't be present. So when I discussed this also with some of my junior staff, they also said, well, partially it might be because you've always owned the business that you worked at, which is also possible.Irene: You know, I never really worked. I did work in management consulting. It's not that I don't understand the challenges of being a woman in a male dominated field. Cause that's what I'm always doing, but I don't actually very consciously think about it ever. I think I've just become accustomed to being one of the few women.Irene: In fact, the funny thing is. I notice when there are a lot of women. It's a very interesting thing. Healthcare banking has more women than other parts of banking and the healthcare industry in general has. I don't know. If this is I've just in my own experience, if I look at the business development heads in China of all the leading multinationals, they're all women and almost like 70 percent women, which I find very startling.Irene: So I think it's more that I, I, I don't notice that I'm the only woman I notice when there are other women around. But I don't feel, I honestly don't feel like I've ever been discriminated against. It doesn't mean that there's not a boys club. There are many times when, especially in Asia, that the guys will go off and socialize differently, they'll do different things.Irene: But I don't necessarily feel like that's hurt me terribly. I'm sure it has in certain ways, but I think that you compensate for things. If you have certain set challenges and you want to find certain solutions, you figure out a way. So I don't feel like it's been, I don't feel, I think part of it is, so when I think about it, I spent so much of my time trying to be equal that I just don't feel unequal and because of that, I think then it doesn't give people much room to treat me in a different way, if that makes sense.Kiran: Yeah, thank you. Like being very confident in yourself so that you don't let people's opinions affect you. Irene: Right. I think that's just how it is in the boardroom anyway. If you aren't confident or you are weak, then you own the persona that you are.Kiran: Thank you.Kiran: I really resonated with your comment about how you always felt the need to prove yourself in any situation that you're in. And I experienced this too, but obviously to a lesser extent because I'm only in high school.Irene: I think it's not that you experience it to a lesser extent. My daughter also went through high school.Irene: I think it just carries with you, which is not an easy thing, to be honest. Later on in this podcast, we'll discuss words of advice, but I think what you feel now is that feeling of needing to prove yourself and be good enough and demonstrate your capability is something that I think a lot of successful and ambitious women struggle with.Irene: And I think that that's something that you need to balance, to be honest. The other end of that is feeling that you're very deserving and you're worthy asking for what you need, asking for what you want, demanding to be competent, like demanding to be respected and getting what you need, that there's a lot of.Irene: There are a lot of people who are very good at that, and they get what they want, right? Because they ask for what they want, because they think that they deserve what they should get. And there's always a double edged sword. Right to every sort of good person personality trait in it.Irene: In its extreme. It really hurts. Yeah. Kiran: Thank you Did you ever have a mentor in your career who helped you and if so What was the greatest impact they had or what sort of impact? Irene: I did not to be honest and part of that was because I think that I was working in China so early and the industry that I was working in was basically nascent, right?Irene: Banking didn't really exist at that time. And so there weren't that many people ahead of me that I, could admire. There were, of course, female entrepreneurs that I worked with that were older than me that had a little bit more experience than me that I admired.Irene: It's not to say that there were not, but there was nobody that I was really close to that mentored me. There's always examples of people you could admire and be role models too but I wouldn't say that I had a mentor per se. Kiran: Thank you. Looking back at your career journey, is there anything you would do differently or any advice you would give to your younger self at the beginning of your professional life?Irene: For the younger generation of women, I think being a woman and being in a very demanding career or being very ambitious is quite difficult. The one thing that I advice that I give to my sort of junior bankers is one, you need to work, you need to work so hard in your twenties. I remember, my life when I was in my twenties, I don't know how things are now for entry level people, but, I was working till 2, 3 a. m. I was working and it was pretty brutal, but in your twenties, you can do it because what happens is when you reach your thirties, you have to slow down. And it's not nice to say, but it's just different women have different biology, like having children is something that is very fulfilling.Irene: I highly support it, but you can't work the same in when you have children than when you don't. So I think that my whole career path would go in different cycles. Right. So it's definitely pre children, marriage isn't an issue, but like pre children and post children.Irene: And then now that I'm empty nest, it's a different time. And once the kids get older, it's different. So you need to work as hard as you can in your twenties and your life might feel a little bit out of balance. Then once you hit your, when you hit your thirties and when you start having children, then my advice changes. Life is a pie of four pieces, you have your your family, your friends, your work, and your personal life .Irene: And these four pieces are not, they're not equal in priority, right? You wouldn't say your friends are more important than your children, or your work is more important than your family, but they are equal in importance in balance. So I would say that you cannot neglect any part of it or your life will fall apart.Irene: And it doesn't mean that just because you spend time, let's say, taking care of yourself versus spending time with your kids or you need to work and you can't go to that play. It's just a matter of if you don't make sure they're balanced, then you'll be in trouble.Irene: That's a thing that we're always struggling with. and the last example, there's anecdotal story that I want to give is one time I was in the gym and I was working out and there was a guy there and I was kind of showing, you know, the, there were these Instagram models that I thought, Oh, I would really like to have this kind of potty and he looks at me and he's like, Irene, you know, these girls train three hours a day.Irene: Like you can't aspire for that. and I thought to myself, you know, you can't be the head of Goldman Sachs, be Martha Stewart and be a bikini fitness model. It's impossible to do all three things. Okay. So you just have to like, let go of any idea that you're going to be perfect in any of those things. A person who doesn't have children is always going to be able to be more committed to you than you can at work in terms of time. A mother who doesn't work will go to every event and you can't if you work. So you just have to not beat yourself up when you can't do everything.Irene: And I think you learn that as you get older. So those are the Mhm. Messages that I would tell the younger ones, like try to fast track your career as fast as you can in your twenties. And then because later you'll have to, you'll have to rebalance. to be happy. Kiran: Thank you. And what's the best advice you've ever received?Irene: Oh, the best advice I ever received was actually from, I had a counselor who told me that, and this is across every single thing, and I really thought about it, and I think about it when I hit problems, is that you cannot control what other people do or think ever. You can only control what you do and what you think. So it's a matter of, I might try very hard to try to persuade somebody, but I can't make them think what I want to think. And so it's really just a matter of in life, like whether it's your partner, whether it's your colleague, whether it's your children, you have no, you can't control other people.Irene: You can only control yourself. And so that really made me understand. I think about that sometimes, when I get frustrated about something, I'll think about that. Then I'll be like, okay, so what should I do about it? And other people can respond based on your response, but you can only control you.Kiran: Thank you. My next question is also along the same vein with advice, but what advice do you have for girls who are interested in pursuing your career? Irene: So it's hard to say because I don't know how you describe my career like there's I have the engineering part, I have the finance part, I have the entrepreneurial part. I would say so one thing, I know that you're studying math which is good. One thing is when I was in engineering my third year I really wanted to drop out I thought to my dad, Oh my God, this is because Berkeley is fairly theoretical and when you're doing thermodynamics, you're like, what am I doing? This is not fun. I'm not interested in this. I was like, I want to quit. This is like after my sophomore year, that's when they're trying to weed everybody out. You're taking math and physics.Irene: My dad said, Irene, you can always go to law school, business school, you can even go to med school, but you can't go back and be an engineer. You can't go and get your PhD in engineering if you don't go through this. So he said, I suggest you stick it through. And I, I did, and it was the best thing I did.Irene: Because I think that in some sense, and my son is also thinking about this as he's thinking about his major. Many things in life you learn later in life, or you learn along the way. I think that in college, it's very important to get an education within... I don't know how to explain what I'm trying to say, you know, like you can be in finance, you could have studied finance or you could study math, right? And math is a tool that will help you. It will give you a very strong foundation for other things. And really college is about learning how to learn. It's actually not about what you learn in college at all. Like nobody, I know very few people use what they learned in college in their job.Irene: Unless you studied a PhD and you're actually doing research. Very few people did. So it's not about, you don't have to think, oh, if I want to go into banking or finance, I need to study economics or finance and the path doesn't have to be then I have to go and get the job, the internship at Goldman. I know a lot of people go down that path, but that doesn't necessarily have to be the only path. Kiran: Right, it's a very restrictive way of going about college. Irene: Yeah, and I think that it's easy. Well, I should say I ended up going down a very typical path, right?Irene: I studied engineering, went to business school, I went into management consulting, I went into banking. So it also sounds like I did go down the good the good Asian child path, which was, always go for the bankable job. Always try to go and do the prestigious thing.Irene: But I don't think college is the same. I don't think education is the same. And so I think, in the next 10 to 20 years, fundamentally, our jobs are not going to be the same. So trying to figure out the path that is so rigid and so direct is not going to work now because the paths are going to shift very quickly.Irene: So I think it's more important to really try to get certain tools in your life, which is understanding, certain fundamentals, learning how to learn, learning how to be flexible, understanding how to be solution driven, being creative, right? It's not like whatever you study, whatever content you're studying, it's going to be probably not that relevant.Irene: So I don't think you need to worry so much about, what it is that you're doing right now. Yeah. Kiran: Thank you. My final question is looking ahead. What are your hopes and aspirations for the next generation of women and how do you envision contributing to their success? Irene: Yeah, I think that when you look at the arc of women in the workplace and in society, there's still many societies where women are very unequal and don't have access, still, in the world.Irene: If you look at the U S, I mean, I think the U S has come a long way. And then if you look at China, you know, women have come a long way. I haven't lived in the U S for a long time. I've lived in China. But I know that there are a lot of things going on in China about diversity and equality and all these other things.Irene: I think it's really important just to focus on being successful as you, right. And being competent and I've never liked to focus on the fact that I'm a woman because I want to believe that I'm successful, not because I'm not a woman, not because I am a woman, just because the things that I've done equal to my peers who are men and women is valuable.Irene: Right. Well, I should say, you know, back in the day, it is true that with, because there's so few women in certain sectors, women actually get an advantage, right. Meaning there'll be more easily hired because. Frankly, no one wants to work in a workplace that has only men, even the men or women don't because it's just not pleasant and it's not balanced.Irene: So, this, this gender debate. People can say, well, it's not fair because a woman can get a job more easily than a man in a certain field because there are less women. And then the woman can say, oh, but you know what, because there are so few women the men crowd out the women and we don't have the same opportunities.Irene: I think all those arguments can be taken, but really, I don't think it's productive or constructive to try to think about that too much in terms of when you're actually in your job or in school. What's really most important is, am I doing the things that I need to do, am I successful in accomplishing what I'm supposed to accomplish in terms of my annual goals and my KPIs. It's not that I'm dismissing the fact that there, there may be discrimination in certain places, and it might be difficult.Irene: But I think that one really has to be very balanced. So it's very hard. I mean, I'm very supportive of women and trying to make sure that women succeed in fields where there are a few women. But at the same time, focusing too much on that is also very counterproductive.Irene: In a way, I think it just means that if you hold on to it, and you remind yourself all the time of that, then you assume that role. The more conscious you are of it, I feel the more it becomes an issue. Kiran: Kind of like imposter syndrome in a sense. Irene: Yeah. and honestly, imposter syndrome, I have that all the time. The funny thing is the interesting thing about imposter syndrome is there was one time, because I wasn't a trained banker, right? I didn't get trained in a bank and I was sitting in a. In a meeting with a lot of I mean, actually, they were probably all men, but a lot of senior people.Irene: And the guy was explaining something that I didn't understand, the lawyer. And finally I said, you know, so and so I don't understand what you're saying. Can you explain this to me? Right. Because, you know, it's very hard to admit that you don't understand something and look like you're not knowledgeable.Irene: You always want to present yourself as knowledgeable, right? I mean, that's just human nature, but I basically said, I have no idea what you're saying exactly. Can you explain it to me? And he tried to explain it to me. I had this aha moment. He was the senior partner at a law firm and we were talking about a regulatory issue and it became clear to me that he didn't really understand it either. So what I understood, meaning things were shifting so fast that nobody really could understand what was happening at, in that particular time was that, I've suddenly realized I'm just, I'm the most knowledgeable person. Cause I've been doing this for now 10 years.Irene: Just because I wasn't say classically trained but in China at that time I had been doing deals for at least a decade and so there wasn't there weren't that many people that were more knowledgeable than me because I had a lot of deal experience. So then I realized you know at some point you feel so insecure about what you don't know or what you think you don't know but in reality you always feel that you, there's somebody that knows more than you or will do better than you or people are judging you. And then eventually you realize that everybody else, when you're working the hardest and you're hustling the hardest, there aren't people that know more than you. So, yeah, almost every professional woman that I know will have hit that at some point. At some point in your life, you'll mature to the point where you'll realize, oh, actually, I don't have to feel this anymore. And hopefully you hit it earlier than later, right? Otherwise you don't get what you want and need because you're not feeling confident enough to ask for it. Kiran: Thank you.Kiran: Thank you so much for joining me on today's episode of Women Who Earn. I hope to see you next time. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit <a href="https://womenwhoearn.substack.com?utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=CTA_1">womenwhoearn.substack.com</a>

January 16, 2024

Interview with Susie Scher, Partner at Goldman Sachs

Transcript:Kiran: Hi, my name is Kiran Bishop. I'm 17 years old, and I became interested in finance during my freshman year of high school. As I became part of financial clubs, I realized that a great deal of the time, I was one of, if not the only girl in the room. This feeling of being disconnected from everyone around me while simultaneously being in a room full of people is what inspired me to create this podcast, Woman Who Earn.I created this podcast to help young girls like me gain knowledge and wisdom from industry professionals on topics ranging from how to break into finance to how to deal with unique challenges posed by being a woman in the industry. It is important for me, and I hope that it is also important for you, that feeling alienated by a situation out of your control does not inhibit your motivation to pursue whatever you want.This is Women Who Earn.On today's episode, I'm joined by Ms.Scher, who is the Chair of the Global Financing Group within Global Banking and Markets at Goldman Sachs. She serves on the Partnership Committee, Investment Banking Executive Committee, and the Global Inclusion and Diversity Committee.Susie is a global sponsor of the LGBTQ+ network and a senior advisor to the Investment Banking Council for Advancement of Racial Equity. Previously, she was co-head of the Global Financing Group. Before that, she was co-head of the Americas Financing Group. Earlier in her career, she served as Head of Investment Grade Capital Markets and Risk Management in the Americas Financing Group.Ms. Scher first joined Goldman Sachs in 1990 as a summer associate and rejoined the firm as a vice president in 1997. She was named Managing Director in 2001 and Partner in 2006. She's a trustee of Little Red Schoolhouse and Elizabeth Irwin High School. She serves on the board of directors of the Posse Foundation and the board of trustees at Middlebury College.She earned a BA in political science from Middlebury College and an MBA in finance from Columbia University School of Business.Thank you so much for joining me today. I think we can just start with my first question, which is, how did you get to where you are today? Susie: Wow, I could spend half an hour answering that question, but I'll try to be concise and then we can move on to other questions.So I had no idea what I wanted to be or what I wanted to do in my career, and when I was in college at Middlebury, you didn't have to be quite as organized as you do today. So, I had just started my senior year exploring job opportunities, and one of the areas I ended up becoming interested in was investment banking. I don't think I even understood what investment banking was at that point in time.It's just that it seemed like a really dynamic industry. It seemed like the people in it were smart, hardworking, and fun to be around. And so, I set my sights on working in investment banking. And from there, I got my first job at a firm called Solomon Brothers, right out of college. I spent three years at Solomon and then decided I wanted to further invest in my sort of business and finance education. So I went to Columbia Business School, and it was there that I figured out what parts of the business were most interesting to me. And we can dig into that and talk about it a little bit. But the thing that most interested me was working with companies.And I still do that today. Companies, big and small, are helping them achieve their business and financial objectives. And then, importantly, I also work in the markets. I really liked the way things that happened in the world affected me. Things that happened in the markets, whether that's the equity market or interest rates.And so I built a career in something that we call capital markets, and we can drill into that further. I went from undergrad at Middlebury College Analyst at Solomon Brothers to longtime partner and business head at Goldman Sachs. Kiran: Thank you. That was very comprehensive. So having started as a summer associate in 1990 and progressing through various roles to becoming a partner in 2006, can you reflect on some of the key skills or attributes that have been instrumental in your career advancement?Susie: Sure. I think the two characteristics you need to have to succeed in investment banking or really in any business are hard work and intelligence, maybe in that order. Okay. And so those are the very straightforward aspects of what can cause you to move over time at a place like Goldman Sachs.But the other thing that I'd say is really, really important, and sometimes maybe doesn't get that much attention is high EQ. My job is to understand the markets and to help companies raise financing in the equity and debt markets, but those companies are just humans and they're my clients and understand who they are as humans and know what they may need and how they think and how they might react to us and our ideas is an incredibly important part of my job.The other aspect of EQ or connection or sort of this personal aspect of the business is working at Goldman; even though Goldman is known as a star firm, we are not a star system. We are a collaborative system, and working with my partners and my colleagues, from our most junior colleagues right out of undergrad to people who run big businesses to my bosses, the CEO and president of Goldman.Understanding how to work together and drive towards a goal for our clients is every bit as important as that starting point, working really, really hard and being smart and understanding what it is we do in the markets. Kiran: Do you think having good EQ is something that you came out of undergrad understanding, or was it really an attribute that you learned along the way?Susie: So I didn't understand that I had it and I didn't understand that it was necessary for business. In fact, I just thought I'd need to be good at math, understand the markets, and understand complex concepts. But over time and looking back, I've come to understand how important EQ is, and looking back through my life, I think all of my success has actually been attributed to EQ in conjunction with the IQ and hard workpiece. I think it has not only made me successful at what I do but also chosen to do things where EQ is an important part of success, right? Not that you don't need EQ to be an engineer, but being an engineer is very IQ and technical and math-heavy.I didn't choose to go into a profession where EQ wasn't the most important thing. Some people might argue with me that it's not the most important thing, but for my success, it's really been the fuel to my success over time. Kiran: Yeah. Thank you. Do you have any tips on how to form or maintain lasting connections or build up good relationships with your clients or with other people who you're working and collaborating with?Susie: So I'm going to use an analogy. And I'm actually guilty of this too. So a lot of times when you meet somebody, and you hear their name, and you say your name, you then forget their name because you're so focused on your own name. The analogy and the tip in EQ are understanding when you're working in business; you're focused on whether you’re doing a good job and success and whether your content is good, and the most basic is my spreadsheet, correct? And is the model correct? And do I know how to do the job of the job? So the tip would be to hear the other person's name, meaning to see the other person, whether that's your colleague that you're working with or your boss or somebody who works for you, or very importantly, your client and understand where that person is, where are they if possible, even in their life what might they be dealing with? And also, what makes them tick? What are their goals and aspirations? So the tip would be: Don't forget the soft stuff, even though to succeed, you've got to have the hard stuff. You've got to have the modeling skills. You've got to understand finance. You have to work your butt off. You have to be intense and driven and all those things in trying to succeed, but you can't do that at the cost of prioritizing the human connection and the human relationships. The goal might be to win the piece of business, give the best advice, and execute the financing, but the human connection underpins it all. Kiran: Right. So make sure you remember the other person's name, but not at the expense of knowing your own. Susie: Yeah. That's a great way to put it. I love it. Kiran: Well, thank you. You're currently the chair of the global financing group. And I was just wondering what aspects of your role you find most rewarding and or challenging. Susie: Yeah. So, at this point in my career, Because of what I'm doing day to day is working a lot with founder-led companies, either private companies or, recently, public companies.And just working with those companies in general is really rewarding because, not that it's not fun to work with very, very big companies like the apples and the Procter and Gamble's and the Pfizer's of the world, that's rewarding too., But there's something really unique about working with founder-led companies because what you're doing is you're helping people with their baby, their brainchild, their passion.And so in my current role, I'm just loving that, like tonight, I'm having a drink with one of my CEOs who, a company that we took public a couple of years ago, and I just love spending time with her and talking about how she's taken the business from an idea to now a relatively large public company. So that's a really rewarding part of my job. The other thing is, I've always loved being an expert. That's one of the reasons that's an itch that this job scratches. And when I started out in the business, the difference between your average human and the experts, that gap was huge, right?Because there was no internet. All you had was the, if you weren't an investment banker and you didn't work on Wall Street, all you had was the Wall Street Journal, and maybe you've got the financial times. And if you worked in the business, you had access to other things like Quotron or Bloomberg.So you were like a super expert. Now we have the internet, we have CNBC, and we have podcasts, but even so, I'm still more of an expert than most, and so I love it. Talking to people and helping them think through one, the art of the possible, like what they might be able to do to achieve, I need to raise capital, can I do it? How much can I raise? What should the timing be? I also love interpreting what's going on in the world and how that might impact the markets and, therefore, companies, either financing needs or business plans. And so, this period of time, I guess all pairs of time seem complex and fraught. There's a lot to talk about, but today, there's so much to interpret, right? We're now a couple of years out of the pandemic and this period of incredible equity and capital, the market created really by the government and the Fed to save the world from the pandemic economically and then backfired because the economy got overheated and interest rates were too low.Well, then we went in the other direction and the Fed raised interest rates to try to slow down the economy and bring down inflation. And everybody last year predicted a hard landing, or, most people meant, a recession or a very high probability of recession, but that didn't happen. In fact, not only did it happen, but it seems like we're in a much better place than we thought we'd be from an economic perspective.Interest rates are starting to come down and the equity market is very strong, but, there are a lot of buts, Russia, Ukraine, the war between Israel and Hamas, what's going on in the Middle East, China always out there, and then an election year, and a very complicated one at that.So, you ask the question, what's fun or cool or interesting about my job right now? That's what I do every day, all day I listen, and I learn, and I read, and I talk to my colleagues, and I scan the world. And then, I try to interpret that and help my clients. I don't predict, I don't have a crystal ball.That would be dangerous, but I help my clients navigate the markets and think about what might transpire and how they can set themselves up to succeed, whether all of the good things play out or all of the bad things play out. That's my job. It's really fun and interesting. Kiran: Thank you. You've been involved in various leadership roles with Goldman Sachs, such as being co-head of different groups and now chairing the global financial group. How has your leadership style evolved over the course of your career? Susie: Well, that's a very good question because although I think I had an innate leadership style, when I was younger, my leadership style was, I would say, leading with aggression more than calm relaxation. One of the reasons you can succeed in this business is because you're confident and you're driven.And, the word that keeps coming to mind is bossy and in charge. I hate that word. But that was my early leadership style, this way of not asking people to do things, but telling them what to do. That is not a good leadership style to use to rise up in an organization, to manage large groups of people, to bring them along, to raise the next generation, and to find your successor.And maybe it's just the difference between being in my 20s and my 30s and now in my 50s and being able to feel more relaxed. But I think I'm a much more relaxed and calm leader than I was 20 years ago. I don't let my anxiety get the best of me. And, I've always been collaborative.I wasn't running around yelling at people. I was sometimes maybe less patient than I could have been, and in the last, let's call it, in my last few jobs in the last decade, I'd like to think I've become the kinder, gentler version of myself, and I think I like this version. Kiran: Yeah. And do you have any general tips for leading groups of people? Susie: One of the things we do, when we get a new job and a promotion, is this concept of the boss or the head or the manager or the leader and even our understanding of what a leader looks like, it seems like on TV or in books. I mean, it's kind of like when you ask kids, What does God look like?Right? God is an old white man with a beard, right? Or you could say your God is Jesus, but in this country, in the U S, what does a leader look like? We grew up, especially my generation, and a leader looked like the president of the United States, the CEO of a company. And no offense to straight white men, some of my best friends are, and I have a couple of sons who are, but first of all, I think people, younger people, should find role models and see themselves as future leaders. And listen, we've now had a black president. One day, hopefully, we will have a female president. So, number one is to find your role models in all different sorts of leaders. That's number one, but number two, think of leading. I don't want to be as squishy as to say, like a lead from behind. I mean, sometimes you have to lead from the front.But leading means developing the next generation of talent and helping people achieve, their goals and get to the highest level they can. And so some of the things I'm most proud of, in fact, the thing I'm most proud of at Goldman Sachs, is not like the deals I've done or the companies I've helped, although that's been very fun, it's the people I've brought up behind me and below me.Some of those people are people in their late thirties and early forties who I've worked with since they were 21, 22, and 23 years old. That's leadership, helping those people get from the day they walked into the door for the first jobs to, and some of them now have jobs that I had. And I love that. That's been really, really important to me. Kiran: Thank you. As a leader, how do you prioritize work-life balance, and what would you give to other people who are aspiring to achieve the same sort of success in both their personal and professional lives? Susie: So there's one thing I always think about when I think about work-life balance, and that's a little bit of an old concept, especially in a world where we have mobile devices, the ability to log in remotely, and some people don't like that, that work and home have blended. I love that because it's given me the ability to be everything I want to be at work, but also take care of myself and be a parent to my four children.A perfect example is, I'm home now because I knew we had this podcast, and I was in the office in the morning, and I told you already that I'm meeting a client for drinks later, but in between, I'm taking my 11-year-old to an orthodontist appointment and I'm going to my 14 year old's high school basketball game to watch her. Actually, it's a perfect example of work-life balance: the game's an hour, and the client wants to move drinks earlier, so I'm going to go to 45 minutes of the game. And so the way I have thought about work-life balance is, and I've always done this even pre-mobile device and log in remotely, is it's got to be seamless, and you have to sometimes be willing to make tradeoffs, and you have to have hard and fast rules.So, for example, one of my hard and fast rules is I never miss a birthday, a kid's birthday. I'll miss my own birthday. I just don't, I won't. And if something comes up, and it's on one of my kid's birthdays, I try to move it or avoid it or get somebody else to go because that's important to me. That's sad.I certainly miss a lot of things because sometimes you need to work and not be present at home. And so, I do think about these things a lot. One other thing, and this is actually the thing that, for some reason, popped into my mind. Often, when we talk about work-life balance, we discuss it with women.We don't discuss it with men. And although in today's modern work environment, men care as much about balance as most of them do, and about seeing their children or their families. And the other thing is we don't talk about ourselves. We talk about work-life balance, so it's a women's thing, and it's about families.So my 21-year-old, when she was by Mitzvahed, so this was a long time ago when she was 12, her parashah, her Torah portion that she read was about taking care of yourself so that you can take care of others. And in her little sermon that she wrote, she talked about finally understanding why when you're on an airplane and they say if the oxygen mask job drop, put your mask on.Before you put on others, another mass, right? Because if you pass out, you can't put your kid's mask on. And so that self-health concept of taking care of yourself, these are all things you could find a million podcasts on now, right? Get enough sleep, get enough exercise, eat well.That is as much an important part of work-life balance as balancing family and office. And so I know that sounds like a lot because you're going to work, you're going to take care of yourself, you're going to take care of your family, but like you're going to be the best employee if you make time for yourself.Kiran: Thank you. Your commitment to diversity is evident through your role as the global sponsor of the LGBTQ+ network and participation in the global inclusion and diversity committee. What initiatives or strategies have you found particularly effective in fostering diversity and inclusion within Goldman Sachs and, more broadly, the financial sector?Susie: Yeah, I mean, listen, we've been at this for a long time, and I've been at this for a long time, and if I think about when I graduated from college in 1986, the workforce on Wall Street was almost completely nondiverse. It was almost all male and it was almost all white. And actually, if you look at it, if you want to and you didn't ask this question, I'm going to answer it.If you think about the business case for diversity, and you look at the market cap of the big banks, the big investment banks, and you look at how diverse they are today in every sense of the world, gender, race, ethnicity, sexual orientation; we're way bigger. We're way more profitable. And that's because of diversity. What's been successful, in addition to, in a merit-based way, hiring the best people for the job and including a diversity lens as we hire the best people for the job, is also just giving folks that maybe don't or didn't fit into the mainstream, and what the mainstream is really evolving and if you came and walked around Goldman Sachs it might not even be that obvious what the mainstream is, but, certainly over the years, giving people who weren't mainstream support whether that's mentoring or sponsorship. A lot of not just Wall Street, but business in general was an all-boys club, and if you didn't get the inside baseball, now I'm using a sports analogy, but that's all I can think of. If you didn't get the inside baseball, if you didn't get, I don't want to call it like the secret rules; it's just the unwritten rules, so it was hard to succeed. We over time, I have made sure that everybody gets those unwritten rules, and that becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy because it's much easier to get the secret sauce of how to succeed when there are people with whom you can connect. So, it's a self-fulfilling prophecy because the more diverse we are, the more we connect with each other, and the more younger people coming in and coming up with the organization are comfortable having the conversations you need to have to succeed.And the other thing is just looking up and seeing people who look like you, that makes a big difference. And so, over time, it's been quite programmatic, whether those are programs around mentoring programs or sponsorship or recruiting to attract talent to the business who might not otherwise think that they want to work in the business, right?Because it used to be that women didn't even think of finance as a career. And I think a lot of those things are working, and we will continue at it, and we will continue to evolve so that Wall Street or Goldman Sachs or business looks like the rest of the world. And back to the market cap comment, we'll be more successful for it. The more diverse we are, the more successful we will be. Kiran: Thank you. And my final question is, what's the best advice you've ever received? How has it impacted you? And do you have any advice for girls who are interested in pursuing what you do or getting into finance, for exploring their interests?Susie: Yeah. I've been at this for so long, and I've received so much good advice. But I guess the best advice I've ever received consistently over time is to get and give real feedback. So we're nice people in general. And when people ask us what we could do better, We tend to give kind of light answers cause we don't want to hurt people's feelings.Nobody's perfect. And the better feedback you can get on how you're doing and what you can be doing better, the better you'll get. So, if you're a leader or a manager, don't be afraid to give it, but importantly, don't be afraid to ask for it, and don't be afraid to push people to think about what you could be doing better.So when you go to your boss and you're like, Hey, what can I be doing better? And your boss is like, all good. You're doing great. You're doing a great job. Well, that feels amazing. Maybe you are, but maybe you go to your boss right after a meeting and say, is there one thing in that meeting I could have done differently or I could have done better that would have made it an even better meeting?And so, with that feedback, we get stronger. And I guess that's really the best advice that I've gotten over the years. Kiran: Thank you. And thank you so much for taking time out of your day to do this with me. Susie: Great questions! It was really fun. Thank you.Kiran: Thank you so much for joining me on today's episode of Women Who Earn. I hope to see you next time. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit <a href="https://womenwhoearn.substack.com?utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=CTA_1">womenwhoearn.substack.com</a>

November 9, 2023

Interview with Rachel Robboy, Chief Risk Officer of IDB Invest

Transcript:Kiran: Hi, my name is Kiran Bishop. I'm 17 years old, and I became interested in finance freshman year of high school. As I became part of financial clubs, I realized that a great deal of the time, I was one of, if not the only, girl in the room. This feeling of being disconnected to everyone around me while simultaneously being in a room full of people is what inspired me to create this podcast, Woman Who Earn.I created this podcast to help young girls like me gain knowledge and wisdom from industry professionals on topics ranging from how to break into finance to how to deal with unique challenges posed from being a woman in the industry. It is important for me, and I hope that it is also important for you that feeling alienated by a situation out of your control does not inhibit your motivation to pursue whatever you want.This is Women Who Earn.Rachel Robboy is an experienced international development banker with core expertise in financial and non-financial risk management, portfolio management, deal structuring, and business development with a focus on Latin America. As chief risk officer of IDB Invest, Ms. Robboy oversees credit, market, and operational risk along with the environmental and social risk and special assets teams.Ms. Robboy chairs and votes on multiple senior management bank committees, and as leader of sustainability; diversity, equity, and inclusion in corporate ethics in IDB Invest over the past two decades, Ms. Robboy has held senior-level positions at the Inter American Development bank group, including chief of the portfolio management division and advisor to the vice president for private sector and non-sovereign guaranteed operations, as well as other leading roles in the infrastructure division and the special operations unit.Ms. Robboy holds an MBA in international finance and a master's in international affairs from the George Washington University and a bachelor's degree from Georgetown University, both in Washington, D.C. Thank you so much for joining me today for this podcast. I think we could probably just get started with the first question: how did you get to where you are today?Rachel: So, first of all, I want to thank you for having me. I'm excited to be here, and it sounds easy. How did I get here? If you asked me did I dream of being a CRO, I would say absolutely not. Having said that, I belong here. It's my dream job, actually, and it really is a place that I belong in terms of all my skills and also my professional interest.So, it all fits together at the end of the day. I think people have always said over the years that I belong in risk, and I think all the career moves that I made have really built a good background for me to be the CRO of an international organization. Kiran: All right. Thank you. And I mean, did you always know, or at what point in your life or in your career, did you realize you wanted to do something in risk? Rachel: It's a good question. Actually, I built a career in both finance and international development. And when you work in emerging markets, it's obviously about both the intersection of development, finance, and risk because to build something in emerging markets, you have to recognize both the opportunity and the risk. So, there are two sides to the coin, and I always worked on either side of that coin. And I think that's what made me a good fit on the risk side is that I did spend time on the development side as well.And I think to have the full picture doing both things added significant value. And I think had I grown up in either just risk or just in development, I wouldn't have had the ability to and the vision to make some of the decisions that I'm able to take today. Kiran: Thank you. And I mean, which decisions are you most proud of in your career journey?Rachel: That's a good question, too. So there are a couple of things along the way that I'm really proud of. And so when you work at an international organization, both at the intersection of development, finance, and in risk, it's a purpose-driven institution. So I believe that everything I do has an impact on the ground.And really, that's what I grew up with. Truly trying to find a career where I could truly make a difference and have an impact. And so, working in development, I've really been able to have an impact, and that's what I'm most proud of. So, for example, when I was doing deals on the business side, I was involved in a lot of firsts for our institution.For example, I help finance the largest wind farm in the region. At a time when actually using renewable energy was in its very early phases. Another example that I'm proud of is the expansion of the Panama Canal, where our institution played a fundamental role as a multilateral development bank, and we provided actually the largest of the loans to help make that a reality. So that's something I'm also extremely proud of.I'm also extremely proud of having built the team. The various teams along the way because when people ask, how did I arrive here? It's not really something I think about as something I've done on my own. It's about building teams and relationships. So when I was a portfolio manager, building that team, and now as CRO, I'm most proud of the work that our team does in making decisions and also having an impact. Kiran: Right, thank you. That's very insightful. I know you speak Spanish fluently, and I was just wondering how that skill or that part of your identity really intersects with your career and how it's helped you along. Rachel: I think being bilingual is essential, I think, for today's business world, and especially in the field of international development. And I think it's really been pivotal for me. And, when I was growing up, learning another language, making that a priority in my education and a priority in my early career, I think helped me achieve the things that I set out to achieve.And I didn't always know how I would incorporate the Spanish, but it was pivotal for me. I lived in Honduras, actually, when I was actually when I went to high school. In my freshman year of high school, I was an exchange student. And for me, that changed my life because not only did I have the opportunity to learn another language, but it also instilled in me the desire to work in development and really to have an impact, to do good, and to contribute.Kiran: Thank you. Yeah, I think it's very interesting. I mean, especially, I think it's so funny. I wish I could have done an exchange year at some point during high school, especially in a different country that speaks a different language. Rachel: It's not too late. It's not too late. Kiran: Yeah, for college, definitely.Thank you. And, I mean, just to pivot a little bit, I understand that finance is a very male-dominated field, and so, has there ever been a time where you were one of, if not the only woman in the room, and, if so, like, how did you navigate that type of situation and ensure that your voices, that your voice and perspectives were heard and respected?Rachel: I've often had the experience of being the only female in the room. When you do basic infrastructure, when you do finance, when you're focused also on Latin America, I was often the only female in the room. And sometimes, I would walk into a room, and I don't realize that I'm the only female in the room. I own my position. I use my voice and my vote in all circumstances. And so I think you just get more comfortable in your position, and making sure that you're heard is the most important thing. It doesn't mean you have to justify yourself or , you know, to make a point of it. But I think as long as you use your voice and you advocate for yourself, increasingly, people will create the space for you. And if they don't create the space for you, then you need to figure out how to create that space. And that comes with being prepared. And that was one of the things that I always made sure is that when I was the only female in the room I was prepared to use my voice. Kiran: Thank you. Yeah, and I understand sometimes it's a little bit more difficult to create your space. And so, have you ever had any sort of mentors who've been able to guide you through your career?Rachel: Yes. I think absolutely. I've been fortunate over the years. I've had a variety of bosses and colleagues who have been my mentors over the years. And what I've tried to do is extract from each of them something that I can learn from them. So, for example, an early boss could teach me how to sell something, how to be compelling, and how to be convincing of your view, and in a negotiation, that's extremely important.I've had other supervisors who were extremely technically qualified, so I took from them their technical skills and so I think being able to extract value and actually learn from those around you has been very important. Also, I've benefited from colleagues who have seen my potential and have included me in various opportunities over the years.So, for example, earlier in my career, when we were doing actually a merger, I was asked to be on the merge team and actually to try to put two organizations together. So somebody saw my potential and said, okay, Rachel, why don't you take this, try to lead this through? Another example was I actually created a risk department for our organization when it didn't have one. And so just because somebody saw, oh, I understood this area, I wasn't in risk, but I had been in a variety of areas of the institution, so when you asked me actually earlier, did I know I belonged in risk? How did I get here? Over the years, I had the opportunity to build on those things.So those are examples of where I had gotten opportunities from mentors in the past. Kiran: Thank you. Yeah, and I was just wondering if you've had any opportunities to mentor other people through their careers or anything like that. Rachel: Good question. I love to do that, actually, and as a supervisor, that's something that I do for my own team. So, my own team and people within and also outside the organization. And what I do is I give people who I work with, I try to give them homework in the sense that I try to give them tangible goals that they need to try to reach because I do think sometimes being a mentor is about helping people think about certain issues, but also to push them forward. To get them out of their comfort zone and to help themGrow, so I do a lot of mentoring: females and males, actually, my own team and also others. And so some of those examples are a particular female that I work with who was always preparing the bullet points and the talking points for her supervisor. And I said, what you need to do is find the conference where you become the speaker, where you sit on the panel, and what you need to do is ask to be invited to that panel and then ask if you can not only attend but to be the speaker.So, really, to push people to do things that they wouldn't have otherwise done. Kiran: Thank you. Yeah. I think that's a very important insight to make, especially sometimes. I guess tough love is the best way to go. I'm not saying that what you're doing is tough love, but you can't always coddle people, especially if you want them to grow into more experienced professionals or just better people overall. Rachel: Absolutely. Kiran: My next question is that it must be interesting to lead as a woman across different countries and cultures, and how has that experience been for you? What are some differences? Between the U. S. and maybe certain countries in Latin America?Rachel: That's a good question. I think being a listener is important, and understanding the needs and objectives of others is very important, and I think that that applies to making a decision now as CRO, but also in terms of finding solutions, because oftentimes, it isn't black and white, our decision making as CRO, and in the deals that we put together. So oftentimes, understanding how we can achieve a win-win is really important.So I find in different cultures people have different styles as individuals, but also you talk about, you know, how does somebody approach a negotiation. Sometimes, in our culture, it could be being very direct. And in other cultures, it isn't so direct. So that's why I think being a listener is important, but also trying to remember that to achieve a win-win, you have to generate ideas and alternatives that could work for both.Kiran: Thank you. Yeah, I think that's a very important observation to make, especially since you can't go into another culture believing that they have to follow your way of doing things, as opposed to really figuring out how to adapt to theirs. Rachel: It's a good point. I think absolutely. As Americans, we tend to be very direct and that can be actually good in business, but it can add to conflict.And I think that's really important. It's, I can say no, and I can say no as I smile, but I also think it's important if you have to say no to explain why you have to say no. And making sure that there's mutual understanding in how we make our decisions. Kiran: Right. Thank you. And, just looking back on your whole entire career, is there anything that you would have done differently?Rachel: That I would have done differently? Perhaps I wouldn't have actually worried so much. You know, I worry sometimes about the decisions I make because I know that the decisions I make affect others and have an impact, and I think it's really important, you know, so I think the decisions also truly weigh on me, but I would have owned it a little bit more.And I think being confident, and again, it goes back to making sure that the views that I take and the decisions that we make are well founded. And that's why both doing the analysis and making sure that the decisions you make are well founded and then you have to own them, you have to own them. Kiran: Thank you. And I mean, I think it's very important to point out that you really can't worry that much because, in hindsight, it's never as bad as you thought it was, would be, or anything like that. What's the best advice that you've ever received? Either in terms of your career or just your life, and how has it impacted you?Rachel: So the best advice I have ever received, and actually the advice that I give to all the mentees, is truly to be proactive and also to manage up and across. So, being proactive is really important. So, not just waiting until the work arrives at your desk, but making sure that you're always being proactive.Is there more that you can do? Is there more that you can contribute? And I also want to talk about managing up. Something in my career that I think I always did differently, and my advice at any level, is managing up: what does the senior manager need to know and do, and whether that means having the bullet points and the analysis prepared, having the recommendation all ready to go. And that's what I mean by managing up. It's always very important. But I also think managing across. So managing across people use, I think, information as a way to control the conversation. And for me, I need to make sure, and I always try to make sure that I use information and I share information because it makes us a better team, and so I think managing across is really important as well, and I think people who are the most successful people are people who are able to manage teams across an organization well. So I think for me, when I look at the risk team, it's not just us as a risk team, but it's a risk across our organization. And that's the advice that I would give people Truly about managing up and managing across and being proactive. I don't think there are enough people in the career space who will truly say, what else can I do?To make a difference. And I think that's what separates a lot of people, not just in my organization, but in career development, and people who grow in their careers are these people who really strive not only to do their job but to do their job and more than their job. And again, to make a difference.Kiran: Thank you. I think that's very important to point out, especially because you can't just do what's expected of you and then expect to kind of move forward or move up in your career when all you're doing is the bare minimum. I think it's very important to take note of. And, I mean, do you have any final advice for girls who are interested in pursuing your specific career or anything like that? Rachel: I do. You know, a career in finance and risk doesn't really just happen. Having said that, I do think careers in risk and finance, there are other skills besides the core technical skills of risk and finance that add enormous value.And I can give you some of those examples where Strong communication is really important. There are a lot of people with technical skills who can't take that technical analysis and drive it through to communicate the so what. The so what: what are your findings? What are your conclusions? So people can do the work, but they cannot bring it home.So, the strong analytical skills and the strong communication skills that you grow in high school and college are really relevant to careers and risk and finance. And again, when you see people who are leaders in those fields, they're not only technically sound, but they're able to communicate what they know, how they know it, and their decision-making.And so I would also emphasize that the skills that you need in risk and finance today are the traditional technical skills: math and science, but you also need the analytical, communication, and writing skills. And the writing skills. And those things are core competencies that will also add value to the full package of a girl and a woman in finance.And so for those girls and women who don't think they belong at the table because they don't necessarily think, okay, I have all of those hard technical skills. They need to realize that their analytical skills are really equally important. And so, for me, when I was early in my finance career, it was my analytical skills that brought me further along.I started with international development and then added on the MBA to continue to grow my technical skills. And my early career was analyzing transactions in Latin America from the financial, development, economic, and impact perspectives. And so I think that gone are the days when you can only see the field of finance.I think that the career track is truly merging a variety of skills, and to be the most successful in our field, you need to have all those skills. Kiran: Thank you. Yeah, I think it's very important to note that in order to succeed, you have to have an intersection of not only those hard skills but also the soft skills as well. Thank you so much for joining me today. I really enjoyed this conversation. You bring a really unique perspective, especially with your international experience and your overall journey. Rachel: I'm happy to be here. Kiran: Thank you so much for joining me on today's episode of Women Who Earn. I hope to see you next time. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit <a href="https://womenwhoearn.substack.com?utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=CTA_1">womenwhoearn.substack.com</a>

8 total episodes available

Deep-dive analytics for Women Who Earn Podcast

Frequently asked questions

Have a different question and can't find the answer you're looking for? Reach out to our support team by sending us an email and we'll get back to you as soon as we can.

What is Women Who Earn Podcast?: Interviews with prominent women in the finance industry. <a href="https://womenwhoearn.substack.com?utm_medium=podcast">womenwhoearn.substack.com</a>
How often does this podcast release new episodes?: This podcast updates inactive.
Where can I listen to this podcast?: This podcast is available on 7 platforms including Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and more. You can also use the RSS feed directly.
Does this podcast accept guests?: Yes, this podcast regularly features guests.

Legal Disclaimer

Pod Engine is not affiliated with, endorsed by, or officially connected with any of the podcasts displayed on this platform. We operate independently as a podcast discovery and analytics service.

All podcast artwork, thumbnails, and content displayed on this page are the property of their respective owners and are protected by applicable copyright laws. This includes, but is not limited to, podcast cover art, episode artwork, show descriptions, episode titles, transcripts, audio snippets, and any other content originating from the podcast creators or their licensors.

We display this content under fair use principles and/or implied license for the purpose of podcast discovery, information, and commentary. We make no claim of ownership over any podcast content, artwork, or related materials shown on this platform. All trademarks, service marks, and trade names are the property of their respective owners.

While we strive to ensure all content usage is properly authorized, if you are a rights holder and believe your content is being used inappropriately or without proper authorization, please contact us immediately at hey@podengine.ai for prompt review and appropriate action, which may include content removal or proper attribution.

By accessing and using this platform, you acknowledge and agree to respect all applicable copyright laws and intellectual property rights of content owners. Any unauthorized reproduction, distribution, or commercial use of the content displayed on this platform is strictly prohibited.