Welcome to Cloudlandia

About Welcome to Cloudlandia

Dean Jackson and Dan Sullivan think out loud about business, marketing, technology, and the ongoing move of the economy into "Cloudlandia", the digital-first world layered over the physical one. Long-form, unscripted conversations between two longtime collaborators.

Publisher

Dean Jackson and Dan Sullivan

Category

business

Language

en

Explicit

No

First episode

14 Oct 2020

Latest episode

15 Jul 2026

Latest episodes

172 episodes in the feed.

1. 

   15 Jul 2026

   The Outsiders Who Built Toronto

   How a handful of outsiders built modern Toronto, and why every name that comes up turns out to have something in common.

2. 

   1 Jul 2026

   Discovering Zero

   Why AI feels less like a new technology and more like the moment Europe discovered zero, when traders could do in seconds what took all afternoon.

3. 

   17 Jun 2026

   Ep176: Thirty Years of Vectors

   In this episode of Welcome to Cloudlandia, these two longtime collaborators trace how small decisions compound over decades to build momentum. In this episode of Welcome to Cloudlandia we open with Dan's annual London trip and a look at how AI is quietly transforming entire industries the way automation once reshaped farming, freeing up labor for higher-value work decade after decade. Dan connects this to his MELT framework, the idea that money, energy, labor, and transportation are where AI's real impact lands rather than entertainment. The conversation moves naturally from continents to careers, showing how economic shifts and personal turning points follow surprisingly similar patterns. Dean shares the experience of rereading 30 years of personal journals, starting from entry number one in April 1996, months before he ever met Dan. He describes "vector changes," the moments a single conversation redirected his career path, from tennis to real estate to building a multimillion-dollar coaching business with his mentor Joe Stump. Dan adds his own distinction between guessing and betting, pointing out how rarely people back their predictions with actual stakes, a useful filter for evaluating advice in any business. I was struck by how a journal that started with no plan became, thirty years later, documented proof of patterns worth studying. Listen for the moment Dean finally explains what a vector really is. SHOW HIGHLIGHTS Dan argues AI's real economic impact isn't entertainment, it's reshaping money, energy, labor, and transportation, his "MELT" framework. Dean started journaling in April 1996, and on page 22 of journal number one, met Dan Sullivan for the first time. Dan's test for any prediction: ask if there's real money on the table. Most people are confident guessers but unwilling bettors. Cyrus McCormick's mechanical reaper let one farmer and a horse do the work of 14 men, a preview of what AI may do today. Dean calls career-changing conversations "vector changes" single moments that redirected him from tennis to real estate to coaching. Dean's partnership with mentor Joe Stumpf took their combined coaching business from a few million dollars a year to many times that. Links: WelcomeToCloudlandia.com (https://welcometocloudlandia.com) StrategicCoach.com (http://strategiccoach.com/) DeanJackson.com (http://deanjackson.com/) ListingAgentLifestyle.com (https://ListingAgentLifestyle.com) TRANSCRIPT (AI transcript provided as supporting material and may contain errors) **Dean Jackson** Welcome to Cloudlandia. Mr. Sullivan. **Dan Sullivan** Mr. Jackson. **Dean Jackson** Back from **Dan Sullivan** London. **Dean Jackson** Across the pond, yes. How was your trip? **Dan Sullivan** We had a terrific time. Yeah, we were gone from Sunday of one week until Thursday of the next. **Dean Jackson** Wow. **Dan Sullivan** So pretty good. **Dean Jackson** What annual trip is this? Because I know you go every year in May. **Dan Sullivan** Probably 19, 19 years. **Dean Jackson** Wow. **Dan Sullivan** Yeah. **Dean Jackson** Look at that. Well, there you go. Is it as you remember? It's pretty interesting because London, like all the cities has gone through a lot of change over the 19 years for sure. **Dan Sullivan** Yeah, but it's got 2000 years of history. It's the one thing that you're reminded of when you go to London. It's been a very important city for 20 centuries. I mean from the beginning it's because of its location and on the river, the Thames. And the Thames is a tidal river so the tide changes twice a day. It goes one way and then it goes the other way and that saved a lot of manpower, saved a lot of probably- All right. Hurry **Dean Jackson** Up, get it on, get it on the train. **Dan Sullivan** Yeah. It's just interesting. It's funny about five years ago, Babson and I did one of those hereditary tests where you're **Dean Jackson** Just coming from- I know, the DNA **Dan Sullivan** Test. Yeah. 23 and Me was, there's a number of them, but 23andMe was the one that we used. And growing up in my family, I mean we're all immigrants being Americans and we were told that we were equal quarters German, French, English and Irish. **Dean Jackson** Wow. **Dan Sullivan** When the test came back, it was 55% from London. **Dean Jackson** Oh, wow. **Dan Sullivan** Yeah. Which could have been German, French, Irish and English. **Dean Jackson** Right, right, exactly. **Dan Sullivan** It basically said that the biggest influence was from London and I went there 62 years ago and first time that I ever went to London was November of 64 where I made my outward bound trip. So that was in Scotland, but I spent two or three weeks in London before I went north. And it was a really dirty city back then because they were still recovering even 20 years later they were still recovering from the war. There was vast sections of the city that had to be completely rebuilt and they hadn't gotten around to cleaning anything up. So Whitehall was Black Hall. Oh **Dean Jackson** Boy, yes. **Dan Sullivan** All the government buildings were really dark and dingy and you just had a sense that it was getting ready for the Beatles. Getting ready **Dean Jackson** For **Dan Sullivan** The **Dean Jackson** Beatles. That's **Dan Sullivan** Right. Yeah. And that sort of changed things culturally and a lot of other things. But I remember I just loved it when I got there and you could do ... I had one of those books. I think this is quite a bit before your time, but you could go to Europe on $5 a day. So they had Fromer, I **Dean Jackson** Think the- I remember seeing the books. Yeah. **Dan Sullivan** And it was London on $5 a day and you could get room and board and well, you could get a room plus breakfast. **Dean Jackson** I think that's how Rick Steve started kind of ... That was what inspired him I think was seeing those same kind of things because he created that Europe through the back door kind of approach. **Dan Sullivan** Yeah. And that just showed you the strength of the North American economy, which would be Canada and the US against the currency, what the pound was, in Europe, what the French Frank was because you could do Paris on $5 a day. You could do Rome on $5 a day and you actually could, you actually could. I probably allowed for $7 a day. I probably- **Dean Jackson** Living luxuriously. **Dan Sullivan** Yeah. **Dean Jackson** Give yourself a buffer. Right. **Dan Sullivan** Yeah. But you can do a lot of walking in London so you don't have to- **Dean Jackson** Oh, you know, Dan, I remember the first time that you and I were in London together **Dan Sullivan** And we walked to the- **Dean Jackson** Yeah, we walked all over the place. We found that beautiful old bookstore. Those were great. You imagine that was a highlight. **Dan Sullivan** And of course our hotel is our favorite hotel is right off Piccadilly Circus. So it's about **Dean Jackson** Four-minute walk. **Dan Sullivan** It's called Hamyard. **Dean Jackson** Oh, okay. Yep. **Dan Sullivan** And Hamyard was one of the worst sections of Soho. Soho was really kind of the ... It was sort of criminal. A lot of the criminal activity in London was out of Soho prostitution, drugs always nightlife. They always had a big nightlife, but part of the nightlife was stealing things overnight and everything else. And Hamyard was one of the worst. It was this old rundown, just a bunch of warehouses and badly kept up stores and badly kept up living quarters. And this couple, the Kemps, K-E-M-P, husband and wife team, they started about I think 30 years ago and they started to take over, first of all, just rooming houses like places where you would have a big house and it might have five or 10 apartments and they started with three or four of them and they completely refurbished them and made them into luxury starting out in the Kensington area, Mayfair, Kensington area. They did I **Dean Jackson** Think **Dan Sullivan** Three or four of them. And then they took over an old 19th century woman's hospital and they converted it into a hotel coven garden and then Charlotte Street, then Soho and then Haymarket and they have five major hotels and they're building new one out. They're building a new one out in the Canary Wharf area. And they have a new one going up. They have three of them in New York. So they have nine major hotels now, but the hamyard is the jewel in the crown for them. So spectacular and they put in, they have the hotel but then the whole part of it is also condos and they- **Dean Jackson** Oh, nice. That's like- They created **Dan Sullivan** All ... **Dean Jackson** I think all the ... That's the model I think that they have **Dan Sullivan** To do in **Dean Jackson** Order to pay for that. Almost all **Dan Sullivan** Hotels, **Dean Jackson** Real estate. Yeah. **Dan Sullivan** Yeah. But if we were to ever have a place in London, I think we'd look into what's available there for a condo because it's a nine minute walk to Waterstone's, my favorite cookstore in **Dean Jackson** The world. Oh yeah. There you go. I really love the ... I don't know whether you've been to the Four Seasons at Trinity Square. No, **Dan Sullivan** Haven't been there **Dean Jackson** Yet. So, so nice. Love it. Right at Tower Bridge. **Dan Sullivan** And they're in a state of total political confusion right now. **Dean Jackson** That's what I hear. Yeah. **Dan Sullivan** Oh yeah. I mean, it's kind of dismal actually reading. We get the telegraph at our ... When we get up in the morning, the telegraph is up to our door and we go to breakfast and read it. They're between two stools right now. It's really question. I think both of the traditional parties are actually going out of existence. There's a new party called the Reform Party and local elections, which are called council elections. It's a parliamentary government so it doesn't really translate into American terminology, **Dean Jackson** But **Dan Sullivan** They're all local areas and their elections don't happen at the same time as the national elections do, but it was just a wipe out. Labor just got totally wiped out and they're asking the prime minister to resign. His own party is asking him to resign so they can get a newly leader and everything else. But it's really pathetic and they're just one of those periods. I mean, Britain's 2000 ... It's an old country and they've had ups and downs, but I would say they're in a down right now. **Dean Jackson** Are they going woke type? **Dan Sullivan** Yeah. Yeah. **Dean Jackson** Yeah. **Dan Sullivan** It's labor and labor is left and left is woke. But they've opened the borders so they have The ... I mean, the US, when Trump came in, it just stopped. I mean, there's been nothing. There's been nothing for almost a year and a half now, which showed that they could do it. They said, "Well, it's almost impossible to close the border." I said, "Well, if you have a commitment to just enforce the laws that are actually in place, it's quite easy." Yeah, right. It's actually quite easy. You don't need new laws. You just apply the laws that they're ... And of course, there's a lot of anti-Trumpism as part of the ... Yeah, he has an unusual ability to get people to hate him. **Dean Jackson** Oh yeah, for sure. How's the New York experiment going with Mundani? Well, he **Dan Sullivan** Hasn't quite run out of other people's money yet, but it'll happen within about three or four months. There's just no money. I mean, the economy of New York City is about the same as the economy of Canada. **Dean Jackson** That's funny. Same as California, right? I think California is maybe eclipses Canada even. **Dan Sullivan** No, California is equal to France. California, it's big. I mean, the population of California and Canada is about the same. It's about 40 million and everything like that. But yeah, I think that the savior for certainly in the United States, I think in Canada is going to be AI. If you just apply AI to everything that already exists in the economy, you're just going to get gains in efficiency and productivity. **Dean Jackson** I heard someone the other day, I was watching a video and they were describing how AI is really, if we just replace AI as a concept with technology doing a portion of this- Technological **Dan Sullivan** Improvement. Technological **Dean Jackson** Improvement. Yeah. So there's 10 steps in doing something and they were likening it to the way agriculture worked, that the farmer was responsible for thinking what to plant and knowing when to plant it. And where to plant **Dan Sullivan** And where **Dean Jackson** To- Yeah, where to plant it. And then below the surface, the technology that they were using was soil and soil did its magic, whatever it did over months and months of doing. And then at the end, the farmer knew when to harvest and how to harvest and prepare it for market. But eight out of the 10 steps or whatever were done by technology and I think that's a really good way of thinking about soil couldn't do it on its own. It required flowers. **Dan Sullivan** Yeah. Well, you had the great example of going back in your history and I really enjoyed your podcast where you talked about going back to 1976, 1986, 2000. I really appreciated that. Yeah. That's **Dean Jackson** Great. You were **Dan Sullivan** Very articulate, very, very- Oh, **Dean Jackson** Thanks, Dan. I mean, that's- **Dan Sullivan** Very wise and articulate.You were made for the medium, I can tell you that. **Dean Jackson** Made for media. That's great. No, for that media. For that media. **Dan Sullivan** You're made for it, yeah. But the big thing, you had the Cyrus McCormick example that you used. And he with one farmer, one Reaper, one McCormick Reaper and a horse- Could do **Dean Jackson** The work of 14 men. **Dan Sullivan** Yeah, 14. Yeah. And in 1900, 50% of the US workforce was involved with agriculture, food production, and now it's 3%, now it's 3% and vastly- **Dean Jackson** 90% of the world, **Dan Sullivan** Right? Yeah, vastly more. Yeah. And I think that's a really great example of what happened to agriculture. I mean, we have the big coach, the big farmers are from Saskatchewan, they don't even use the word acre. They use sections. I think a section is 2,000 acres. You have 10 sections or you have 20 sections, but it's all automated. I mean, it's not humans doing that. Automated tractors are doing the plowing and the harvesting and everything like that. They're not doing it. I think it's really probably if you look at any part of the economy where automation has had the greatest impact, it would be agriculture. **Dean Jackson** Yeah, I bet. **Dan Sullivan** Because food is so important. Well, **Dean Jackson** And it's physical. I mean, there's no way to digitize it, right? That's the funny thing. **Dan Sullivan** Yeah. **Dean Jackson** But those- **Dan Sullivan** I mean, it's not a topic that the mainstream media want to cover because it's good news and they're not into good news, but in every sector of the industrial economy, whether it's manufacturing, whether it's agriculture, whether it's logistics, you're just seeing massive applications of AI to everything, every aspect of it. And you're starting to see the results already. I think the results are starting to come ... I mean, that's where people are really using that. The other part of AI is sort of entertainment. It's **Dean Jackson** Sort **Dan Sullivan** Of entertainment, but that's not where the real productive impact is happening. I think it's happening in money, how money as an industry, which is ... I mean, it's really the major industry is how you can get money as fast as possible, as cheaply as possible to the people who are going to use it to create something more productive. And then you have energy, which is at the very center and it's being used there and labor, just making labor more productive. And then transportation, those are the melt, that's my melt concept. **Dean Jackson** Right. Yeah. You were mentioning the video that I put up yesterday that I've decided that because over the last ... I think I mentioned to you, we've both had birthdays since last time we spoke. I turned 60, you turned 82. **Dan Sullivan** Yeah, you caught up a little bit for about nine days, nine days and nine, 10 days, and then I noticed you over my shoulder and I stretched out another year. **Dean Jackson** Right, that's right. Better get on it. That's right. **Dan Sullivan** But **Dean Jackson** In looking back, I think I shared with you, I was over the kind of month leading up to my birthday, I started looking, just taking little random samples from all my ... I have hundreds of journals. I started in April of 1996, like officially journaling and I started looking back and there's some really great insights and things that it was really fascinating to look back and see and I started thinking about just reflecting on some of that and then I went all the way back to journal number one and I realized that I think that the best way to do this is to go back to journal number one and watch the story unfold with wisdom of having 30 years of knowing how it ends. It's really interesting, Dan, because in April when I started the journal, I did not know who Dan Sullivan was, but on page 22 of journal number one- **Dan Sullivan** How did you even breathe? **Dean Jackson** Exactly. But on page 22 of journal number one was the day I went to meet with Alan Kerns at the strategic coach offices and he was in a workshop and we were going to have dinner after the workshop. I just think it's interesting if I look at the ... You would certainly be on my Mount Rushmore of most influential people over the 30 years and that you showed up on page 22. So that was in the spring and I had my first strategic coach workshop in the fall of that year. It's amazing to see the through lines. Yeah. **Dan Sullivan** Well, I think that really interesting part of what you ... It came through, Babs showed it to me last night and so we played it, you were getting near bedtime and we played the whole thing. And the most interesting thing was the question that your Finnish buddy, Swedish. **Dean Jackson** Yeah, **Dan Sullivan** Swedish. Swedish buddy asked, he said," I'm the 180th ranked tennis player and he says, I'm nothing really. **Dean Jackson** "I'm living hand to mouth, yep. **Dan Sullivan** But if I'm the 180th best businessman in the world, I'm a billionaire. I mean- **Dean Jackson** Really? That was his question. If you **Dan Sullivan** Went back and looked at it, he might not be a billionaire because we didn't have the number of billionaires at that time that we do today. The IPO, you know that Elon Musk's IPO is coming up for SpaceX and they think this is going to make him a trillionaire that cross over the trillionaire. So that's a big deal. That is **Dean Jackson** A big deal. And the thing, the fact is in 1996 he hadn't really done anything yet. **Dan Sullivan** Oh no. He was working at a car wash in North Toronto. **Dean Jackson** Yeah. I wonder when did PayPal first happen? Yeah. **Dan Sullivan** Yeah. I don't know. My technological history is getting cloudy as I look back. It's in the midst of time now some of those breakthroughs. But anyway, yeah we're in a big period. We're in a big period right now. Anyway, but it's interesting to do that. I'm on day number 172 of my new time system and one of the crucial things, we're writing the next book which is called Yesterday's Create Tomorrow. So it's not yesterday, but it's yesterday's because it's the accumulation of great yesterday. **Dean Jackson** Yesterday's Create Tomorrow. That's **Dan Sullivan** Really good. And anyway, but the big thing was to get the graphic on it and so Hamish McDonald, my cartoonist and I have been working on this and I said," I got to get a good graphic. "And it's really interesting we had a session on Friday, two days ago and I said," You know something, tomorrow doesn't actually exist. **Dean Jackson** "Right. I was just saying that today, like looking back, the video that I shot, I was actually at the table where I would go to journal in that time at the Eagle Ridge Mall and I realized I said to my friend Josh this morning that you realize even over 30 years there's only ever been today. I mean at that time- And yesterday. Well, exactly. Yeah, right, exactly. But I mean- **Dan Sullivan** I mean your journaling is basically a record of **Dean Jackson** Yesterday. Yesterday, yes. **Dan Sullivan** So you have the experience of yesterday, but you only have the opportunity of today basically. I mean, you can take action today. I've got three or four things on my schedule for today, but I've never actually had any experience of tomorrow. **Dean Jackson** Right, that's exactly right. **Dan Sullivan** Everybody is obsessed about tomorrow, like I said, you're obsessed about something that doesn't exist. **Dean Jackson** Talk **Dan Sullivan** A little bit about journaling because I've been a great journalist. I turned my life around with journaling to talk to you about what it does for you. **Dean Jackson** I think that a journal is a great place to think about your thinking and to have these is where I work things out and hatch my evil schemes, but I look at the most impactful things are when I'm thinking about my thinking and there's a lot of patterns and things that I would do like I used to in and it's great I'm excited about starting at journal number one and going forward and recording insights because I get to see there it is, that's the genesis of this and the book that I was reading became this thought, which became this ad, which became this empire, right? I look at the things like when I look at this journal number one from a context of only looking- **Dan Sullivan** 96, right? 1996 **Dean Jackson** April of 1996, **Dan Sullivan** Yes. **Dean Jackson** And so I look at all the things that had not ... I hadn't met Dan Sullivan yet at that stage, right? But it was months away from my first strategic coach workshop. So I'm going to be very interested to see- **Dan Sullivan** Who was your first coach? **Dean Jackson** Gary Motterset. **Dan Sullivan** Again, Gary- Who's still a coach, who's **Dean Jackson** Still a coach. Yeah, exactly. And still coaches the 10 times and is in the Free Zone group. Yeah, he's in Free Zone in Toronto. So when I come up for Free Zone, I'll go to the 10 Times workshop the day after, which Gary is workshop. Yeah. So the first time when you started doing Free Zone in Toronto and we started going there, Gary and I, we were mentioning we had a real full circle moment there because I think that might have been his first year of coaching somewhere around there, but you look at the through lines of it and I think that I see on reflection the importance of the betting portion of guessing and betting because there's a lot of guessing and a lot of correct guessing that I can see that I have done, but if I New then what I know now, there are places where you could go all in on that bet and have a different outcome. **Dan Sullivan** Yeah. It's really interesting just as a sidelight here. Whenever I get involved these days it's mainly political as political discussions and somebody says, "Well, this is what's going to happen now." And I says, "Now, this is what's going to happen now. This is what you're saying, right? Yeah, this is what's going to happen. Is this a guess or is it a bet? I can hear the guess. Is there a bet here? Okay. Because if I was to say $10,000 that you're wrong, would you be up to the bet? **Dean Jackson** Right. **Dan Sullivan** And very **Dean Jackson** Few **Dan Sullivan** People are up to the bet. **Dean Jackson** People **Dan Sullivan** Are very confident about the guests, not so confident about the bet. Yeah, **Dean Jackson** I think you're right. **Dan Sullivan** So it's a good way whenever people are predicting the future, they're saying, "It's going to happen, this is going to happen." I said, "That sounds like a guess, but is there money on the table here? Are we talking about money?" And very seldom is there money on the table **Dean Jackson** Or going or going all in. I'm excited to go on this journey because I think it's going to be very ... I'm going to get a lot of insight out of going through and seeing what the next 30 years looks like realizing that ... Well, first of all, at that stage, I didn't even have a sense of what 30 years means. That was my whole life. I was 29. I was longer than I had been alive in April of 2016. Well, the **Dan Sullivan** Other thing is the first five or six years are a bit hazy. **Dean Jackson** Yeah, right. **Dan Sullivan** No, I mean, I **Dean Jackson** Started **Dan Sullivan** Thinking about my thinking when I was eight years old. **Dean Jackson** Oh yeah, right. That's what I mean. You're exactly right. Yeah. **Dan Sullivan** In other words, I can remember I said at six years old, at six years old, I wasn't conscious, but at eight years old, I just wrote a piece called Metacognition. You know what metacognition is? I don't know if you've heard the term. It's actually thinking about your thinking. That's basically Latin. If you want to make it official, translate it into Latin, but it's basically ... But it's just thinking about your thinking and basically that's what coach is. It's a whole bunch of little mazes that we put you through in the course of going through the maze and getting through the maze, you thought about your thinking. But I think this is really an excellent ... It's really wealth that you have here. If you think about you have 30 years of records of you thinking about your thinking. That's **Dean Jackson** Exactly it. **Dan Sullivan** That's real wealth. **Dean Jackson** Yes. **Dan Sullivan** Very few people have that. **Dean Jackson** Yeah. Wisdom. I mean, I think that's part of the thing, right? I often wondered about that. What is the official evidence, but evidence of wisdom, is that ... **Dan Sullivan** Yeah. You actually have evidence that you say ... Well, I was thinking about this 30 years ago, and I said, "Show me the evidence that you were thinking **Dean Jackson** About. " Right. Oh, exactly. Yeah, there you go. I think that is absolutely true. I can't wait till nine word email makes its first appearance. And the day I discover Homer McDonald in USA Today over breakfast and have the idea that stops your divorce might be a great thing. And I think about that, that hadn't happened yet. Money making websites hadn't happened, none of it. You **Dan Sullivan** Introduced an interesting word into your podcast last night and that was vector. You have **Dean Jackson** These vectors. Vector changing. Yes. **Dan Sullivan** Vector changing. It's interesting as you go through where the nine word email is a vector. It's a vector. Yeah. Can you tell our listening audience here what a vector is? **Dean Jackson** Well, I think that the vector is like the trajectory- I think of a **Dan Sullivan** Straight line. I **Dean Jackson** Always think of **Dan Sullivan** A vector being a straight line. **Dean Jackson** Okay. Going in a new **Dan Sullivan** Direction. Going **Dean Jackson** In a **Dan Sullivan** New direction. **Dean Jackson** Right. And I think that's exactly it up until in 1986 I was on the path of pursuing tennis and in one conversation with one person on one night, a completely new thought entered my head in a way that really I said it in the video resonated with my soul. I really got this that to me was the immediate unlock and that was in the spring and by the fall I started my real estate career in the fall of 1988. So that was a complete vector changer and that I went on that for eight years pursuing my real estate career in Toronto until I met Joe Stump and Joe Stump provided as a relationship the opportunity to have a different vector change of not growing a real estate business in Toronto but taking the things that I was doing and using them to help grow thousands of real estate businesses all over North America. **Dan Sullivan** Any market. **Dean Jackson** Yeah. So that was the vector change out of my real estate straight line to what was a 13 year path of growing a real estate coaching business. And I learned so much in that, by the way, Joe Stump would be right beside you there on my Mount Rushmore over the 30 years. He's the reason that I started journaling in earnest as a serious thing. **Dan Sullivan** How old would he become? **Dean Jackson** He's 10 years older than me. So he just turned 70. Yeah. **Dan Sullivan** Yeah. All these young people I'm surrounded by. **Dean Jackson** Right, exactly. These youngsters. But that was an amazing thing. I look at Joe Stump as a, what is that term in space where you can just like skip 10 years ahead. Like he had 10 years ahead of building a ... Because all the time I was building my real estate business, he was building his speaking and event business and to be able to hop on that as a vehicle that was already 10 years in the thing and we together were able to take that from three or four million a year to a year. So it's really giddy with excitement of being able to relive these with the gift of knowing how the story ends. T me, when I was talking about all these things that didn't even exist then, like JK Rowling had not yet released the first Harry Potter book. JK Rowling, while I was journaling here, JK Rowling was sitting in a cafe in Edinburgh writing Harry Potter on notebooks and now look what that ended up becoming. I mean, it's pretty ... **Dan Sullivan** Yeah, it's interesting. One thing about London, there's lots of theaters, but a lot of theaters are never available because they have lawn running shows. For example, the theater that has Le Mezerob, it's 40 years now that is 40 years. **Dean Jackson** Lemez has been running for 40 years. 40 **Dan Sullivan** Years. Yeah. It's right around **Dean Jackson** The corner **Dan Sullivan** From our hotel. It's two minute walk to La Mez and it's 40 years and there's Banham of the Opera is still going. It's like 36, 35, 36 years. So there's these theaters and you say, "Well, there's lots of theaters, but they're not actually available. They're actually..." But there's one right at the intersection of Charing Cross and Shopsbury, two huge avenues in London and they have a cross, they cross and there's a palace theater there and it's got another story that she wrote about Harry Potter when Harry Potter is 40 years old and he's a civil servant. **Dean Jackson** Wow. **Dan Sullivan** We went to see it and it's in two sections. So in an evening you would go for the first two hours, then you'd take a break and then you take another two hours and it's been going for five, six years now and it's not very good. I mean, it's got all the technology that they can pull off now with wires and people flying and everything like that, but it's not very good, but it's Harry Potter. She put a stamp on the world if you use it. And I think in Orlando do they have a Harry Potter? Like is there a whole Harry **Dean Jackson** Potter? Yeah, that Universal has a whole Universal. **Dan Sullivan** Yeah. And it'll go forever. I mean, it'll go forever. Potter world. And the reason is because the books are actually fun. I mean, I read all the books, I saw all the movies and everything **Dean Jackson** Else. I bought Dan and I have a box set of the Harry Potter books because I was in a cafe at Barnes & Noble in Lakeland and I saw it was the first time that JK Rowling had passed a billion dollars. She was like the first self-made UK billionaire aside from the queen or whatever. And I thought it was funny because as I was sitting there reading that article and I'd seen other things from her and I realized that she hand writes these books in notebooks and I saw an end cap display with the box set of all of the Harry Potter books and I had an immediate like visual anchor of that's what a billion dollars looks like is right there. That collection, that is evidence of a billion dollars that made its way from her brain down to her fingers- **Dan Sullivan** Notebook. **Dean Jackson** ... out to a notebook and into these books and turned into a billion dollars and it's just such a ... Yeah, it's amazing. **Dan Sullivan** Kind of tells you how the world is actually created. **Dean Jackson** Well, at first it starts with a thought, right? I mean, everything ... First, I imagine that Jeff Bezos had ... There's probably a Genesis thought that Jeff Bezos had. **Dan Sullivan** Have you seen any of the videos of him explaining how you've become a billionaire? **Dean Jackson** No, I have not. **Dan Sullivan** Because AOC, who's a candidate for possibly ... Said, "It's not possible to earn a billion dollars." She said, "You can only do it through illegal means." Okay. And he says, "Well, let's take that thought apart." He says, "You got a hamburger place. You create really great hamburgers and then you're doing really well with the first one and then you do the second one and that works. And then the third one works. And then number 100 really works as even better than number one." He says, "After a while, you got a billion dollars." **Dean Jackson** Right. That's exactly- And you earned it. **Dan Sullivan** And you earned it. Yeah. **Dean Jackson** I just remember where ASC- But **Dan Sullivan** I love her. I hope she's the candidate. Yeah. I mean, Kamala might be the candidate and I would be totally for it. AOC, I really want her. **Dean Jackson** Oh yeah, just for the blooper reel. I mean, my favorite ever, Dan, was when her elation that New York City, that Amazon was not- Turned **Dan Sullivan** Down Amazon. **Dean Jackson** Yeah. And now those billions in tax credits can go to teachers and stuff without realizing **Dan Sullivan** That's not- But I really want her out there. I really want her out there and full bloom and at 50, she'll still sound like a 15 year old. You know what I mean? That's my prediction. I don't think she'll ever make it to Senator. I don't think she'll ever make it to Senator. I think she'll be the new Maxine Waters. You know Maxine Waters? **Dean Jackson** Yep. Congress for Life. **Dan Sullivan** Right. A Congressman for Life and very compelling, very emotionally directed and just completely run. And it's almost like you just want to see her going for the next 50 or 60 years attractive, compelling, completely wrong. **Dean Jackson** It's almost like my thing was just thinking, "Oh, bless your heart. **Dan Sullivan** Bless your heart." Yeah. I mean, I just want you to always be part of our life. **Dean Jackson** Exactly. Those billions of dollars can go to teachers and service police and public **Dan Sullivan** Services. Yeah. You're an American landmark. **Dean Jackson** I love it. It's all in the inflection, Dan. It sounds flattering. **Dan Sullivan** Entertainment can come in all forms. **Dean Jackson** Yes, you're exactly right. **Dan Sullivan** Speaking of which, we went to see a musical and this is on my birthday on the 19th of May if anyone's interested in sending me presence in the future is the 19th of May. **Dean Jackson** Or retroactively. I mean, yeah. **Dan Sullivan** Yeah. We saw High Society, which is a Cold Porter musical from ... **Dean Jackson** Yeah. **Dan Sullivan** And it was the most spectacular musical I think I've ever seen in my life because what they did, what they realized was that first of all, it's about rich people and they changed it from Philadelphia. It was originally based on a novel called the Philadelphia Story, which was about upper class wealthy society in Philadelphia at a certain point, but they switched it to Newport, Rhode Island, where **Dean Jackson** They have- Have you ever been to Newport? Oh **Dan Sullivan** Yeah. Yeah. **Dean Jackson** Yeah. **Dan Sullivan** Where the cottages have 60 rooms, palaces. **Dean Jackson** Yes. **Dan Sullivan** But anyway, what they did is they reworked the story so that it's up to date, you feel it's up to date. But the other thing is that they included a lot more of Cool Porter. The Cool Porter is the composer of all the music and the lyricist of all the music and they brought it up and they just have amazing talent. They threw amazing talent at it. They had like 28 people in the cast, full orchestra, clever scenery and everything else and not cynical at all, just completely straightforward about wealthy people dealing with their lives. And it was just so refreshing, but there's a particular singer and he's about 50 now. His name is Julian Ovenden. He's the most spectacular singer and it's sort of a throwback kind of singing. He sings out of the 1940s, 1950s. He just has this great sense. Do you know the tradition that they have in London called the Proms and the Last Night of the Proms? No, it happens at the Royal Albert Hall, which is right at Q Gardens. It's in Q Gardens and the Royal Albert Hall is just this big massive concert hall, but in October, I think it happens in October, they have the last night at the proms, promenades, promenade. And just go to YouTube and look up the last night of the proms, Julian Ovenden, O-V-E-N-D-E-N, **Dean Jackson** O-V-E-N-D-E-N. **Dan Sullivan** And the specific show was Rogers and Hammerstein. So they did the musical music of Rogers and Hammerstein, Carousel, Oklahoma, South Pacific, King and I, Sound of Music, they created all this. He's just a spectacular singer and he's in the cast, but there's about five or six other singers and it was just a magical evening because it takes a real gift to take ... They're going through the dialogue and at a certain point you have this movement from a dialogue into a song and the bridges between ... It's like they'll have a concept to say something and then what they're saying in the sentence becomes the first, you know, it becomes the beginning of a song and then they sing it and it's just flawless. It's just one of the most remarkable evenings I've ever spent. **Dean Jackson** Wow. **Dan Sullivan** Yeah. **Dean Jackson** Amazing. Okay. **Dan Sullivan** Yeah. It's called High Society, the term. I mean, it was done, but what they did is that they added six more songs, which Cole Porter wrote for other shows, but they built them into this show and the dancing was fantastic, everything, just terrific talent. **Dean Jackson** Yeah. That's amazing too, right? Like you think about these theaters, like the durability of things when you think like you were mentioning how Le Miz has been playing for 40 years in the same theater. **Dan Sullivan** And I **Dean Jackson** Think it **Dan Sullivan** Started there. I think it started there. I mean, it's too French. **Dean Jackson** Yeah. **Dan Sullivan** The people who created the show, it might have started in Paris, but it became really big in London. I **Dean Jackson** Remember in the 80s when Garth Drabinsky was bringing the Phantom of the Opera and Cats, that had a long run in Toronto. **Dan Sullivan** Yeah. And then he created a show called Showboat. He took a movie that was called Showboat and he turned it into a musical and it was at the Ford Theater, which is way up in North York. I mean, in Toronto, that section of Toronto, which I always think you have to get shots to go there, you have to take oxygen with you. **Dean Jackson** We must see your papers, all your papers in order. **Dan Sullivan** Can I see your passport, please? Right, exactly. And then he took over that big theater in New York and he completely revamped it. His whole notion was in every big city in North America he was going to have a theater and then he was going to create new place and he would just run them through from theater to ... It was a great ... I mean, Garth Rabinski, if he had been better at his bookkeeping, it would have been **Dean Jackson** A **Dan Sullivan** Major ... **Dean Jackson** The Pantages Theater, right? **Dan Sullivan** Yeah. Oh yeah. **Dean Jackson** Yeah. **Dan Sullivan** I mean, yeah, he completely revamped the whole ... That was the Winter Garden and the Elgin. I was just driving down Yun Street yesterday and there they were the two theaters and they discovered this whole Vaudeville theater that was above another theater and they completely refurbished it and everything like that. He was a great ... I'm sorry that he got into trouble. He should have just- **Dean Jackson** I just have a vague recollection that he did, but I don't know. I don't know **Dan Sullivan** Why. Yeah, he was a little sloppy in his bookkeeping and he ended up getting into trouble. You should do a better job. If you're going to be great, make sure your bookkeeping supports it. **Dean Jackson** What's up with Jeff Madoffs? **Dan Sullivan** Well, still then they think they're going for Broadway now, but they've changed their strategy that they need a real star. They got to drive it with a star and they have three or four names who I don't recognize, but it'd be like someone like Drake or someone like that. **Dean Jackson** Oh, really? Wow. Okay. **Dan Sullivan** Yeah. I'm not saying they know that. I'm not saying that's who it is. I'm just using it as an example or Usher. My acquaintance with modern pop music starts ends at around 1975. **Dean Jackson** Oh, that's funny. **Dan Sullivan** When you were nine. **Dean Jackson** When I was nine, what was it? Disco Duck, Dan? Is that when that was? Disco Duck. **Dan Sullivan** Talking Heads. I think Talking Heads was the ... **Dean Jackson** Yeah. **Dan Sullivan** My last acquaintance. I still think he's one of the most talented people. **Dean Jackson** I just saw an interview with him. He's got new music coming out now. That's funny, but he seems very thoughtful. **Dan Sullivan** Yeah. I mean, he's a real creative guy. He's a bit like Paul Simon. Paul Simon really, he had about a good 40, 50 years of pretty new stuff. Yeah. Yeah. **Dean Jackson** Awesome. **Dan Sullivan** Yeah. Well, we've covered a lot of ... I think you got to bring back Cyrus McCormick because Cyrus **Dean Jackson** McCormick- Oh, Cyrus will show up. Yeah. **Dan Sullivan** Because Cyrus really tells you what happens with technology, I think probably more than any other person and the talk, all the talk about AI getting rid of jobs and everything. Well, he got rid of all sorts of jobs and exploded the US economy because the 14 people that he freed up from agriculture were able to go off and do other things. **Dean Jackson** That's amazing. Well, I realize I will see you next- **Dan Sullivan** I'll actually see you in person. **Dean Jackson** Yes, exactly. I am super excited about sharing at CoachCon. **Dan Sullivan** Yeah. Yeah. **Dean Jackson** So that's going to be a fun breakout. **Dan Sullivan** Kathy Davis has a good spotlight for you. **Dean Jackson** Oh, that's great. I'm very excited. **Dan Sullivan** Yeah. **Dean Jackson** Yeah, I'm very excited. All right. Well, when do you arrive? **Dan Sullivan** I don't know the answer to that question. **Dean Jackson** Of course you don't, nor should you, Dan. It's not today. It's not today. It's not today. **Dan Sullivan** When **Dean Jackson** The time arrives, that'll be a good yesterday. I mean- **Dan Sullivan** When I get there, it'll be today. **Dean Jackson** That's exactly right. And I'll be there right beside you. Perfect. **Dan Sullivan** Okay. Thank you. **Dean Jackson** Okay, Dan. We'll see you. Bye. **Dan Sullivan** Okay, bye.

Reach and audience

Public platform figures. Ratings count people who left a rating, not total listeners.

Apple Podcasts (US)

4.3 / 5

10 ratings

Podcast Authority Score: 58 / 100

A composite of feed quality, social presence, YouTube performance and engagement. Read the methodology.

Quality

85

Social presence

0

YouTube

0

Engagement

77

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